View Full Version : Natla is a dumb broad.
Natla sends the one woman who can "stamp out Bigfoot" to find a PIECE of the Scion, which would undoubtedly generate interest in Lara as to where the other pieces are, and cause her to go find them.
If Natla was so powerful/smart/hot/etc. why didn't she just find the whole Scion herself? She could fly past any traps, shoot fireballs at any villain, and make light of the whole thing.
Her plan would have succeeded. Obviously, she wasn't so smart.
Initially Natla had some plans about Lara, that's it. Otherwise there wasn't TR series
Maybe she was just lazy :p
Sgt BOMBULOUS
31-10-09, 10:01
Palace Midas wasn't covered in her insurance... Tough breaks.
LightningRider
31-10-09, 10:23
Maybe she feared the power of Tihocan and Qualopec, and decided to send someone to do it for her, just in case? :tea:
Dennis's Mom
31-10-09, 13:52
Clearly Natla didn't read the "Evil Overlord List." (http://www.eviloverlord.com/lists/overlord.html)
Super Badnik
31-10-09, 16:46
Clearly Natla didn't read the "Evil Overlord List." (http://www.eviloverlord.com/lists/overlord.html)Ha, obviously she didn't. :p
LightningRider
31-10-09, 17:25
Clearly Natla didn't read the "Evil Overlord List." (http://www.eviloverlord.com/lists/overlord.html)
She's been gone a few years, it happens to any old person. :p
Hmm. While Anniversary buggered up everything else about TR1, I suppose it did solve this plot hole: Natla's "OMFG WE CAN ROOLZ TOGEVUH LULZZ!!!!!" speech explains it. ;)
I think she only offered Lara that position because she feared Lara would kill her otherwise. Which she did.
Furthermore, the plot hole became bigger in TRA because Lara should have been the LAST person to hire to get the Scion. She was incredibly obsessed with it because it was a clue as to what happened to her mother. No wonder Lara went after Natla.
Changeling
02-11-09, 10:17
Natla was probably afraid of what might happen if she went for the pieces of the Scion herself: Tihocan and Qualopec ruled over separate countries to protect the Scion from Natla. For all we know, they could've used some strange Atlantean field which blocked Natla from getting the pieces of Scion so she needed to get other people to do it for her. I think the hiring of different people was a sort of "survival-of-the-fittest" sort of thing: whoever could find the location of the Scion first was the one whom Natla sent to get it.
Still, giving Lara directions to the thing she's obsessed with, and expecting her to give it to Natla was not a good idea at all.
Changeling
02-11-09, 13:20
Still, giving Lara directions to the thing she's obsessed with, and expecting her to give it to Natla was not a good idea at all.
When did it become apparant that Lara was obsessed with the Scion? In TRA yes, but not in TR1. She was in it for the sport, remember?
... and TRA was what I was talking about.
Changeling
03-11-09, 18:56
^ Oh sorry, I thought you were talking about TR1. :p My bad.
Natla enjoys playing with humans. It wasn't about doing what was 'smart', it was about watching people squirm.
Natla enjoys playing with humans. It wasn't about doing what was 'smart', it was about watching people squirm.
seems so. every human being (from guide to cowboy) has died in the end. Only Lara made it home.
Uzi master
03-11-09, 23:28
not ALL have died... anyway Natla couldn't fly or shoot fireballs until after she fell in the lava, she was to reliant on the scion for her power.
wait, you were talking about TR 1 only.
Nah I was talking about both games. I figured the TR1 forums could use a few new posts :)
you guys forgot that all the scions were hidden behind curtains of water, and Natla cant touch water, she is more of a fire person... I read that somewhere but I forgot where :(
tombraiderxii
05-11-09, 05:14
you guys forgot that all the scions were hidden behind curtains of water, and Natla cant touch water, she is more of a fire person... I read that somewhere but I forgot where :(
true true if u were talking about TR1, but it cant possibly fit in with TRA cuz in TRU how would she get to the arctic sea level (cant remember the exact name of the area in TRU) shed have to make contact with water. :p thats how lara got in.
Uzi master
05-11-09, 05:27
AGAIN Natla wasn't always like that, in tr1 at least...
!Lara Croft!
