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God Horus
19-08-09, 04:07
Hey guys :wve:

Well I have some questions, sort of a survey for you all and I hope you can help me out :) I will definitely be taking all of your responses into consideration!

Now before I ask questions, I just want to say that I have seen shooter levels are quite unsuccesful in the level editor world, and I am just trying to see, if there can be a good shooter level and what others want in it. I am not including Cain's levels at all in this (no joke intended)

1. Do you enjoy playing shooter themed levels? Why or why not, what do you and do you not enjoy about them?

2. Do you think shooters are not made for LE?

3. What would you like to see in a good shooter level, or can there even be a "good shooter" in the LE world?

And by a shooter level, I mean a level which revolves heavily around fighting more than it does anything else. The reason I have decided to conduct this survey is because shooter themed levels are rarely made and they are very unsuccesful for the most part... Thanks everyone! :D

Tombraider95
19-08-09, 09:52
Hey guys :wve:

Well I have some questions, sort of a survey for you all and I hope you can help me out :) I will definitely be taking all of your responses into consideration!

Now before I ask questions, I just want to say that I have seen shooter levels are quite unsuccesful in the level editor world, and I am just trying to see, if there can be a good shooter level and what others want in it. I am not including Cain's levels at all in this (no joke intended)

1. Do you enjoy playing shooter themed levels? Why or why not, what do you and do you not enjoy about them?

2. Do you think shooters are not made for LE?

3. What would you like to see in a good shooter level, or can there even be a "good shooter" in the LE world?

And by a shooter level, I mean a level which revolves heavily around fighting more than it does anything else. The reason I have decided to conduct this survey is because shooter themed levels are rarely made and they are very unsuccesful for the most part... Thanks everyone! :D

1. Yh, they can be fun But annoying Whens Theres Too Much :)

2. Yes.

3. Different Weapons, and Moves to do on the enimeys :D

Hope This Helped :o

snork
19-08-09, 10:02
1) I think with some experience and with the auto-aim the pistol-killable enemies do not pose a real threat to me as a player, unless they are set up special (narrow high ledges, spikes or fires around, something in the way that should NOT be shot at, etc.) - or maybe also if there are no medipacks in the game.

So if it is constantly "just shoot a zillion enemies" it get's boring for me. The more harmless the enemies / surroundings, the worse.
And if with every opened door / around every corner some enemies come rushing, the surprise get's lost.

Moreover, I find the constant bang bang bang from the pistols too loud, compared with the other sounds. I want the other sounds to be "normal" so turning down the overall sounds volume is not the best option for me. I do it though when I know a big fighting sequence is coming. (having died the first time :o )
And it is annoying for my neighbours, late evening I have to go headphones. :D (rather "clairaudient" old house I live in.)

I rarely use explosive ammo, but if I get bored by more and more meaningless enemies coming, I may use them.

2) I think fans of FP shooters can never be satisfied with trle shooters.

3) However, if in a multilevel adventure, if there are more shooter parts / levels included, I agree. I'm all for change and pluralism.
I also like the stealth-mixed approach - when you can find ways of attacking them without open fight in the plain. Makes more sense with scarce medipacks.

Playing ASL Madstreet with an exe that leaves dead enemies lying around is quite hilarious though. :D

I wonder why almost noone makes use of flash grenades. When you have only pistols or very limited special weapons, but flash grenades (and no other grenades), it makes some different fighting.
(ego's in London / Underground has this, 4 ninjas in a room)

Also surroundings that when you go multiple backflip+shoot, I think having architecture / objects so that the camera seems to go more wild than usual makes it more lively or interesting. (eRIC's Babylon Will Fall comes to mind)

Cain
19-08-09, 14:11
i think youl find alot of people realy like shooters, like mine, there are very good, try out "cain castle in the dark" its reeeeeeeeealy good and very populer, if u like shooters download it nowwwwwwwww

cain
cain
cain
cain
cain:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

TRLEChippers
19-08-09, 14:25
1. I don't really enjoy playing shooter levels with thousands of gunmen shooting at you, but for ones with the right amount of enemies it's ok.

