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View Full Version : EU President to Obama: Your plan sucks!


SamReeves
25-03-09, 16:44
LOL. The great American stimulus is now getting some hate from the EU. The EU President called it the "road to hell" for all the spending. You gotta love it when Obama gets egg in his face from his own lefty buddies in the EU. :vlol:

Read the story below in the San Francisco Chronicle:

EU presidency: US economic plans 'a road to hell' (http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2009/03/25/financial/f073139D49.DTL&tsp=1)

Reggie
25-03-09, 17:30
There are right wing governments in Europe you know.
I know that Gordon Brown our Labour Prime Minister is in full support of his economic policy. In fact, I believe Obama may be mirroring what our government's been doing with all this spending.

My opinion? As a saver and prudent spender I've been penalised. My savings interest has gone through the floor and I feel I've been punished for spending spending spending all the time. On the other hand, failing businesses and failing banks get support. Why? shouldn't the government be funding success instead? I disagree with how both the UK and US have managed this and I think we'll see things going disasterously wrong down the line.

Draco
25-03-09, 17:35
Obama is a failed President as far as I'm concerned. That's the problem with electing someone not qualified for the job.

Elmer
25-03-09, 17:50
Who would you like have for president?

Drone
25-03-09, 17:56
Mother of the nations tries to act cool huh ....

Draco
25-03-09, 17:58
Who would you like have for president?

Ron Paul

Mad Tony
25-03-09, 18:03
Ron PaulNo, no and NO. The guy is a racist and far too extreme.

As for who I'd like to have in the White House - definitely not Obama that's for sure. Personally I'd rather have someone who doesn't believe mindless spending. People criticized Bush's spending, yet Obama is even worse.

Draco
25-03-09, 18:23
No, no and NO. The guy is a racist and far too extreme.

Racist?

As for extreme, it only seems extreme. His way would be better for everyone.

Encore
25-03-09, 18:33
Are you gonna spend the next 4 years bashing Obama 4 times a week, Sam? It's getting kinda tiresome... :p FFS, I don't exactly worship the guy either but let the man do the job. 2 months is hardly time to evaluate anything.

The_Underworld
25-03-09, 18:48
Are you gonna spend the next 4 years bashing Obama 4 times a week, Sam? It's getting kinda tiresome... :p FFS, I don't exactly worship the guy either but let the man do the job. 2 months is hardly time to evaluate anything.
Agreed! :tmb:

ShadyCroft
25-03-09, 18:57
^^ Agreed as well !

I'm not an Obama fanatic, I just don't see these constant bashing topics getting us anywhere

voltz
25-03-09, 19:10
I'm thinking if Mccain had a different VP, we may be seeing a far different picture by now.

Nannonxyay
25-03-09, 19:16
Are you gonna spend the next 4 years bashing Obama 4 times a week, Sam? It's getting kinda tiresome... :p FFS, I don't exactly worship the guy either but let the man do the job. 2 months is hardly time to evaluate anything.

Amen. :tmb:

robm_2007
25-03-09, 19:26
Ron Paul

OMGOMGOMG, it thought that it said "Ru Paul", the drag queen. LOL.

also, the EU (european union?) has a president? ive never heard of that. sorry, but i never learned that in school, American skoolz now aint suh guud.

SamReeves
25-03-09, 19:34
Are you gonna spend the next 4 years bashing Obama 4 times a week, Sam? It's getting kinda tiresome... :p FFS, I don't exactly worship the guy either but let the man do the job. 2 months is hardly time to evaluate anything.

LOL, it was your EU President doing the bashing. :ton:

Just reminding you folks how wonderful Obama is. :) Also I remember quite a bit of bashing by unhappy posters here of Bush. :whi:

Forwen
25-03-09, 19:54
We have a president? :confused:

This is a gross misnomer. "EU presidency" is held by a country and as such overseen by the country's leader.

violentblossom
25-03-09, 19:59
Are you gonna spend the next 4 years bashing Obama 4 times a week, Sam? It's getting kinda tiresome... :p FFS, I don't exactly worship the guy either but let the man do the job. 2 months is hardly time to evaluate anything.

AMEN, Encore. God, you're so reasonable, it kills me. :hug:

raiderfun
25-03-09, 20:11
Too early to judge a president, Obama needs at least two years, therefore we can declare our verdict.

Mad Tony
25-03-09, 20:48
Racist?

