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rowanlim
05-09-08, 05:07
I came across these 2 articles & I'm horrified :(

4,000+ Japan Whale Harvest Not Justified

A new study by Japan's national whale-research program is drawing sharp rebuke from scientists and conservationists who say the results did not necessitate killing more than 4,000 whales.

Critics have long accused Japan of using its scientific whaling program to circumvent a 1986 moratorium on commercial whaling by the International Whaling Commission (IWC).

In the new research, Kenji Konishi of Japan's Institute of Cetacean Research and his colleagues analyzed data from 4,704 Antarctic minke whales killed by the Japanese Whale Research Program (JARPA) from 1987 to 2005.

They concluded that the thickness of the whales' blubber decreased by 3.6 millimeters (0.14 inch), or about 9 percent, during the 18-year period.

The Japanese team suggests the thinning blubber may be due to either global warming-related reductions in ocean krill populations, competition by other whale species, or a combination of the two factors.

The minke whales killed by JARPA were preserved for study or openly sold as meat on the Japanese market, as is allowed under IWC regulations.

The study is detailed online in a recent edition of the journal Polar Biology.

"Crude" and Unnecessary

Konishi said killing the whales was the only way to ensure the measurements of the blubber's thickness were consistent across the different specimens.

"These data could only be obtained using lethal research," Konishi told National Geographic News.

Previous studies using biopsy samples, which are taken from living whales, have not obtained "total fat contents and thus energy content" of the animals' blubber, Konishi added.

Scott Baker, associate director of the Marine Mammal Institute at Oregon State University, was not involved in the study.

Full article here (http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/09/080902-japan-whaling.html)

I always believed that killing whales for meat is never justified, they are endangered & it's so difficult for them to reproduce, I wonder is it really difficult to go against their culture for whale meat?

Elephants Decimated in Congo Park

Since the beginning of this year, armed groups, soldiers, and poachers have killed 10 percent of the elephants in Congo's troubled Virunga National Park—allegedly driven by rising Chinese demand for ivory—park officials say.

The announcement raises fears that elephants could disappear forever from Africa's oldest and largest national park, which has recently made headlines for its gorilla murders.

Rangers plying the lawless central sector of Virunga have discovered the bodies of seven elephants in the past two weeks alone.

In one case they came upon Rwandan militia members hovering over the bodies of two elephants. The rangers managed to drive the men away before they could remove the animals' tusks.

In all, 24 elephants are known to have been killed in Virunga so far this year.

"We believe that less than ten were killed last year," said Samantha Newport, spokesperson for Virunga National Park. "Undoubtedly this year is a lot, lot worse. It's catastrophic."

Chinese to Blame?

The Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) is one of the primary sources of illegally trafficked ivory in the world, according to TRAFFIC, a group that monitors the wildlife trade.

Recently, the tiny elephant population of Virunga in the conflict-riven east of the country has become the target of gunmen hoping to unload the illegal ivory into a thriving international black market, park officials say.

Virunga's elephant population is small—thought to number between 200 and 300 animals—and isolated. It will not be able to sustain itself if killings continue at this rate, said Noelle Kumpel, program manager at the Zoological Society of London, which is working to support the rehabilitation and management of Virunga.

There's been a surge in the volume of illegal ivory since 2004, said Tom Milliken, regional director of TRAFFIC for eastern and southern Africa. Experts attribute the trend to thriving and overt domestic markets in the contraband throughout central Africa, in combination with a newly tapped appetite for ivory among China's rising middle class.

Read more here (http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/08/080829-africa-elephants.html)

Elephant killings are also never justified, for the same reason. Is it because we are not doing enough to make people aware of how severe the situation is? Or are there really that many people who just don't care? :(

Death Mask
05-09-08, 05:14
Damn it, reading this made me extremely upset, why the hell doesn't anyone do anything about this? ****ing murderers. :mad:

Goose
05-09-08, 08:28
I cant stand stuff like that, especially animal abuse in this country, it should recieve a harsher penalty.

Elmer
05-09-08, 08:53
Why do we have to know everything!
If whale blubber is decreasing in thickness, then well, okay, but murdering thousands of them to get to know that surely doesn't help them at all!:mad:

As for the elephants... just let them live there lives peacefully already:mad:
Why are some people that obsessed with ivory that they are capable of murdering elephants for it?

Nefertiti_89
05-09-08, 08:54
I cant believe the UN and UNIC lets this happen!!!

Its in complete and utter violation of the World Charter for Nature and World Biodoversity Convention!!!!!!!!!

Also, I have been to Japan and alot of people there do not eat whale meat and do not follow tradition. There is no excuse for this!!!!!!!!