2. In my opinion shooters are not made for the LE as games made with the LE should usually be about exploration, puzzles and a bit of shooting. Also it is impossible (I think) to get a FPS-style view.

3. A good TRLE shooter level should include enemies- but not too many. Also varied weapons, a few puzzles and a bit of exploration maybe to find hidden pickups like new guns or puzzle pieces. And of course, varied enemies and locations.

Kapu
19-08-09, 16:38
1. Do you enjoy playing shooter themed levels? Why or why not, what do you and do you not enjoy about them?

Absolutely not. I hate playing LE games that are entirely combat based, because they end up dragging on and on and they're very boring. Tomb Raider combat is just way too simple to make an entire game based around it.

2. Do you think shooters are not made for LE?

Well, I doubt the authors have intended to create a shooter game, but considering the obnoxious amount of combat and total lack of any other kind of gameplay, then I would say no. Shooters are made for the TRLE.

3. What would you like to see in a good shooter level, or can there even be a "good shooter" in the LE world?

I would like to see more gameplay in shooter levels. Some defensive moves, maybe some hand-to-hand combat. Something that's more than firing and doing sideways somersaults. Is this possible? I think it might be. I've been looking into hand to hand combat a lot lately, and I think it could happen. It would be a lot of work, but would the new gameplay be worth it? Completely.

KurtisandLara
19-08-09, 17:13
1. Do you enjoy playing shooter themed levels? Why or why not, what do you and do you not enjoy about them?

Absolutely not. I hate playing LE games that are entirely combat based, because they end up dragging on and on and they're very boring. Tomb Raider combat is just way too simple to make an entire game based around it.

2. Do you think shooters are not made for LE?

Well, I doubt the authors have intended to create a shooter game, but considering the obnoxious amount of combat and total lack of any other kind of gameplay, then I would say no. Shooters are made for the TRLE.

3. What would you like to see in a good shooter level, or can there even be a "good shooter" in the LE world?

I would like to see more gameplay in shooter levels. Some defensive moves, maybe some hand-to-hand combat. Something that's more than firing and doing sideways somersaults. Is this possible? I think it might be. I've been looking into hand to hand combat a lot lately, and I think it could happen. It would be a lot of work, but would the new gameplay be worth it? Completely.

Took the words right out of my mouth :tmb:

Explorer
19-08-09, 17:30
1. Not really. I'm not a fan of shoot em ups i.e games that center on heavy fighting, so solving puzzles, evading traps etc are more attractive elements :)

2. Not necessarily, I'm not sure whether shooters are suited or not suited for custom levels in themselves, but with regard to my personal preference as stated above - I would say no.

3. Possibly. Can't really say much on that ...

trlestew
19-08-09, 18:34
1. No, they often revolve around alot of enemies and poor combat (not the authors fault with the combat part) also its very easy to die.

2. Yes, the enemy AI is dumb and the combat stale. The trle engine wasnt made for shooters at all.

3. Unless theres a new patch or some very smart modders i'll like to see hand to hand combat. Smarter enemy AI. Evasive action and ways to flee or take cover instead of spamming medipacks, and a gun\ammo system like AOD. But I doubt that would happen.

Spikey
19-08-09, 18:50
1. So far, no. Combat is and always has been the weak point of TR, and having a level with little else to make up for it usually isn't going to be too appealing.

2. Considering what we all know from experience, no, the LE isn't made for shooters at all. That doesn't mean they can't be any good though with a little experimentation:

3. Despite what has been released in regards to Shooter levels so far, I'm pretty sure that it is still possible to create a decent level with a bit of hard work. With the patching capabilities nowadays, populating a level with a number of shatterable, collapsible and explosive objects with which to take out enemies would make things a lot more interesting. Considering how bland the combat system is in TR as a whole, making more interactive environments (and perhaps loading Lara with a bunch of fast and powerful weapons) would go a long way in making combat more hectic and enjoyable.

Obviously, deeper AI and a full cover system would be a great step forward, but until that's possible then the above is probably the only recommendable way of making a decent Shooter level for now.