PDA

View Full Version : A Clockwork Orange?


Soma Holiday
02-03-08, 20:13
I've heard so much about this movie so I finally watched it last night...and I really didn't see the greatness. I don't know. I understood the concepts pretty good, but the movie was pretty offensive and not that entertaining to be honest.

I know alot of people admire Kubrick, but I really don't see what's so great about him. Maybe if I'd grown up around the time he was directing, since it was pretty revolutionary, I would like him more. I mean I think he's good, but not in the sense that most people do.

Can anyone tell me why Clockwork is so great?

TombRaiderLover
02-03-08, 20:22
I love this film.

But it wasn't always that way. When I first saw the film on television, I wasn't too impressed. I found the performances to be campy and over-the-top, because I expected the film to have a much more dark and serious tone.

But even though I convinced myself the film was awful, it was stuck in my head. Still puzzled at why the film was considered one of the greatest ever, I watched the film again . . . and again . . . and again . . . and realised I was falling in love with the film.

A Clockwork Orange is a well-paced, well-plotted and well-performanced masterpiece. With each viewing, McDowell's portrayal of delinquent Alex DeLarge becomes even more entertaining and empathetic. The other actors surrounding him are wonderfully quirky - I've come to realise the performances are supposed to be surreal. That's the point. I also loved Kubrick's style of directing - the touches of black humour, the use of music, and the marvellous visuals.

Now I have the film on DVD, and I'm planning on up-grading to the 2-disc special edition (which is released tomorrow in the UK.)

Ward Dragon
02-03-08, 20:29
I don't see what's so great about this film either. The concept is interesting, but I really couldn't get into the movie because I hate the main characters.

Soma Holiday
02-03-08, 20:32
I don't see what's so great about this film either. The concept is interesting, but I really couldn't get into the movie because I hate the main characters.

That's how I felt! I watch There Will Be Blood, who's main character is also insane, and I LOVE him. But I really hated Alex. He was just a little too over the edge to me, and it became offensive...more than likely because almost every single women in the film was either raped or naked at some point. I realize that we are supposed to see them as he did, as sex objects, but I still think it was a little far...this made me hate Alex more and more. He's the villian, and he wins in the end. It kind of made me angry to be honest.

digitizedboy
02-03-08, 20:38
Malcolm mcdowell is awesome in this. And who can not like this movie, one of Kubrick's best. it outshone the shining. lol.

TombRaiderLover
02-03-08, 20:46
That's how I felt! I watch There Will Be Blood, who's main character is also insane, and I LOVE him. But I really hated Alex. He was just a little too over the edge to me, and it became offensive...more than likely because almost every single women in the film was either raped or naked at some point. I realize that we are supposed to see them as he did, as sex objects, but I still think it was a little far...this made me hate Alex more and more. He's the villian, and he wins in the end. It kind of made me angry to be honest.

Kubrick's point was to make us empathise with Alex, even though he was something of an anti-hero, if not a villain. We saw things from his eyes, were introduced into his world, and were made to even feel sorry for him when he was being reformed by the Ludovico Technique.

And for me, it worked. I never hated Alex. He was very amusing, clown-like, and entertaining. If it hadn't been for McDowell's brilliant performance, I don't think I would've found him so watchable and fascinating. ;)

When I first watched the movie, I was not at all keen on the over-used nudity either. Now that I'm going through adolescene, it's not too bad at all. :p

Thorir
02-03-08, 21:07
I found it quite boring. Nothing special about it.

McDowell was really great, but everything else... Boring!

Vertigo
02-03-08, 21:48
I haven`t seen it yet.
But I liked the book!

spikejones
02-03-08, 22:03
I thought that was just the name of a song. Never heard of the movie, must not be that good then.

Encore
02-03-08, 22:06
One of my favorite movies... Completely insane but paradoxically it has a very well defined message and structure... However it's mostly the visuals that attracted me in the first place: the set decoration, art, production design, cinematography etc. Everything visual about this movie is absolutely amazing, even more when coupled with the extraordinary soundtrack. One of my favorite scenes is the one by the water, in slow motion with Rossini's music. :D

Oh and I do love Alex! In fact he's one of my all time fav movie characters. I guess that makes me a sick person :p

Kubrick is God. :o

Edit:
I thought that was just the name of a song. Never heard of the movie, must not be that good then.

Oh no!!! First victim to this thread. :( That's like saying Apocalypse Now isn't good. I mean, Soma didn't like it and that's fine with me. But all people who actually study cinema and understand it better than me say it's one of the best movies ever made. At least watch it and see for yourself! You might not like it but you should acknowledge its technical wonders.

knightgames
02-03-08, 22:12
A Clockwork Orange came out around 1969 or 70 ish. It's an older movie, spikejones.

I disliked it because the characters were repulsive to me. There were no redeeming qualities in them. Nothing even to identify with the audience (or at least me).