And as for the elephants, DRC doesnt have a stable enough government to stop this from happening, theres too much infighting going on for them to even realise!

This kind of thing really just makes me sick.

MrBear
05-09-08, 09:05
I cant stand stuff like that, especially animal abuse in this country, it should recieve a harsher penalty.

Well, how harsh is the current penalty?

I find it strange that people react to these kinds of news with the sentiment that the perpetrators should spend longer time in jail.. As if that helps anything?

About the topic, it is indeed sad.. I'm not looking forward to telling my grand-children about the time when we had wild tigers and rain forests in the world.. (okay, so maybe the rain forest won't be gone by then, but you get the idea)

MiCkiZ88
05-09-08, 09:13
humans > everything else. Who cares about wildlife when you can see them in zoos? Who cares about rainforests when there's a tiny one near your town? We need more of everything. We own the planet.

Pfft.

^ Not my words. Just my opinion about some humans.

MrBear
05-09-08, 09:23
Unfortunately, a lot of people do this not for fun, but to get by and earn money.. Without poverty in South America, would the farmers cut down lumber from the rainforest? It's a matter of some people prioritising their own survival above the existence of endangered species and rainforests.. I'm not sure how strongly I can blame them, wouldn't we do the same?

MiCkiZ88
05-09-08, 09:28
They need better education and a better system. Cutting down the forest without any regulations will spoil the soil and nothing will ever grow on it. Flood waters will wipe away the muddy soil and it's near impossible to build proper housing/buildings on it.

Sure poverty has a lot to do with it, but being ignorant of the consequences is another matter as well.

Same goes for hunting.

Goose
05-09-08, 09:33
Well, how harsh is the current penalty?

I find it strange that people react to these kinds of news with the sentiment that the perpetrators should spend longer time in jail.. As if that helps anything?

About the topic, it is indeed sad.. I'm not looking forward to telling my grand-children about the time when we had wild tigers and rain forests in the world.. (okay, so maybe the rain forest won't be gone by then, but you get the idea)

I think England needs a harsher system in total, when kids think that going to prison is like going to a hotel, where they stand around playing pool and have tv's with playstations in there rooms, its no wonder there re offending.

MrBear
05-09-08, 09:34
Micki: Yes, indeed.. The ignorance goes hand in hand with the poverty; without poverty they wouldn't cut down trees and without ignorance they would know how to prevent laying waste to the areas..

I think England needs a harsher system in total, when kids think that going to prison is like going to a hotel, where they stand around playing pool and have tv's with playstations in there rooms, its no wonder there re offending.

So increasing the time they should spend in jail makes them aware of the real prison life in what way?

MiCkiZ88
05-09-08, 09:37
Micki: Yes, indeed.. The ignorance goes hand in hand with the poverty; without poverty they wouldn't cut down trees and without ignorance they would know how to prevent laying waste to the areas..


Conclusion: Educate the poor. Does it cost too much to give them free education? Education is the key out of poverty. But with education they will know how not to cut everything out of the way as well. Ah, I'm not sure how many goverments would be willing to do that like ours does. It would be a totally new system.

Goose
05-09-08, 09:38
Micki: Yes, indeed.. The ignorance goes hand in hand with the poverty; without poverty they wouldn't cut down trees and without ignorance they would know how to prevent laying waste to the areas..



So increasing the time they should spend in jail makes them aware of the real prison life in what way?

I didnt say increasing there time? Increasing there experience, if prison was a 100% degrading experience then they wouldnt be very eager to get back there would they?

MrBear
05-09-08, 09:40
I didnt say increasing there time? Increasing there experience, if prison was a 100% degrading experience then they wouldnt be very eager to get back there would they?

So when you talk about a harsher system, you mean the condition of the jails? :confused:

Micki: well, free education wouldn't be free for the government :p and think of how large, for instance, Brazil is.. Usually the farmers that we need to teach about this are situated so far away that you'd practically need a teacher for every 2 or 3 people :-/ (I imagine, anyway, I haven't exactly been there)
I do agree with you, by the way.. Education is the way to go...

Goose
05-09-08, 09:42
So when you talk about a harsher system, you mean the condition of the jails? :confused:

Exactly: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/multimedia/archive/00438/news-graphics-2008-_438441a.jpg

Thats better then military personel recieve.

MrBear
05-09-08, 09:45
Exactly: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/multimedia/archive/00438/news-graphics-2008-_438441a.jpg

Thats better then military personel recieve.

Okay, I see the dilemma now.. Of course jail needs to be frightening to prevent crime before it happens.. On the other hand, as I've heard it, jail is pretty frightening once you're inside; it doesn't matter if you've got a tv or not, you're still robbed of your freedom..