As for extreme, it only seems extreme. His way would be better for everyone.Yes, Racist. Ron Paul has shown that he holds very hostile views towards black people on numerous occasions. One such example is when he made a joke about the 1992 Los Angeles riots saying "they only stopped because the blacks went to pick up their welfare checks".

Why would his way be better for everyone? He's an isolationist who wants to pull the US out of the United Nations. He obviously hasn't learned the lessons of the failures of the League of Nations in the 20s and 30s. One of the reasons why the League of Nations failed was because the US did not join. Need I remind you that the failure of the League of Nations was one of the causes of World War II? He wants to get rid of many important government agencies such as FEMA, DHS, FBI and many more. He also opposed giving a congressional gold medal to Rosa Parks and Pope John Paul II.

If he's so great, why did he get such little support in the primaries? The bulk of his supporters are paranoid conspiracy loons who advocate every conspiracy theory going. This makes me wonder whether he lied when he said he didn't advocate the 9/11 conspiracies.

Moving away from Ron Paul now, I also find it ironic that the people in this thread who are criticizing Sam for criticizing Obama are the same people who would bash Bush at any given opportunity. During the last year or so of Bush's presidency there'd be a new thread about how terrible he was almost every week. Bush got his fair share of attacks on this forum and I don't see why Obama should be immune for it.

Quasimodo
25-03-09, 20:58
Moving away from Ron Paul now, I also find it ironic that the people in this thread who are criticizing Sam for criticizing Obama are the same people who would bash Bush at any given opportunity. During the last year or so of Bush's presidency there'd be a new thread about how terrible he was almost every week. Bush got his fair share of attacks on this forum and I don't see why Obama should be immune for it.

Same here. Obama is fair game :p

violentblossom
25-03-09, 21:01
Moving away from Ron Paul now, I also find it ironic that the people in this thread who are criticizing Sam for criticizing Obama are the same people who would bash Bush at any given opportunity. During the last year or so of Bush's presidency there'd be a new thread about how terrible he was almost every week. Bush got his fair share of attacks on this forum and I don't see why Obama should be immune for it.

Yes, i hate constant complaint threads, too, but that was a bit different as his time had already almost run out and Obama is just barely getting into the swing of things.

EmeraldFields
25-03-09, 21:04
Moving away from Ron Paul now, I also find it ironic that the people in this thread who are criticizing Sam for criticizing Obama are the same people who would bash Bush at any given opportunity. During the last year or so of Bush's presidency there'd be a new thread about how terrible he was almost every week. Bush got his fair share of attacks on this forum and I don't see why Obama should be immune for it.

Maybe it's because the people who are now criticizing Obama were the ones who always ragged on people for criticizing Bush.The same goes for the people who are now not wanting to dig deeper into what Obama is doing.

I think we all tend to be hypocritical sometimes.:p

angelfaithrox
25-03-09, 21:08
Moving away from Ron Paul now, I also find it ironic that the people in this thread who are criticizing Sam for criticizing Obama are the same people who would bash Bush at any given opportunity. During the last year or so of Bush's presidency there'd be a new thread about how terrible he was almost every week. Bush got his fair share of attacks on this forum and I don't see why Obama should be immune for it.

Well, Bush was in power for eight years and made a lot of mistakes. Obama has been in power what two months and aren't really giving him a chance. I don't agree with a lot of what Obama has to say and honestly I doubt he is going to change much, but I think we should at least give him a chance.

SamReeves
25-03-09, 21:13
TBH, I think some people here will make any excuse for Obama. Fact is he's the President and is the guy in charge. He hasn't done a very good job no matter how you slice it, and it's time for the folks who championed this guy to see what he really is…especially through the words of other world leaders. Not to mention the many people whom have lost half their wealth in the stock market and home equity, just in the first two months of the Obama presidency. It could be rather expensive to "give him a chance" if folks really want to see him succeed. ;)

But yea it's easy to attack the OP if you don't have a story or reason to refute why Obama is doing good! :whi:

angelfaithrox
25-03-09, 21:15
.

violentblossom
25-03-09, 21:17
I'm not making excuses, as I've stated I'm not really an Obama fan but I'm going to give him more than 2 months before I start criticizing everything he does. ;)

EXACTLY. Geez, this is starting to sound like "Core fanatics vs. Crystal Dynamics fanatics".

Just because people are saying that you shouldn't judge his whole presidency in 2 months doesn't mean that they are in love with the man or his policies.