Malcolm did act very very well in the movie, but I just didn't like it.

Archetype
02-03-08, 22:14
Watched it sometime last year, have to say it wasn't great.

Encore
02-03-08, 22:15
I disliked it because the characters were repulsive to me. There were no redeeming qualities in them. Nothing even to identify with the audience (or at least me).


You only like movies where you can identify with the characters??

tizerist
02-03-08, 22:19
nothing special about the film for me. the portrayal of a future london was waaaaay off, the violence was unnecessary and mindless and i think the film survives only on its reputation.
had it not been banned, i doubt we would be talking about it now.

Forwen
02-03-08, 22:31
Never seen the film, read the book however. And while I understand (or at least, as I understand) one of the main points of this story was to allow the reader to see the world through a common thug's eyes, mindset and reasoning, it was nothing I couldn't have figured out for myself. The other point, I assume, was about social pressure and conformism, but I've got strong views on that which don't really overlap with what I read there.

Maybe there's some historical context I'm missing? Dunno, and don't feel inspired to check.

Encore
02-03-08, 22:40
nothing special about the film for me. the portrayal of a future london was waaaaay off, the violence was unnecessary and mindless and i think the film survives only on its reputation.
had it not been banned, i doubt we would be talking about it now.

:( I see a lot of disrespect for the artistic side of cinema here... But opinions are opinions I guess.

Also the violence thing about this movie is SO over estimated. It was extremely violent yes... for the 70s. Much worse movies came out since then. Trainspotting, Kids, or Alpha Dog - those are violent movies about young people that (at least to me) make A Clockwork Orange seem like a kiddie movie.

Soma Holiday
02-03-08, 22:47
You only like movies where you can identify with the characters??

I don't think it was necessarily not identifying with the characters, as much as it was absolutely loathing them. :p I've seen plenty of films where the characters were superb, and yet they have nothing in common with me, but to see such a vile person actually succeed is near torture. I wanted to kill Alex myself by the end of the film. I didn't feel any type of compassion for him. The only way I can describe the feeling at the end is that...it felt like I had just watched Hitler successfully concur the world and eradicate the entire non-Arian race.

That is seriously how much I detested Alex.

The only aspect I actually liked from the film was the hint that music is closely linked to sex and violence, because I feel that is true.

But yeah...:o

Also, about the violence being intense...the rapes where the only parts the bothered me. I'm used to seeing violence in movies like you said, but rape is just something incredibly horrible to me. I really did not want to see anything like that...they could have portrayed rape in a much more subtle way...but I guess that wouldnt have shown the "ultraviolence." ;)

Encore
02-03-08, 22:50
Oh, that post of mine was directed to knightgames specifically. To be honest I can totally get your point, Soma. You gave off decent reasons for not liking the movie.

knightgames
02-03-08, 22:59
You only like movies where you can identify with the characters??

Identify is probably the wrong word. But there was nothing in his character that I cared about. As a viewer not being invested in the central character, the story surrounding him seemed like parsley.


Look at Pulp Fiction. I was caught up in many of the exploits of the characters. Yes they were criminals. They were repulsive individuals, but somehow they made enough of an impact to make me care about them and what happened to them.

I never got that touchpoint in A Clockwork Orange to make me like it. If I have no reason to care about a character I'm not going to like the film. As I said I DO think Malcolm did admirably. Maybe a few script inclusions would have fleshed the character out enough for me. I don't know.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm. My curiosity does have a hold on me. I haven't seen the movie in 25 years. I wonder if I'd view it the same way today?

BtoFu
02-03-08, 23:25
But all people who actually study cinema and understand it better than me say it's one of the best movies ever made. At least watch it and see for yourself! You might not like it but you should acknowledge its technical wonders.

Pied Pipers for the masses. :D I don't listen to many critics because oftentimes they flat out steer you in the wrong direction of expectations. I didn't particularly care for Clockwork, kinda messy and though it has it's iconography, visually I thought much of it was suspect where futuristic guesswork was concerned. To me it just looked like another circa 70's movie that was trying to look futuristic and was kinda failing at it. Not in a bad Logan's Run kinda way mind you! I think Fight Club resonates more with me as a modern Clockwork.

knightgames
03-03-08, 05:08
Kubrick does have the chops, and that is why he's recognised as an elite director.

I love Dr. Strangelove. It's one of my top movies. It's sadly satirical and perfect for it's time considering the height of paranioa regarding the cold war, that the only way to protect ourselves from each other was by killing everyone..... and the madness from that kind of thinking. (Was "MAD' other wise known as mutually assured destruction even a policy back in 63?)

I don't even need to mention 2001. It's a visual masterpiece. (I remember reading on a forward to the novel of 2001 or 2010 that either Neil Armstrong or Buzz Aldrin were going to kiddingly report a monolith on the moon. They decided it would be best not to follow through with the joke.)

I originally hated The Shining. It was so different from King's book that I panned it for deviating as much as it did. It wasn't untill the remade miniseries with Rebecca DeMourney and Tim Daly aired that I realised how bad the idea of such a literal translation is. It didn't stink, but it felt unnecessarily dragged out. I gave Kubrick some slack on his verion of the Shining and actually have warmed up to it quite nicely. (Scatman's character didn't need to die in the movie, but that's me just liking King's version a bit better)

TombRaiderLover
03-03-08, 06:29
A Clockwork Orange came out around 1969 or 70 ish. It's an older movie, spikejones.

1971. ;)

Wow, I'm very surprised by the negativity towards the film in this thread, seeing as how it's one of my favourite films (and regularly appears on Top 100 lists by critics.) But to each his own. ;)

Evangelina
03-03-08, 09:12
I absolutely adore this film, the books alot better though.

I remember I hated it the first time I saw it but after watching it another couple of times and reading the book in between I began to appreciate it.

Now it's one of my all time faves.

touchthesky
03-03-08, 09:44
Ive never seen it, but, lately, Tesco and ASDA have been getting in those classics, so perhaps I'll pick it up.

knightgames
03-03-08, 10:58
1971. ;)

Wow, I'm very surprised by the negativity towards the film in this thread, seeing as how it's one of my favourite films (and regularly appears on Top 100 lists by critics.) But to each his own. ;)

gracias. I knew I was in the ballpark, but specifically I wasn't positive. :hea:

Encore
03-03-08, 13:51
Identify is probably the wrong word. But there was nothing in his character that I cared about. As a viewer not being invested in the central character, the story surrounding him seemed like parsley.


Look at Pulp Fiction. I was caught up in many of the exploits of the characters. Yes they were criminals. They were repulsive individuals, but somehow they made enough of an impact to make me care about them and what happened to them.

I never got that touchpoint in A Clockwork Orange to make me like it. If I have no reason to care about a character I'm not going to like the film. As I said I DO think Malcolm did admirably. Maybe a few script inclusions would have fleshed the character out enough for me. I don't know.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm. My curiosity does have a hold on me. I haven't seen the movie in 25 years. I wonder if I'd view it the same way today?

Point taken. Like I said, a matter of opinion.

Pied Pipers for the masses. :D I don't listen to many critics because oftentimes they flat out steer you in the wrong direction of expectations. I didn't particularly care for Clockwork, kinda messy and though it has it's iconography, visually I thought much of it was suspect where futuristic guesswork was concerned. To me it just looked like another circa 70's movie that was trying to look futuristic and was kinda failing at it. Not in a bad Logan's Run kinda way mind you! I think Fight Club resonates more with me as a modern Clockwork.

Did I use the word "critics" on my post? No, I didn't. I specifically mentioned people who actually study cinema, want to be directors themselves, art students in general, etc. I don't like critics myself. Some of my favorite movies have been bashed by them.
About it failing as a futuristic movie, you're missing the point, the movie is suposed to not be too futuristic because in the end it's about the issue of violence and its various types (including institutionalized violence), in our modern society.

Paperdoll
03-03-08, 14:14
Granted I never saw the movie until the end therefore I wouldn't consider my own opinion on this valid but I never cared much for it. Lately I've been watching more movies for entertainment rather than for their "qualities", so to speak so I can't say I'll be watching A Clockwork Orange anytime soon. As far as the visual go... only thing I can remember is pretty much the character designs so I can't elaborate on that...

petujaymz
03-03-08, 14:59
I've tried to watch this film four times.

I either fall asleep (it's always shown late at night) or I miss the first hour or so.

:wve:

remote91
03-03-08, 15:26
I loved the movie! :D I thought it was great and I liked the quirky, unusual clothes and hair.

TombRaiderLover
03-03-08, 19:10
Note to UK fans:

The 2-disc special edition of the film was released in stores today. ;) The picture and sound has been remastered, and it features an audio commentary with McDowell, a Channel Four documentary (45 mins), a new featurette (30 mins) and a documentary profile of McDowell's career (90 mins), plus the original trailer.

BtoFu
03-03-08, 21:27
Did I use the word "critics" on my post? No, I didn't. I specifically mentioned people who actually study cinema, want to be directors themselves, art students in general, etc. I don't like critics myself. Some of my favorite movies have been bashed by them.
About it failing as a futuristic movie, you're missing the point, the movie is suposed to not be too futuristic because in the end it's about the issue of violence and its various types (including institutionalized violence), in our modern society.

Well I was a film student for four years, so that's tit for tat when you talk about whose opinions are more relevant, because we never really hold any opinions higher than our own - nor should we when it comes to taste. And my gripe with the futuristic settings were purely on an aesthetic front, not thematic.