I don't think we need to take steps to make prison a worse place than it already is.. But that's my opinion..

Goose
05-09-08, 09:50
Okay, I see the dilemma now.. Of course jail needs to be frightening to prevent crime before it happens.. On the other hand, as I've heard it, jail is pretty frightening once you're inside; it doesn't matter if you've got a tv or not, you're still robbed of your free time :)

I don't think we need to take steps to make prison a worse place than it already is.. But that's my opinion..

Yea, but the people going there half the time know each other anyway, its a social life for them being inside, alot of them learn how to become BETTER criminals by the social life they have when inside.

If they were treated like in mates at alcatrazz, no talking, get beaten if they mess about and the like, might get raped in the showers, it would be a hellish experience.

The problem is people in this country are against traditional prisons as they look at south africa and say "it doesnt work there", but there ignoring the fact that in south africa, there nothing for prisoners to come out to, where as in England our government practically wipes there bums for them if they fill in the forms.

MiCkiZ88
05-09-08, 09:50
Micki: well, free education wouldn't be free for the government :p and think of how large, for instance, Brazil is.. Usually the farmers that we need to teach about this are situated so far away that you'd practically need a teacher for every 2 or 3 people :-/ (I imagine, anyway, I haven't exactly been there)
I do agree with you, by the way.. Education is the way to go...
Heh, indeed. But it would be better to educate the people or at least give them some information. I trust that there must be some workshops or something and they should educate the workers. What's better: Keep wasting and building new (ultimately ending up in ruining the soil)? Or stop wasting and give some of the money for a better education system?

MrBear
05-09-08, 09:59
^ Let's hope we'll see more progression on this part :) I think the problem is money, as always.. It's not like the Brazilian government wants the rainforest gone..


If they were treated like in mates at alcatrazz, no talking, get beaten if they mess about and the like, might get raped in the showers, it would be a hellish experience.


Yes, and it probably would do a lot to make some people get their ways of living straight.. But the thing is, I'm not ready to subject any human being to that kind of treatment.. I know it would be for the better of society, but I just couldn't enforce that kind of prison...

You're probably right about the social thing, I don't know a lot about these environments.. And if you're right, that really is a problem.. :o

Goose
05-09-08, 10:01
Yes, and it probably would do a lot to make some people get their ways of living straight.. But the thing is, I'm not ready to subject any human being to that kind of treatment.. I know it would be for the better of society, but I just couldn't enforce that kind of prison...

You're probably right about the social thing, I don't know a lot about these environments.. And if you're right, that really is a problem.. :o

This is mostly according to the News and papers to be honest.

Nefertiti_89
05-09-08, 10:22
humans > everything else. Who cares about wildlife when you can see them in zoos? Who cares about rainforests when there's a tiny one near your town? We need more of everything. We own the planet.

Pfft.

^ Not my words. Just my opinion about some humans.

Agreed.

Humans to me are just disgusting creatures. We're right down there with cockroaches to me I'm so embarrassed to be human at times like this.

I think we should punish people by locking them in zoos, treating them the way they treat animals, humiliating them, degrading them, and slowly destroying their quality of life until they would rather die. I dont think its harsh because these people are monsters.

rowanlim
05-09-08, 10:27
To some people, these activities are just a way of life. I don't know how we can revert them from hunting to not hunting. Stricter punishments seems to be in order...

I don't know, I just felt so sad & disgusted.

Nefertiti_89
05-09-08, 10:31
What I dont get though, is if someone kills one human, everyone wants the death penalty for them but someone goes out and kills 4,000 animals, and nobody is even game to arrest them! I think laws need revamping as well.

xXhayleyroxXx
05-09-08, 10:42
id hate to think what id do if i saw someone kill an animal :cln:

circumstances like this just anger me and upset me, i agree with everything everyone has been saying on this thread, im disgusted.

if you lot really wanna see stuff like this search hayden panettierre (cant spell her name properly:p) on youtube and it will come up with her trying to save dolphins and cat and dogs destined to be killed for fur (Unfortuneatly she fails ) :(
it really is disgusting but i watched it and i now fully respect hayden, she risked her lives for those animals and i would havwe done the same :(


i think it should be illegal to kill any animal inhumanely, i think they have the same right to live here as we do, im not religious but i remember been told God put us on this planet to look after the animals so shoudn't we?

i just feel proud to say most of my animals are rescued (50+ and counting), and some of them such as chinchillas have been saved from being made into a coat or saved from a grisly death :(

i think if we all did our bit we could stop a few inncoent animals dying :hug:

tampi
05-09-08, 14:08
http://i33.************/2mg7djp.jpg :cln: