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Kittypower
23-05-09, 18:36
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/images/attachement/jpg/site1/20090523/0013729e44a40b8196083f.jpg


GUANGZHOU: A bridge that has gained a reputation as a macabre tourist destination after attracting at least 12 would-be suicide jumpers since the start of April was the scene of a bizare incident this week in which a passerby pushed a man who was threatening to jump.

The passerby was agitated by the fact that the would-be jumper had held up traffic around Haizhu Bridge for almost five hours.

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2009-05/23/content_7935489.htm

Super Badnik
23-05-09, 18:40
So sad:(, and hilarious:p

Tony9595
23-05-09, 18:46
Maybe youŽll hate me, but...

He deserved that :yah:!!
After all, he didnŽt die :p

Super Badnik
23-05-09, 18:47
Maybe youŽll hate me, but...

He deserved that :yah:!!
After all, he didnŽt die :pOh, he didn't die? Now i do this without feeling a bit guilty: :vlol:

Kittypower
23-05-09, 18:47
yeah, after 5 hours i would have gotten out of my car and pushed.

Atlantisfreak666
23-05-09, 18:48
I feel bad for laughing....

Kittypower
23-05-09, 18:48
point:the guy didnt die.

Tony9595
23-05-09, 18:50
Oh, he didn't die? Now i do this without feeling a bit guilty: :vlol:

Yeah, IŽll laugh with you :D

:vlol:

TRhalloween
23-05-09, 18:52
point:the guy didnt die.

You might want to put that in the OP because loads of people arre likely to put "OMG!!!So sad!!! Wat wrong wit dis wuuuurld!! this nevur happened in de olden dayz!!:(:(:("

Night Crawler
23-05-09, 18:54
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/images/attachement/jpg/site1/20090523/0013729e44a40b8197a855.jpg
The 66-year-old Lai Jiansheng, salutes to the passers-by after pushing Chen Fuchao who threatenes to kill himself off the bridge on Thursday, May 21, 2009

Lol.

Mad Tony
23-05-09, 18:54
You might want to put that in the OP because loads of people arre likely to put "OMG!!!So sad!!! Wat wrong wit dis wuuuurld!! this nevur happened in de olden dayz!!:(:(:(":vlol: :tmb:

I lol'ed when I saw this, and I don't feel bad for doing so either. The guy was just standing there for hours holding everybody up. If he really wanted to kill himself he would've either a) jumped straight away or b) done it in private. To be honest I think he was just looking for attention.

Changeling
23-05-09, 18:55
LOL :vlol:

Seriously though... threatening to commit suicide for five hours and not doing anything? I would've pushed him too!

trXD
23-05-09, 18:57
I don't think this is funny, although i admit he could have tried to commit suicide in a less annoying way.

Siberian Tiger
23-05-09, 19:05
If you're gonna do it, do it.

Five hours of holding up other peoples' lives just because he hates his own? Come on.

voltz
23-05-09, 19:06
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/images/attachement/jpg/site1/20090523/0013729e44a40b8197a855.jpg

Honestly I could call this guy a hero, but that doesn't change the fact he just committed attempted murder. Still that was pretty funny.

EDIT: Actually this post was a knee-jerk reaction. Once given time to put some thought into it, it's not so funny afterall. Someone was throwing their life away for crying out loud.

Smog
23-05-09, 19:09
I want to buy that man a drink. :tmb:

Mr.Burns
23-05-09, 19:11
It's nice to see that people are finding humor in a man's emotional trauma and another person's attempt to expedite his pain instead of helping him.

Mad Tony
23-05-09, 19:14
It's nice to see that people are finding humor in a man's emotional trauma and another person's attempt to expedite his pain instead of helping him.I'd be able to understand your point if this guy had only been up there for a 10 minutes or so, but he was up there for hours. As Siberian Tiger said, he was holding other people's lives up just because he hated his own. Besides, there was a mat under the bridge anyway so the man who pushed him probably knew he wasn't going to die.

Lenochka
23-05-09, 19:15
It's nice to see that people are finding humor in a man's emotional trauma and another person's attempt to expedite his pain instead of helping him.

Yeah... It's a bit strange to see people finding this funny, when I first seen the topic appear I was almost certain people would find the guy who pushed him as the one in the wrong.

Changeling
23-05-09, 19:16
I just find it funny because it's not something that people normally do, people usually give the person attention by saying that they have so much to live for and all that jazz. He stood there for five hours wasting people's lives. If he genuinely wanted to kill himself then he would've done it straight away.

Draco
23-05-09, 19:20
I have no tolerance of suicidal people who only do it to be dramatic.

If you want to end your life, do it already. I like mine and I have to get back to it.

Mr.Burns
23-05-09, 19:22
I'd be able to understand your point if this guy had only been up there for a 10 minutes or so, but he was up there for hours. As Siberian Tiger said, he was holding other people's lives up just because he hated his own. Besides, there was a mat under the bridge anyway so the man who pushed him probably knew he wasn't going to die.

It's not the time frame nor the protection underneath the bridge, it's the intent that disturbs me. A man in pain does not take into consideration anything else aside from his own problems. A person who knows of the safety restraints and yet still pushes the man over is a person who has no consideration for what the man is going through. It would have been more humane to talk the man from jumping and get him admitted to a hospital. What I find ironic is that so many people on this forum would be so consoling and considerate to someone who opens a thread saying they want to kill themselves. Yet here is a man whom was in conflict and all people do is laugh? Quite the double standard here.

Rai
23-05-09, 19:22
The man who was threatening to jump had his reasons, whether he was serious about jumping or not, he still needed help. It's not like he woke up and said to himself 'Oooh, I think I'll hold up the traffic for a laugh today'. Was he being an annoyance for the people being held up? Yes. Did he deserve to be pushed off the bridge and sustain injuries? No.

I'm actually quite shocked that some members here are saying 'if you're gonna do it, just get on with it'. Where's the compassion?

rowanlim
23-05-09, 19:30
It's nice to see that people are finding humor in a man's emotional trauma and another person's attempt to expedite his pain instead of helping him.

Yeah, right?

I'd be able to understand your point if this guy had only been up there for a 10 minutes or so, but he was up there for hours. As Siberian Tiger said, he was holding other people's lives up just because he hated his own. Besides, there was a mat under the bridge anyway so the man who pushed him probably knew he wasn't going to die.