Mad Tony
25-03-09, 21:37
There's nothing wrong with criticism of individual actions though. Just think of this: if McCain were in Obama's shoes would he have escaped lots of harsh criticism on here? Most definitely not.

ShadyCroft
25-03-09, 21:45
There's nothing wrong with criticism of individual actions though. Just think of this: if McCain were in Obama's shoes would he have escaped lots of harsh criticism on here? Most definitely not.

I have to agree with you. There's always another side that isn't happy, which is why both sides should stop...like I said, its getting us no where.

And give the guy some time to do some presidency. If he fails then you can gloat, if he doesn't then wouldn't we be glad. And Bush is gone, no more, finito, so bashing him won't do us any good either.

Reggie
25-03-09, 23:54
EXACTLY. Geez, this is starting to sound like "Core fanatics vs. Crystal Dynamics fanatics".

Just because people are saying that you shouldn't judge his whole presidency in 2 months doesn't mean that they are in love with the man or his policies.

:vlol: An apt comparison!
Its impossible to judge a whole presidency if the whole presidecy hasn't played out. Its as simple as that. All we can do is judge what has happened so far and the individual policies and actions he takes. I'd like to think that something as petty as left-right idealogies can be set aside for something more realistic when it comes down to these hard times i.e. judging someone based on the merit they display thus far.

Oh and good comments from MT so far in this thread.

Trinity34
26-03-09, 01:20
Well I will not say Obama has not made some mistakes but what interests me more is if he will learn from them or not or stay the same.

Lost_Raider
26-03-09, 01:50
Sigh...it's not really Obama's fault...he didn't single-handly put the country into debt during this economic disaster, it's the trend that's running back fo decades.

Keynes says that during recession, government should run deficit, while during growth, government should have surplus. Somehow US government can't translate that theory into reality. Now it will go bankrupt before it got nuked by some rogue states.

Be glad this is the EU that does the complaining. The last time the Chinese complained about the plan, the price for T-bonds that were issued for the bank bail-out money dropped the next morning, and now Chinese ships are free to roaming around South China Sea with US Navy keep its mouth shut.

CerebralAssassin
26-03-09, 01:53
I will start critisizing and bashing (if necessary) BO at the end of his term;)

Mr.Burns
26-03-09, 01:58
The extremist views and attitudes in this thread are what frustrates me the most, not a person. Obama will be judged by historians. As it stands, it is too soon to say for certain how this will turn out, though I for one have never been a fan of excessive spending when in a situation with massive debt. Folks hated Bush because he was overly conservative and unilateral. Folks hate Obama because he's big on spending, big on government, big on gun control, etc etc etc. No one will ever have universal popularity however I find it saddening to find people, especially people in this thread that are demonstrating views that don't see things from a broader perspective, just black and white.

Quasimodo
26-03-09, 02:03
The extremist views and attitudes in this thread

:confused:

Kittypower
26-03-09, 02:10
64 days people, a little more than 2 months. If he does turn out to be a bad president than well just vote him out in 4 years.

LaraLuvrrr
26-03-09, 02:20
I think Obama is a socialist. He really does care about the U.S. But he wants to fix it all himself and use taxpayer's money to do it. So now America is in the hands of the government. We'll see where that leads.... Right now I kinda like Obama but despise many in congress and the government. I'm not sure what to think about all the governmental spending. I just don't see why it has to be to the extent he wants... the price tag is huge.

amiro1989
26-03-09, 02:26
Are you gonna spend the next 4 years bashing Obama 4 times a week, Sam? It's getting kinda tiresome... :p FFS, I don't exactly worship the guy either but let the man do the job. 2 months is hardly time to evaluate anything.

Thank you.

Obama is not a god, and obviously if you think he'll be able to solve those massive problems in 2 months you're deluded. Wake up. It took us a little bit more than 5 to 6 years to get in that situation, it should take just as much to get off of it ;). Even if he did some mistakes, does that make him an idiot or an incompetent president? I don't think so. He's a human after all, just like everyone of us. Bush did some massive mistakes as well, but we got over it. I don't plan on opening a thread on every single "bad" things he did. You just look like a no-life posting threads every two-days about "how lame" Obama supposedly is.

Plus, that argument about Bush haters doing the same with Bush is lame. You're just as pointless if you keep on posting threads about the "bad" things that he did, and god knows he did in 8 years. Using this argument to explain your action, doesn't make you any better ;)

Lost_Raider
26-03-09, 02:31
Sad truth is that a big government is needed to maintain an big army...and US got its hands got caught in too many cookie jars to simply disengage from the world.

This passage from this article (http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/china-flexes-and-the-us-catches-a-chilly-reminder-20090316-8zu2.html?page=-1) sums up the situation nicely.

When Bush's first treasury secretary, Paul O'Neill, warned the vice-president Dick Cheney against tax cuts because of the looming deficit, Cheney said: "Reagan proved deficits don't matter."

O'Neill's resistance cost him his job. Of course, he was right. The deficit has emerged starkly as a vulnerability of the US state. It was in Reagan's term that the US went from being the world's major creditor to becoming its biggest debtor.

Bush, his ideological and political heir, has left the US, at the end of a boom, with a deficit of half a trillion dollars. To fight off recession, Obama is putting the country into much deeper deficit.

violentblossom
26-03-09, 02:58
There's nothing wrong with criticism of individual actions though. Just think of this: if McCain were in Obama's shoes would he have escaped lots of harsh criticism on here? Most definitely not.

good point. :tmb:

SamReeves
26-03-09, 03:04
Plus, that argument about Bush haters doing the same with Bush is lame. You're just as pointless if you keep on posting threads about the "bad" things that he did, and god knows he did in 8 years. Using this argument to explain your action, doesn't make you any better ;)

Ha!! I urge you to do a search of Bush in General Chat. 90% of those threads were negative threads, but many posters here participated gleefully…even after the first election of Bush. It's all there. But if anything it proves some TRF'ers are unwilling to be fair or want to validate their own truth. This is what I suspected and I thank some of you for confirming that. :whi:

*back to your normally scheduled threads*

disapearing-boy
26-03-09, 03:04
Not to mention the many people whom have lost half their wealth in the stock market and home equity, just in the first two months of the Obama presidency


That would've happened regardless of who was in Office. In fact, it was already happening long before he took office. This recession has been looming for a long period worldwide due to bad economic policy. The banks were corrupt and overspending money that doesn't really exist. Previous Government leaders overlooked this despite the warnings. They saw the short term benefit (money, money, money) and not the long term problem. The people responsible wont be blamed, it's the people who may very likely fail at fixing an almost unfixable problem that will be blamed for everything.

How quick we forget.

I don't think any party would have a perfect solution. I'm not a fan of Bush but rarely joined in on the bashing threads. I like Obama in general but his policy on abortion really :cen: me off.:mad:

As a non American (me not Obama!) i think Obama is good for the rest of the world as he's unlikey to start wars but I won't comment on his domestic policies cos it doesn't concern me. We'll see what he can do when given more time.

Your entitled to dislike him, fair enough but give it more time on the economy issue. Its not an easy problem to solve in two months.

violentblossom
26-03-09, 03:07
Ha!! I urge you to do a search of Bush in General Chat. 90% of those threads were negative threads, but many posters here participated gleefully…even after the first election of Bush. It's all there. But if anything it proves some TRF'ers are unwilling to be fair or want to validate their own truth. This is what I suspected and I thank some of you for confirming that. :whi:

*back to your normally scheduled threads*

i think he was talking to everyone.

you're right, and no one is perfect, its evidently come from both sides. people can be very defensive and hypocritical when it comes to their views, i admit that i am guilty of this as well sometimes.

it does not make your view any less valid, its just frustrating to see so many negative thread, i suppose.

amiro1989
26-03-09, 03:12
Ha!! I urge you to do a search of Bush in General Chat. 90% of those threads were negative threads, but many posters here participated gleefully…even after the first election of Bush. It's all there. But if anything it proves some TRF'ers are unwilling to be fair or want to validate their own truth. This is what I suspected and I thank some of you for confirming that. :whi:

*back to your normally scheduled threads*

Oh I agree with you on that Sam.

I'm not attacking you on your point of view. You have the right to say what you think, that is not the problem. I just don't like the fact that you always have to post a thread about it. I remember when some people always posted threads about Bush, I know I was agreeing with them, cuz I had a similar point of view, but it's just as bad, actually, to just point out bad things... It doesn't solve anything.

Nothing personal, here :hug:

SamReeves
26-03-09, 03:53
Oh I agree with you on that Sam.

I'm not attacking you on your point of view. You have the right to say what you think, that is not the problem. I just don't like the fact that you always have to post a thread about it. I remember when some people always posted threads about Bush, I know I was agreeing with them, cuz I had a similar point of view, but it's just as bad, actually, to just point out bad things... It doesn't solve anything.

Nothing personal, here :hug:

Nothing personal here either! :hug: I wish we had less "atta boy" and more discussion how Obama can do it better or perhaps what we think is the better thing to do.

When I do find stories that amuse or alarm me about this Presidency, I do think they should be brought up. Especially when he's still giving bailouts to AIG, GM, Citibank, etc. Remember this is going to be on the deficit's tab. Would it have been perfect with McCain? I don't believe so. He was one of the Senators pushing for TARP, so either way I believe we would be screwed with Obama or McCain. A real fiscal conservative is what the administration needs right now. There are none in sight and that is what scares me most of all. :(

Mona Sax
26-03-09, 22:21
As far as I remember, the economic crisis was an important reason why Obama won in the first place - people blamed Wallstreet, big businesses and neo-cons. I don't want to discuss if they were right or not, I just want to remind people that we were in deep **** long before Obama moved into the White House.

As for solutions... I don't think there are any. Banks and stock markets are the economic backbone of our system, we're all going to bleed whether we save them by burning money or let them die. I think those responsible should answer for their greed in court, though. We, in the meantime, should think about what went wrong and what we can do to make sure it won't happen again in the foreseeable future.

violentblossom
26-03-09, 22:24
As far as I remember, the economic crisis was an important reason why Obama won in the first place - people blamed Wallstreet, big businesses and neo-cons. I don't want to discuss if they were right or not, I just want to remind people that we were in deep **** long before Obama moved into the White House.

As for solutions... I don't think there are any. Banks and stock markets are the economic backbone of our system, we're all going to bleed whether we save them by burning money or let them die. I think those responsible should answer for their greed in court, though. We, in the meantime, should think about what went wrong and what we can do to make sure it won't happen again in the foreseeable future.

well said, Mona. ;)

Reggie
26-03-09, 22:36
The extremist views and attitudes in this thread are what frustrates me the most, not a person. Obama will be judged by historians. As it stands, it is too soon to say for certain how this will turn out, though I for one have never been a fan of excessive spending when in a situation with massive debt. Folks hated Bush because he was overly conservative and unilateral. Folks hate Obama because he's big on spending, big on government, big on gun control, etc etc etc. No one will ever have universal popularity however I find it saddening to find people, especially people in this thread that are demonstrating views that don't see things from a broader perspective, just black and white.

What extremist views? I think the majority in this topic have expressed views which show they are seeing this from a broader perspective and there's been some sound contributions made to this thread which chellenges Sam's view. I'm sure you're not the only one here who knows that ultimately, historians will be the judges of what happened. ;)

As far as I remember, the economic crisis was an important reason why Obama won in the first place - people blamed Wallstreet, big businesses and neo-cons. I don't want to discuss if they were right or not, I just want to remind people that we were in deep **** long before Obama moved into the White House.

As for solutions... I don't think there are any. Banks and stock markets are the economic backbone of our system, we're all going to bleed whether we save them by burning money or let them die. I think those responsible should answer for their greed in court, though. We, in the meantime, should think about what went wrong and what we can do to make sure it won't happen again in the foreseeable future.

Well said. Although this witch-hunt of those that have cocked up doesn't sit well with me. Here in the UK, Fred Goodwin's house has been attacked - people out there seem hungry for the metaphoric blood of these people.
GOODWIN HOME ATTACKED
"Fred the Shred has fled," says the Sun – which holds Sir Fred Goodwin among one of its favourite topics – on its front page today after the disgraced former RBS boss's Edinburgh home was attacked by vandals.
Many of the papers look forward to the G20 summit, with police now concerned that the attack on the banker's property could "signal a campaign of unrest" culminating at the summit.
An anonymous email was sent after the attack threatening further action against bank bosses, and demonstrators have threatened to hang effigies of Goodwin and other bankers from the lampposts.
One could argue, of course, that much of this reaction has been prompted by the media coverage of Sir Fred Goodwin's bonus, led, in part, by the tabloids. However, today the Sun was not condoning the behaviour.
"The Sun condemns all thuggery and vandalism,'' it says on its leader page. "But Britain is angry, we all know why."

source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/mar/26/7

It doesn't sit well with me.

Mona Sax
26-03-09, 22:41
Although this witch-hunt of those that have cocked up doesn't sit well with me. Here in the UK, Fred Goodwin's house has been attacked - people out there seem hungry for the metaphoric blood of these people.
I agree. I'm mad as hell at some of those managers - nothing more than common thieves, IMO - but I want justice, not violence.