I wouldn't push him even if I knew there was a mat under the bridge.

Explorer
23-05-09, 19:31
It's not the time frame nor the protection underneath the bridge, it's the intent that disturbs me. A man in pain does not take into consideration anything else aside from his own problems. A person who knows of the safety restraints and yet still pushes the man over is a person who has no consideration for what the man is going through. It would have been more humane to talk the man from jumping and get him admitted to a hospital. What I find ironic is that so many people on this forum would be so consoling and considerate to someone who opens a thread saying they want to kill themselves. Yet here is a man whom was in conflict and all people do is laugh? Quite the double standard here.

Agree 100%

I'm actually quite shocked that some members here are saying 'if you're gonna do it, just get on with it'. Where's the compassion?

Your not alone :(

Changeling
23-05-09, 19:31
I'm actually quite shocked that some members here are saying 'if you're gonna do it, just get on with it'. Where's the compassion?

Well why make a scene about it? We like our lives, we understand that you're going through problems, but please don't involve us and make a dramatic scene about it. If you need to talk, go to a Counsellor or Psychologist, or even go as far as admitting yourself to hospital. We're obviously going to get tired of it. We can only help so much.

I had a friend at one point who was partially suicidal... though I think sometimes she was just doing it for attention. She would say stuff about it and I would just get so tired of it that I'd be like, "Well there's a road with plenty of traffic right out there!" Yes, it sounds quite cruel and nasty, and I do somewhat regret thinking that, but honestly, I just snapped.

Mr.Burns
23-05-09, 19:34
Well why make a scene about it? We like our lives, we understand that you're going through problems, but please don't involve us and make a dramatic scene about it. If you need to talk, go to a Counsellor or Psychologist, or even go as far as admitting yourself to hospital. We're obviously going to get tired of it. We can only help so much.

I had a friend at one point who was partially suicidal... though I think sometimes she was just doing it for attention. She would say stuff about it and I would just get so tired of it that I'd be like, "Well there's a road with plenty of traffic right out there!" Yes, it sound quite cruel and nasty, and I do somewhat regret thinking that, but honestly, I just snapped.

Compassion is the ability to feel and see where someone in pain is coming from. You're not being very compassionate at the moment. Think from this guy's perspective, not your own. If you were in as much emotional trauma as him, you wouldn't care about anyone else. Pain at that level override's people's ability to think rationally.

Smog
23-05-09, 20:00
you were in as much emotional trauma as him, you wouldn't care about anyone else. Pain at that level override's people's ability to think rationally.

The guy who pushed him clearly reacted with a similar level of consideration. Maybe actually falling was the wake-up call he needed to snap him back to reality. After all, how long could he be expected to stay up there without someone physically doing something about it? I don't think you'd be so ethically immovable if he'd been holding up an ambulance or a fire engine on its way to a proper emergency. I'd be surprised if he's not charged with causing a public disturbance. Just because he's clearly mentally unhealthy doesn't mean that he has a get-out-of-jail-free card for being an idiot. I don't imagine many of us can identify with serial killers either, but their warped perspectives don't excuse their actions.

Elessar87
23-05-09, 20:09
I agree 100% with Mr. Burns and others who said that pushing the man was wrong. And I must say I am very shocked that people would say anything so insensitive as "if you're gonna kill yourself just do it already don't waste my oh-so-precious time with your problems". I know that being in traffic for 5 hours is annoying but that pales in comparison to being in so much emotional anguish you want to end your life. In 5 hours your discomfort will be over while that man will probably be in pain for God knows how long until he gets treatment and sorts out his life. Bottom line: we don't know the man that did this, so it's very unfair to say that he did it purely for attention. And it's just plain heartless to whine about your 5 hours in traffic while someone else is on the verge of ending his own life. Not everything in life revolves around you and what makes you happy. Try to remember that.

Mad Tony
23-05-09, 20:18
I agree 100% with Mr. Burns and others who said that pushing the man was wrong. And I must say I am very shocked that people would say anything so insensitive as "if you're gonna kill yourself just do it already don't waste my oh-so-precious time with your problems". I know that being in traffic for 5 hours is annoying but that pales in comparison to being in so much emotional anguish you want to end your life. In 5 hours your discomfort will be over while that man will probably be in pain for God knows how long until he gets treatment and sorts out his life. Bottom line: we don't know the man that did this, so it's very unfair to say that he did it purely for attention. And it's just plain heartless to whine about your 5 hours in traffic while someone else is on the verge of ending his own life. Not everything in life revolves around you and what makes you happy. Try to remember that.But Smog raised a good point. What if this man's antics had held up a firetruck or an ambulance?

voltz
23-05-09, 20:22
I wanted to take back what I said a page ago because I don't find anything funny in this at all. Things can happen to wreck a person's life and when it causes someone to break down, what happens is they're at the point where they don't know why they should be around anymore and obviously need help to snap out of it. When you see someone who's just waiting to jump, they're struggling to find a reason not to.

Pushing him off the bridge may have just reinforced his excuse for killing himself because that's just what he expected from society. It's going to take more to get him back on his feet now not just because of depression, but the trauma from what he just went through.

Changeling
23-05-09, 20:28
I know that I may sound heartless and horrible for saying that I found it funny, but it's not going to stop me because... well, I did find it darkly comical.

And Smog does raise a good point: what if that man was holding up a fire engine or an ambulance? That would mean that not only his life would be lost, but potentially other people's lives as well.

As humans, every single one of us has selfish desires of our own. I know that the entire world doesn't revolve around me, but the entire world doesn't revolve around the suicidal man either.

You just can't win. If you say that a news article is horrible and that the world is going awry, you get picked on for that. If you say that you don't care and find it funny, you get nagged at for that as well.

Elessar87
23-05-09, 20:29
Pushing him off the bridge may have just reinforced his excuse for killing himself because that's just what he expected from society. It's going to take more to get him back on his feet now not just because of depression, but the trauma from what he just went through.

Exactly. If a man is up there for 5 hours he obviously doesn't WANT to kill himself, and is searching for something to live for. And pushing him off just proves to him that the world really is cruel like he most likely already believes it is and makes is harder for him to heal. So calling the man who pushed him a "hero" is absurd because he actually did the jumper the worst damage yet by being so heartless. There is no way I find such a terrible act in the least bit amusing.

@changeling: it's true that he could have been holding up an ambulance and costing other peoples' lives, but at that moment he clearly wasn't in a healthy state of mind and was therefore not taking that into account. And of course the whole world shouldn't revolve around the suicidal man, but being so insensitive as to physically push him in order to "hurry him along" is unbelieveable. It's not amusing. It's a sad commentary on how truly selfish human beings can be and doesn't reflect well on the human race as a whole. If I were the man that pushed him I'd be ashamed of myself.

Siberian Tiger
23-05-09, 20:33
Threatening to jump from a bridge for five hours in full view of busy traffic vs. gun/rat poison/noose/oven/whatever else is private. Of course he wanted attention. Although that does not rule out the fact there is something wrong with him, because people who're suffering may cry for help (with such acts).

Guess I'm just not so understanding of people I don't know. The clarify, I don't agree with the man pushing him. Just daft.

Changeling
23-05-09, 20:34
Guess I'm just not so understanding of people I don't know.

Seems I'm like that as well.


@changeling: it's true that he could have been holding up an ambulance and costing other peoples' lives, but at that moment he clearly wasn't in a healthy state of mind and was therefore not taking that into account. And of course the whole world shouldn't revolve around the suicidal man, but being so insensitive as to physically push him in order to "hurry him along" is unbelieveable. It's not amusing. It's a sad commentary on how truly selfish human beings can be and doesn't reflect well on the human race as a whole. If I were the man that pushed him I'd be ashamed of myself.

But human beings are selfish, even me and you, so we can't really help it. I can understand how you would find it insensitive, but I must just not be looking at it from such a serious viewpoint.

But don't judge and say that I have no feelings or compassion towards another human, because I do, but for this news article, I'm not looking at it from a serious level.

Elessar87
23-05-09, 20:43
Guess I'm just not so understanding of people I don't know. The clarify, I don't agree with the man pushing him. Just daft.

Well, thank you for at least admitting it and not trying to justfy your initial reaction.

People who make public displays of their suicide attempts often don't have anyone in thier lives to talk to about how they feel and thus turn to society for help. This man wanted someone to tell him to not do it. He wanted something to live for and he needed someone to tell him what that was. No one in his life could do that, so he made a display of himself hoping that someone would step in and help him. He probably wasn't even conciously aware that this is what he was looking for, he just did what he did impulsively. I'm not saying it was the right thing to do, I'm just saying he didn't do it to purposely hold people up or God forbid to cause them any annoyance or ruin thier precious day.

The point I'm trying to get across is this: Don't judge people you don't know. And whatever you do DO NOT laugh at someone's suicide attempt. It ends up saying more about you than about the suicidal person anyway.

@Changeling: I'm not insinuating that you're a heartless person. I'm just saying that that reaction and your subsequent defense of your reaction was heartless. People are capable of being quite callous sometimes, I understand that. It doesn't make you a bad person. It's probably just human nature to a certain extent. I'm just asking you and the other people here who laughed to think before they just blurt out "lol, that's so funny". Try to put yourself in the other person's shoes before you judge/comment. I apologize if I offended you in any way. It was not my intent.

badboy70
23-05-09, 20:56
It's funny, but wrong too. :p

Tony9595
23-05-09, 21:12
What if somebody wanted to go to the bathroom, 5 hours... :eek:!!

Elessar87
23-05-09, 21:18
What if somebody wanted to go to the bathroom, 5 hours... :eek:!!

Seriously? Is that your biggest concern? I don't want to sound confrontational or anything but are you looking at the bigger picture at all? I think there are bigger issues here than whether or not somone on the bridge had to pee.

Reggie
23-05-09, 21:22
I think helping someone towards a needless death for any reason just sucks.

mau3genius
23-05-09, 21:46
Well, he pushed the guy to an emergency cushion, so probably he wasn't trying to kill him.
Anyway, If the guy really was so depressed he wanted to die, he would've done it in less than an hour. I'm not approving the old man's actions, but, I know several (and I mean a lot) of cases where people that seemed to be perfectly fine killed themselves just like that. Privately, and with little hesitation; no one finds out, no one helps them. He was certainly looking for attention, in my opinion.

Camera Obscura
23-05-09, 21:48
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/images/attachement/jpg/site1/20090523/0013729e44a40b8197a855.jpg

I bet he wouldn't have had such a smug face if the guy had truly died. :pi:

Joely-Moley
23-05-09, 22:05
Call me crazy, but I don't see any humour in this.

LaraCablara
23-05-09, 22:13
Seriously? Is that your biggest concern? I don't want to sound confrontational or anything but are you looking at the bigger picture at all? I think there are bigger issues here than whether or not somone on the bridge had to pee.

What if they had somewhere important to be? What if they had a loved one dying in a hospital and wanted to see them? What if they had extreme diarrhea and bought a new car just the other day?

Seriously, 5 hours. Waiting for a man to decide whether he wants to kill himself.

Elessar87
23-05-09, 22:29
What if they had somewhere important to be? What if they had a loved one dying in a hospital and wanted to see them? What if they had extreme diarrhea and bought a new car just the other day?

Seriously, 5 hours. Waiting for a man to decide whether he wants to kill himself.

Yeah I understand that 5 hours is a long time. I'm sure everyone on that bridge had somewhere important to be otherwise they wouldn't have been there. I'm not saying that what the man did was right. I was simply responding to the "omg, what if someone had to go potty?" comment. As for the larger issues you've just raised: you're right, there are x number of "what if" senarios we could raise here about the people trapped on the bridge. And holding up traffic for 5 hours is definately not a considerate thing to do. But as I've said before, I doubt the man thought it through that far before he did it. I'm just trying to explain the reasoning behind doing something like this. I think it should be noted that this issue is one that hits home for me as I had a friend whose ex-boyfriend (who we were both still friends with) killed himself without warning (he was one of those people who "just went ahead and did it" which some other people on this thread seem to think is somehow more admirable than seeking help) and personally I would much rather have seen him reach out for help in any way, even in an unhealthy way like in this senario, than have just kill himself. We all would have wanted any kind of warning so we could stop him and get him help. That's just the way I feel. I'm sorry those people on the bridge had to wait 5 hours. I'm sure it was very inconvenient for them. But I can honestly say that if it was me stuck on the bridge I'd just be happy he got help and didn't throw his life away. Yeah it would be annoying to be stuck there for 5 hours but if in the end a life is saved, 5 hours of my time is a small price to pay.

Origonal
23-05-09, 22:32
I bet he wouldn't have had such a smug face if the guy had truly died. :pi:


Wait...did he shove him aff the bridge? x

TRhalloween
23-05-09, 22:33
Wait...did he shove him aff the bridge? x

Yes but he landed on a safety thing.

Smog
23-05-09, 22:37
Yes but he landed on a safety thing.

Thus rendering this entire argument pointless.

Rai
23-05-09, 22:50
Yes but he landed on a safety thing.

Thus rendering this entire argument pointless.

A safety mat that was still only half inflated. The guy injured his back and elbow, something that wouldn't have happened had he had someone to talk to and the help he needed, so no, this argument is not pointless. People still have their opinions on what happened.

Mad Tony
23-05-09, 22:53
A safety mat that was still only half inflated. The guy injured his back and elbow, something that wouldn't have happened had he had someone to talk to and the help he needed, so no, this argument is not pointless. People still have their opinions on what happened.He did have people to talk to. People were trying to talk him out of it for 5 hours. The whole thing would not have happened had he not even got up on the bridge in the first place.

Elessar87
23-05-09, 22:57
A safety mat that was still only half inflated. The guy injured his back and elbow, something that wouldn't have happened had he had someone to talk to and the help he needed, so no, this argument is not pointless. People still have their opinions on what happened.

Agreed. Also, for me this is far less about the specifics of what happened and much more about peoples' reactions to it. I was fully expecting people to have much more compassion for the jumper than they have shown. And never in my wildest dreams did I ever expect people on this forum to either a) think it was funny of all things or b) tell him to "go kill yourself somewhere else" or "don't bother me with your problems". I thought we were all more caring than that since this seems in general like a very compassionate community. But it seems I was mistaken.

Super Badnik
23-05-09, 23:05
This whole incident has probably left the guy even more depressed and un-loved. Unless he was just seeking attention, if so he is probably just craped off.

Sir Croft
23-05-09, 23:06
Why people's first option when trying to suicide is jumping off a bridge, or building? This is so cliched.

Neteru
23-05-09, 23:08
Why people's first option when trying to suicide is jumping off a bridge, or building? This is so cliched.Because of course style is oh so important when you're going to kill yourself.

Tony9595
23-05-09, 23:13
Seriously? Is that your biggest concern? I don't want to sound confrontational or anything but are you looking at the bigger picture at all? I think there are bigger issues here than whether or not somone on the bridge had to pee.

That was just an example of how disturbing could be waiting hours, just because a person wanted to have some atention...

A simple example as the ones on this post ↓

What if they had somewhere important to be? What if they had a loved one dying in a hospital and wanted to see them? What if they had extreme diarrhea and bought a new car just the other day?

Seriously, 5 hours. Waiting for a man to decide whether he wants to kill himself.

If he wanted to kill himself, itŽs bad I know... but why do other people have to suffer because of what he is doing?

Elessar87
23-05-09, 23:14
Because of course style is oh so important when you're going to kill yourself.

Exactly! Why should it matter what particular way he chose to kill himself? The important issue here is that he's sucidal and therefore obviously full of pain. The means he chose is irrelevent.

Dia2blo
23-05-09, 23:16
I find it amazing to see how incredibly selfish some people can be. That poor man still suffered injuries from the fall, and not to mention how much worse he is going to be feeling now. I wouldn't be surprised if he was up on that bridge again as soon as he gets out of the hospital (if he can afford the bill).

That man was selfish enough to get out and push the guy off, just because he was held up in traffic? Have people no compassion? What is more serious- getting somewhere late or saving someones life? And i don't just mean letting their body survive, but helping them overcome a severe psychological breakdown!

Dark Lugia 2
23-05-09, 23:18
Yes but he landed on a safety thing.

... and damaged his spine. :/

I'm glad I'm not the only one who doesnt find this funny.

Elessar87
23-05-09, 23:20
I find it amazing to see how incredibly selfish some people can be. That poor man still suffered injuries from the fall, and not to mention how much worse he is going to be feeling now. I wouldn't be surprised if he was up on that bridge again as soon as he gets out of the hospital (if he can afford the bill).

That man was selfish enough to get out and push the guy off, just because he was held up in traffic? Have people no compassion? What is more serious- getting somewhere late or saving someones life? And i don't just mean letting their body survive, but helping them overcome a severe psychological breakdown!

Thank you! I whole heartedly agree.

@Tony9595: I'm getting tired of saying the same thing over and over, so I'd advise you to go back and read some of my eariler posts if you want so you can understand my POV on this issue.

Sir Croft
23-05-09, 23:22
Exactly! Why should it matter what particular way he chose to kill himself? The important issue here is that he's sucidal and therefore obviously full of pain. The means he chose is irrelevent.

Going for such a noticeable option is stupid, people who choose to kill themselves this way don't want to suicide, at least not most of them, they know people will try to save them, so then they feel they are important. Those who actually want to suicide do it quietly and quickly at home.

Mad Tony
23-05-09, 23:26
Going for such a noticeable option is stupid, people who choose to kill themselves this way don't want to suicide, at least not most of them, they know people will try to save them, so then they feel they are important. Those who actually want to suicide do it quietly and quickly at home.Exactly. :tmb: Whether he was going to really jump or not, I still don't see how him being suicidal gives him the excuse to hold people up for hours on end. What's worse is that he could've done more than just make a few people late for work, he could've stopped important vehicles (e.g. ambulances) getting through. Every action has a consequence, this guy is no exception.

Mr.Burns
23-05-09, 23:38
Going for such a noticeable option is stupid, people who choose to kill themselves this way don't want to suicide, at least not most of them, they know people will try to save them, so then they feel they are important. Those who actually want to suicide do it quietly and quickly at home.


this is of course provided that the person really does not have the intent to off themselves. If someone really does have the intent, then at home or in public matters not. We are not psychologists so none of us can truly know what goes on in the mind of every suicidal person. What we do know is that everyone is different and reacts differently. So it would be quite plausible to assume that everyone in an apparent suicidal state would react differently given that each person's life is unique and have unique experiences, thus unique stresses and reasons for being where they are. As such, given the "typical" means of suicide out there, some may not find the idea of pills, blowing their heads off with a shotgun, hanging or whatever else very appealing. Some want it quick, hence the shotgun or the hanging. Others might be afraid or unable to obtain a weapon so hanging, pills or jumping is easier for them. It could of course also be cultural. Perhaps to some, the idea of pills or a firearm is not very "honorable" but jumping or hanging is. People who choose a particular method of self termination have their reasons and it would be presumptuous to automatically assume that because someone chooses to jump, that they are merely seeking attention. Is it possible that this person was seeking attention? Sure. Perhaps he was hoping someone would talk him out of doing this, that there really is a better way than killing himself. We don't know his situation, nor the conflicts going on in his mind. But never make generalizations when dealing with something as layered and complex as the human mind.

TRhalloween
23-05-09, 23:39
A safety mat that was still only half inflated. The guy injured his back and elbow, something that wouldn't have happened had he had someone to talk to and the help he needed, so no, this argument is not pointless. People still have their opinions on what happened.

... and damaged his spine. :/

I'm glad I'm not the only one who doesnt find this funny.

I just want to point out that I was just explaining to Origonal how he fell. I'm not taking any sides.

Elessar87
23-05-09, 23:41
Going for such a noticeable option is stupid, people who choose to kill themselves this way don't want to suicide, at least not most of them, they know people will try to save them, so then they feel they are important. Those who actually want to suicide do it quietly and quickly at home.

No he didn't really want to die which is why he went with such a public option rather than a private one. He was clearly crying out for help. And is that so wrong? Do you really think its somehow more "noble" to kill yourself rather than reach out for help? Because I can tell you right now its not. It takes alot more courage to admit you are suicidal and seek help than to go home and do it "quickly and quietly".

As for the endless number of "what if" senarios, I've already addressed them and will no longer discuss them. Read my previous posts to understand how I feel about them, if you are so inclined. If you aren't there's really nothing I can do. Sometimes people don't understand things because they don't want to. If you are hell bent on thinking that the jumper was wrong and therefore deserves no compassion then fine. Go ahead and think that. Just be aware that in life we are often held to same standard to which we hold others. It's unfair to expect others to suffer in silence while you go about your merry way. I just hope if ever you need someone to care about you in life you get more compassion from them than you are showing this man right now.

This is my last post on the topic. I leave it to others to defend common sense and compassion, if they are inclined to do so.

EDIT: @ Mr. Burns: I couldn't agree more. As Lara would say, you're my new favorite person. :)

spikejones
23-05-09, 23:51
I'd be able to understand your point if this guy had only been up there for a 10 minutes or so, but he was up there for hours. As Siberian Tiger said, he was holding other people's lives up just because he hated his own. Besides, there was a mat under the bridge anyway so the man who pushed him probably knew he wasn't going to die.

really? do you believe the only way to get from point A to point B is via that bridge? people have a choice to sit and watch what unfolds, or they can turn around and go another way. no one is ever forced to sit there and be held up by some guy at the top of a bridge. :rolleyes: sure.. its a slight inconvenience, but it sure the hell beats sitting there for 5 hours if you really don't want to be there. I think those people wanted to sit there in suspense to see if the guy was going to jump or not. How else do you explain how crowds gather around a skyscraper in New York City everytime some guy stands at the top and threatens to jump. These people practically go out of there way to get in on the drama. They're not being held up in the least bit.

Rai
23-05-09, 23:52
Going for such a noticeable option is stupid, people who choose to kill themselves this way don't want to suicide, at least not most of them, they know people will try to save them, so then they feel they are important. Those who actually want to suicide do it quietly and quickly at home.

Do you really think he was thinking rationally at this point? He was [probably] in no frame of mind to be thinking of others. The emotional pain he was going through was greater than anything else. It may seem inconsiderate to you or others here, but people who want to end their lives or are even thinking about it aren't thinking 'oh dear, better think how this effects others'. He wasn't necessarily thinking of any inconvenience he may cause or even doing it 'just for the attention'. People who do these sorts of things are in very dark places, where rational thinking doesn't come into it. Maybe he wasn't really intending to jump, but he acted out of desperation. As has been said, he was there for 5 hours needing to be talked out of it, he needed to have a reason not to do it and to live.

Of course, we can only speculate what this poor man was going through and thinking, but that applies to both sides of this discussion. Who are we to decide what is the right way to commit suicide or even if this man was serious about it? He probably did at the time think that was the only way out of his troubles, but thinking and doing are two different things. Once on that bridge, he may have been scared witless, too scared to move from his spot. We don't know, maybe he was on the verge of changing his mind? Then what happens? An impatient traveller decides to push him.

Yes, others were inconvenienced and it could have resulted in something worse. There are so many what ifs. What if he'd gone through with the suicide?

TRHalloween, I realise that, I quoted you to make my point easier. I was elaborating, is all.

Mad Tony
24-05-09, 00:00
really? do you believe the only way to get from point A to point B is via that bridge? people have a choice to sit and watch what unfolds, or they can turn around and go another way. no one is ever forced to sit there and be held up by some guy at the top of a bridge. :rolleyes: sure.. its a slight inconvenience, but it sure the hell beats sitting there for 5 hours if you really don't want to be there. I think those people wanted to sit there in suspense to see if the guy was going to jump or not. How else do you explain how crowds gather around a skyscraper in New York City everytime some guy stands at the top and threatens to jump. These people practically go out of there way to get in on the drama. They're not being held up in the least bit.I hate to keep using this example, but not many people seem to be taking note of it. What if an ambulance or a fire truck was delayed because of it? 5 or 10 minutes can be the difference between life and death for somebody who is in need of urgent medical help. Or what about the police that tried to coax him down? They could've been dealing with actual crimes. The fact is that this guys little stunt put other people's lives at risk, therefore I don't have much sympathy for him.

I'm not being insensitive or cruel here, I'm just looking at the bigger picture and how other people's lives were put at risk as a result of this.

spikejones
24-05-09, 00:10
ambulances and police cars etc. can do the very same thing any other person can do -- take another route. furthermore, dispatchers can relay instructions via radios in the emergency vehicles to keep the drivers informed of the locations of traffic jams and such. Not to mention the fact that the drivers just so happen to listen to the radio all day long and basically know what is going on where. They wouldn't have been trying to take that route in the first place. Not unless they were then when the guy first started climbing and it hadn't been called in yet. In that case - guess what? they are the first responders. I know you keep arguing that you aren't bein insensitive to the guy, however you very clearly are placing his needs at a lower level than any other person that may or may not be about to die. Whether it is needless death at the persons own hands or at the hands of another, do not all potential "cide" victims deserve equal chance?

Rai
24-05-09, 00:11
The chances are, any ambulance on that bridge would have other options as soon as they realised there was a hold up, even if they didn't know why that was. They could have radioed back to the base or tried to get out of the traffic. If there was already a patient in the back, then the situation is more difficult, but I'm sure they could have handled the situation professionally. The police on the scene were there to help. This case was no less important than any other. The police are trained for all kinds of emergencies and to help people. The what ifs and maybes are speculation. I'm pretty certain if there were any incidents similar to those what ifs, they would have been reported.

Edit: spikejones said it better than me.

Mad Tony
24-05-09, 00:14
I'm not placing his needs at a lower level than any other person. However, because of his actions, other people's lives were put at risk. Take the police for example. Because they were there trying to get him to come down, there would've been less police officers available to go and help other people who had gotten themselves into life or death situations against their own will.

@Rai: That's not the point. When it comes to the emergency services, every second is vital.

spikejones
24-05-09, 00:29
well you have to think about it. the police force consists of more than just the two pictured there. maybe there were 10 at most on the scene. and that is quoting high to be honest with you. And there was how many ambulances there do you think? 1 is all that's needed here. And the cherry picker bucket truck. Perhaps one fire truck. You seem to think that makes a major dent in their force. The force is much much larger than that. And there is more than just one station. There many many substations scattered across the city for the purposes of rapid response time. They're not sending 10 guys 20 miles for something. That would be ridiculous and time consuming when there are more guys who can get there much faster. And how many murder victims have you heard of that managed to call the police and say "help... I'm about to get shot!!" Not many I'd say. Usually a witness will call that in after the fact. So basically the way I see it, a murder victims chances are slim as it is already since there isn't much prevention there. No one is gonna sit there patiently waiting to kill you while you ring up the police. So.. basically speaking, its already an after the fact response most of the time. But there's plenty of other officers and ambulances on duty that can respond anywhere at any time with maximum efficiency.

Changeling
24-05-09, 00:34
My, my, my, what a thread this has become.

The only reason that I'm saying he could've done the suicide attempt in a less public place is because of experience with it. Having a suicidal person go up to you every day and complain about their life and keep saying that they want to kill themselves isn't fun. You try to help, but they don't listen. What I'm saying is, if people had tried to convince the man to stop the suicide for five hours and he hadn't listened to them or found any quality in life because people did care about him, then why didn't he just jump? Someone said earlier that he may have been looking for someone to say to him that there is more to life and that he doesn't have to do this and to show their compassion towards the man, and in that he wouldn't actually commit suicide, he was just looking for an excuse not to jump. People were doing that, but he didn't seem to be listening.

And what if the man had jumped? What difference would it have made? He would still have survived and landed on the partially inflated safety mat at the bottom, and probably would've sustained the same injuries as he has done now. That could well show him that not all suicide attempts go according to plan and that they can land you with a disability or something similar for the rest of your life.

trXD
24-05-09, 00:35
Going for such a noticeable option is stupid, people who choose to kill themselves this way don't want to suicide, at least not most of them, they know people will try to save them, so then they feel they are important. Those who actually want to suicide do it quietly and quickly at home.

Wow that's a very insensitive thing to say.

People who does this want to create some big scene as they go but are still slightly wondering if killing themselves is right.

Rai
24-05-09, 00:44
However, because of his actions, other people's lives were put at risk

You state that as if it were fact. Were there any incidents reported where someone's life was put at risk or lost as a direct result of this one man's actions?

As spkiejones pointed out, the actual number of police and other emergency services at the scene were probably minimal compared to actual numbers available to cover emergencies in other areas. This case wasn't any less important. This man was injured, he needed medical attention. The police were there for his safety and that of others.

I understand where you are coming from, but your arguments are based mostly on speculation. This man wasn't intentionally holding the traffic up. He was acting out of desperation.

spikejones
24-05-09, 00:47
Changeling: you think that just because you knew one depressed person who talked about their misery to you a lot and stated they wish they were dead at their own hands - that you know what really went on their head, or the heads of every person who contemplates suicide? Most likely you were not able to help this friend of yours because you were not compassionate and understanding enough of them, yet resigned yourself to telling them they should throw themself in front of traffic. How, my dear, would you feel if someone told you to jump off a bridge when you came home upset about something that really bothered you? Now.. had the guy "just gone ahead and done it" as so many people have said in here - and which you seem to be getting at a bit in your post, he would not have landed on a safety mat. It wouldn't have been in place yet. That is something the emergency services brought as a last resort in the event they were not able to coax him down from his precipice.

I understand where you are coming from, but your arguments are based mostly on speculation.
not only that, but are mostly echoes of other ideas presented by other members. (ie.. "held up for 5 hours!" and "what if there was another emergency?")

Changeling
24-05-09, 00:52
I'll have you know spike, that I dealt with that friend for a long time and tried to help them in every way possible. But did they listen? No. I was being as compassionate as I could be and tried to understand them, but do you realise how hard it is when they shove you away the whole time and say that you're too annoying and that you should stop helping them? If they're coming up to me and complaining about how much they want to commit suicide, yet they don't want me to help them because it's too annoying, then what are they expecting me to do? Wish them luck?

And I only speak of experience as to how irritating a situation similar to that can be.

EDIT:
If I was coming home upset for over two years and complaining about how much I hate my life, then off course I'd be expecting someone to snap and say that to me.

Draco
24-05-09, 00:52
The man who was threatening to jump had his reasons, whether he was serious about jumping or not, he still needed help. It's not like he woke up and said to himself 'Oooh, I think I'll hold up the traffic for a laugh today'. Was he being an annoyance for the people being held up? Yes. Did he deserve to be pushed off the bridge and sustain injuries? No.

I'm actually quite shocked that some members here are saying 'if you're gonna do it, just get on with it'. Where's the compassion?

The man was an attention whore wasting everyone else's time, what kind of compassion would you expect?

Rai
24-05-09, 01:03
Dear god, Draco, do you really think that of that man? Have you actually read any of the other posts at all. What are you basing that assumption on? I'm too tired to discuss this further, but right now, I'm glad to be me.

Changeling. I realise how frustrating it must have been for you to be in that situation with a suicidal friend who wouldn't listen. But do you realise that perhaps your friend just wasn't thinking rationally? Someone who is in such a dark place emotionally may only realise they need help when it is too late, sadly. They may even know they have a problem with depression but their thoughts and feelings are so covered in darkness that they can't see they are getting it or appreciate it. I dunno, maybe your friend was just seeking attention, but you're only seeing it from your point of view.

spikejones
24-05-09, 01:13
I'll have you know spike, that I dealt with that friend for a long time and tried to help them in every way possible. But did they listen? No. I was being as compassionate as I could be and tried to understand them, but do you realise how hard it is when they shove you away the whole time and say that you're too annoying and that you should stop helping them? If they're coming up to me and complaining about how much they want to commit suicide, yet they don't want me to help them because it's too annoying, then what are they expecting me to do? Wish them luck?

And I only speak of experience as to how irritating a situation similar to that can be.

EDIT:
If I was coming home upset for over two years and complaining about how much I hate my life, then off course I'd be expecting someone to snap and say that to me.
I wont profess to know what you did in your dealings with the person, but did you make a pity case of them and baby them? That can be annoying. We have only to look at the most recent pity case you threw up and its reception by the person. Or were you genuinely trying to help the person? Even then though, and it should come as no surprise to you - people just don't like to hear what it is that they need to hear. They don't like to hear the truth. People would rather be lied to and have things sugar coated than to hear the harsh truth about themselves. At any rate, your best option there is to simply be there friend and not to come across as overbearing. If its not within your power to fix, there isn't much you can do. If youre not a doctor or a psychologist, there's really no way you can help a suicidal person except to simply be their friend in order to shine some light in their otherwise depressing life.
The man was an attention whore wasting everyone else's time, what kind of compassion would you expect?

perhaps you feel he is an attention whore holding everyone up because you choose somehow to give him attention and to point at him as the one who is holding people up. The fact of the matter is that he is doing nothing of the sort. Its the police that cordoned off the area preventing traffic from progressing forward. Why not blame them for the hold up? Why not blame the people parked behind you for holding you up? Why can't those pesky *******s just back up so you can turn around? There's plenty of people who could be blamed in part for this whole "hold up" but everyone chooses to blame the guy who's life hangs in the balance. why is that?

Draco
24-05-09, 01:34
Because he is the one who created a situation. None of the other actions would have happened without him.

My pragmatism tends to take over when dealing with that level of absurd behaviour.

If the man wants to die so bad, what the hell is he waiting for?

amiro1989
24-05-09, 01:39
The 66-year-old Lai Jiansheng, salutes to the passers-by after pushing Chen Fuchao who threatenes to kill himself off the bridge on Thursday, May 21, 2009
He's the one who should have fell....

spikejones
24-05-09, 02:01
Because he is the one who created a situation. None of the other actions would have happened without him.

My pragmatism tends to take over when dealing with that level of absurd behaviour.

If the man wants to die so bad, what the hell is he waiting for?

as has been pointed out - he most likely did NOT want to die. depressed people may contemplate it a lot but of those many contemplations, how many times do they actually do it? Once only if they succeed. And you seem to be implying that its all his fault - every bit of it - even the event that caused his depression. It most likely wasn't. If you want to blame root causes of things, you need to look further than simply the act of a guy climbing on a bridge. None of his actions on that day would have happened had the event that triggered his suicidal contemplation occurred. So why not look at that? From what it appears to me, your view of the big picture is being blinded in some manner - be it your own preconceived notion of suicidal peoples' problems being only of their own doing, or be it that you are merely going with the flock. Either way, its a bit shortsighted to just jump up and say "its his fault it all happened".

t. A. T. u.
24-05-09, 02:35
Ironic :p

TR love
24-05-09, 02:47
Wow, what a heartless man

scoopy_loopy
24-05-09, 04:28
:vlol:

That is awesome.

Draco
24-05-09, 04:28
as has been pointed out - he most likely did NOT want to die. depressed people may contemplate it a lot but of those many contemplations, how many times do they actually do it? Once only if they succeed. And you seem to be implying that its all his fault - every bit of it - even the event that caused his depression. It most likely wasn't. If you want to blame root causes of things, you need to look further than simply the act of a guy climbing on a bridge. None of his actions on that day would have happened had the event that triggered his suicidal contemplation occurred. So why not look at that? From what it appears to me, your view of the big picture is being blinded in some manner - be it your own preconceived notion of suicidal peoples' problems being only of their own doing, or be it that you are merely going with the flock. Either way, its a bit shortsighted to just jump up and say "its his fault it all happened".

I have just as many reasons to be depressed/overly dramatic/suicidal as anyone else, hell I have more in many cases. Yet I'm not.

So pardon me for not being the pillar of empathy when it comes to those who are.

scoopy_loopy
24-05-09, 04:35
as has been pointed out - he most likely did NOT want to die. depressed people may contemplate it a lot but of those many contemplations, how many times do they actually do it? Once only if they succeed. And you seem to be implying that its all his fault - every bit of it - even the event that caused his depression. It most likely wasn't. If you want to blame root causes of things, you need to look further than simply the act of a guy climbing on a bridge. None of his actions on that day would have happened had the event that triggered his suicidal contemplation occurred. So why not look at that? From what it appears to me, your view of the big picture is being blinded in some manner - be it your own preconceived notion of suicidal peoples' problems being only of their own doing, or be it that you are merely going with the flock. Either way, its a bit shortsighted to just jump up and say "its his fault it all happened".

God, we finally get some good news on TRF's and people have go and make it as doomy and gloomy as all the other news threads. Typical :tea:


And the other guy didnt die.... maybe he'll now have a great fear of heights and never have to nerve to attempt suicide in this manner ever again :D

AmericanAssassin
24-05-09, 05:10
Smart guy. Got traffic moving. :)

Tear
24-05-09, 05:43
Oh wow, I shouldn't laugh but the situation is pretty funny.:o

Qualopek
24-05-09, 05:46
If I were in that situation, I'd probably get ****ed after 5 hours of waiting there. I wouldn't go to such extremes as actually pushing him off, but I'd probably be ranting my ass off to him about why he shouldn't jump. Perhaps the old man just had a dark sense of humor?

And yes, as horrible as the situation was, I found it somewhat funny and odd too.

LaraLuvrrr
24-05-09, 07:00
This is funny :D

innocentvenus
24-05-09, 08:05
I was horrfied when I found out about this, because the one who told me left out the fact the man did not die. So it's good he's alive.

Now as to the matter of the man who pushed him, it seems pretty messed up. It was five hours, and the man did land on the mat, but damn...I don't know how he could have done it. I mean, I would be ****ed if I had to sit there for five hours because someone wanted to kill themself.

However, I put the suicidal man at fault as well. Life is precious and all, but holding up traffic (which I agree could have holded up real emergencies). I do wonder if he was willing to kill himself in the first place. Most serious people would have done it right away. If there were other emergancies, then no, one man thinking about killing himself is not worth it. But if not, then trying to save his was good.

Mad Tony
24-05-09, 11:35
You state that as if it were fact. Were there any incidents reported where someone's life was put at risk or lost as a direct result of this one man's actions?

As spkiejones pointed out, the actual number of police and other emergency services at the scene were probably minimal compared to actual numbers available to cover emergencies in other areas. This case wasn't any less important. This man was injured, he needed medical attention. The police were there for his safety and that of others.

I understand where you are coming from, but your arguments are based mostly on speculation. This man wasn't intentionally holding the traffic up. He was acting out of desperation.It is fact. He did put lives at risk. I never said anybody's life was lost a result of this though, and that's what you seem to think I was implying.

This man obviously caused considerable disruption on a busy bridge. This put's people's lives at risk. Yes, there are loads more emergency personnel on hand in other locations, but what's to say that an ambulance on the way to a patient who'd just had a heart attack wasn't delayed by 5 minutes? When it comes to heart attacks, 5 minutes can make all the difference. I know because my grandfather recently suffered a heart attack and would not have survived had it not been for the speediness of the paramedics. Had the ambulance got there just a few minutes later due to a delay like this one, there's a pretty good chance he would've died.

Rai
24-05-09, 12:32
I see your point, I really do, but you're still looking at this from a what if scenario and putting the blame for the disruption entirely on the man with such severe emotional problems at the time that he wasn't thinking rationally. Would it really have been better had he jumped straight away before the emergency services got there, before the safety mat was in place? A life would most probably have been lost. It was the emergency services professionals to prevent that from happening once they got there.

Let's look at those lost 5 hours for a minute. A man goes to the bridge with the intent on jumping, but he's in emotional turmoil so can't jump right away. Some one sees him and calls the emergency services. They arrive and assess the situation. The bridge is cordoned off or whatever. Why was it that 5 hours were allowed to pass before some irate traveller acted? Why wasn't someone up there with him already, trying to talk him out of jumping? Perhaps there was someone yelling up at him, I don't know, but it wasn't working was it? I'm just suggesting that perhaps the hold up wasn't entirely this man's fault. I'm not pushing the blame on the emergency services either, I'm sure those that were there were trying their best to handle the situation. You have to look at the bigger picture. It's not as if the man was sat in the middle of the road, refusing to move. He was on the bridge contemplating whether he wanted to live or not.

I'm sorry about your grandfather and pleased that he survived thanks to the speedy actions of the paramedics.

tombraiderluka
24-05-09, 12:46
Eh, this guy should go to jail :confused: What is amusing here??

TRhalloween
24-05-09, 12:52
Eh, this guy should go to jail :confused: What is amusing here??

Maybe the guy who fell should go to jail. He was holding up the traffic. Is that even legal?

January_Snow*
24-05-09, 12:59
Gosh, I hate those people, they are just attention seekers...standing on a bridge for 5 hours thretening to kill himself....moron...

tombraiderluka
24-05-09, 13:01
Maybe the guy who fell should go to jail. He was holding up the traffic. Is that even legal?
Everyone should go to jail :p

Mad Tony
24-05-09, 13:07
I see your point, I really do, but you're still looking at this from a what if scenario and putting the blame for the disruption entirely on the man with such severe emotional problems at the time that he wasn't thinking rationally. Would it really have been better had he jumped straight away before the emergency services got there, before the safety mat was in place? A life would most probably have been lost. It was the emergency services professionals to prevent that from happening once they got there.

Let's look at those lost 5 hours for a minute. A man goes to the bridge with the intent on jumping, but he's in emotional turmoil so can't jump right away. Some one sees him and calls the emergency services. They arrive and assess the situation. The bridge is cordoned off or whatever. Why was it that 5 hours were allowed to pass before some irate traveller acted? Why wasn't someone up there with him already, trying to talk him out of jumping? Perhaps there was someone yelling up at him, I don't know, but it wasn't working was it? I'm just suggesting that perhaps the hold up wasn't entirely this man's fault. I'm not pushing the blame on the emergency services either, I'm sure those that were there were trying their best to handle the situation. You have to look at the bigger picture. It's not as if the man was sat in the middle of the road, refusing to move. He was on the bridge contemplating whether he wanted to live or not.

I'm sorry about your grandfather and pleased that he survived thanks to the speedy actions of the paramedics.According to the story, people were trying to talk him down. Obviously, they'd been doing that for quite some time and were unsuccessful.

Draco
24-05-09, 15:27
I see your point, I really do, but you're still looking at this from a what if scenario and putting the blame for the disruption entirely on the man with such severe emotional problems at the time that he wasn't thinking rationally. Would it really have been better had he jumped straight away before the emergency services got there, before the safety mat was in place? A life would most probably have been lost. It was the emergency services professionals to prevent that from happening once they got there.

Let's look at those lost 5 hours for a minute. A man goes to the bridge with the intent on jumping, but he's in emotional turmoil so can't jump right away. Some one sees him and calls the emergency services. They arrive and assess the situation. The bridge is cordoned off or whatever. Why was it that 5 hours were allowed to pass before some irate traveller acted? Why wasn't someone up there with him already, trying to talk him out of jumping? Perhaps there was someone yelling up at him, I don't know, but it wasn't working was it? I'm just suggesting that perhaps the hold up wasn't entirely this man's fault. I'm not pushing the blame on the emergency services either, I'm sure those that were there were trying their best to handle the situation. You have to look at the bigger picture. It's not as if the man was sat in the middle of the road, refusing to move. He was on the bridge contemplating whether he wanted to live or not.

I'm sorry about your grandfather and pleased that he survived thanks to the speedy actions of the paramedics.

Something had to happen eventually, the man was clearly not going to get down on his own whether from jumping or not.

IceColdLaraCroft
24-05-09, 15:31
:vlol: I saw this on Bloomberg and i LMAO