05-11-09, 05:42
true true if u were talking about TR1, but it cant possibly fit in with TRA cuz in TRU how would she get to the arctic sea level (cant remember the exact name of the area in TRU) shed have to make contact with water. :p thats how lara got in.
but it says in lara's jounal that she beleives there to be another...drier...way in.
tombraiderxii
05-11-09, 06:05
AGAIN Natla wasn't always like that, in tr1 at least...
i said that. sorry for not being clear lol :o
but it says in lara's jounal that she beleives there to be another...drier...way in.
ah... i see... still seems highly unlikely
darn, i should read her journal when i have the time :p
you guys forgot that all the scions were hidden behind curtains of water, and Natla cant touch water, she is more of a fire person... I read that somewhere but I forgot where :(
Where are the curtains of water in Egypt? I know some swimming areas exist, but I don't recall the Scion itself being protected or behind water.
Where are the curtains of water in Egypt? I know some swimming areas exist, but I don't recall the Scion itself being protected or behind water.
wasnt getting the key to open the scion hall hidden in that huge pool roome? the one with the giant two statues.
Romantics Inc.
06-11-09, 00:21
because then Tomb Raider wouldnt exist. Just stick with the classic story...ugh...
wasnt getting the key to open the scion hall hidden in that huge pool roome? the one with the giant two statues.
Sure, but the scion was not. a door would not have stopped her.
Sgt BOMBULOUS
06-11-09, 02:47
Sure, but the scion was not. a door would not have stopped her.
Heh... All Lara needed was a hacksaw to finish Sanctuary of the Scion in 5 minutes in TR1 :D
Sure, but the scion was not. a door would not have stopped her.
maybe that door was natla-proff
Heh... All Lara needed was a hacksaw to finish Sanctuary of the Scion in 5 minutes in TR1 :D
heck if she had two sticks of dynamites then she'll finish all of egypt in 5 minutes :d
lara c. fan
07-11-09, 11:18
Clearly Natla didn't read the "Evil Overlord List." (http://www.eviloverlord.com/lists/overlord.html)
:vlol::vlol::vlol::vlol:
awesome
I understand that "no Lara going after the Scion = no Tomb Raider" but it seems like a pretty big plot hole.
pretty big plot holeNot much different than many movies or television shows. Lines I would have liked to have heard in some cases:
Mission Impossible - Barney: "Jim, wouldn't be easier if we just killed him ourselves?" Jim: "Well yes Barney, but that would take 5 minutes and this is a one hour show".
Star Trek - Bones: "Jim, couldn't you just set up a panic button where the ship would just stun everyone in the vicinity of the landing party and beam the party back up in case of trouble?". Kirk: "Well yes Bones, but then that would eliminate about 2/3rds of our episodes".
maybe she had to go to the mall to get her atlantian dress
If Natla was so powerful/smart/hot/etc. why didn't she just find the whole Scion herself? She could fly past any traps, shoot fireballs at any villain, and make light of the whole thing.
She could not fly or shoot fireballs untill later in the game, but she could have just sent Larson, instead of sending Lara then Larson with instructions to kill her. That way Lara would never have known about her evil plans and nobody would have tried to stop her.
I reckon Natla hired several mercenaries simultaneously (including Lara) to get the Scion knowing how dangerous the tombs might be and didn't much care who succeeded provided someone retrieved the pieces of the Scion. Her decision was probably based purely on logic. In the good old days as Queen she could have just ordered some soldiers to do it, but she wakes up in a capitalist world where the only real power is cold hard cash, and so she gets rich instead and uses her financial clout to ensure loyalty from people who only care about money. The fatal flaw in the plan - only Lara doesn't need paying because Natla has correctly judged that Lara was nutty enough to do it (however dangerous) just for "kicks". Sadly this also means that Lara won't just accept a large suitcase full of cash to go away if she succeeds, and Natla is presumably smart enough to realise that Lara wants to keep the Scion for herself and will die trying to get it back. (After all she has already broken into the Natla Technology building, a fact no doubt picked up by security.) Therefore, unfortunately, Lara has to die when her task is over, whatever Natla's personal feelings on the execution. Lara's too much of a murderous nutcase (however attractive) to let go free. Sometimes as a leader you have to make the tough choices to make sure the mission succeeds.
rr_carroll
11-11-09, 08:12
Good construction, Icarus60. :)
I think that Natla could use her superpowers only in special locations. TR1 FMV didn't show that Natla had wings in Los Alamos. But in TRA she had. This tr1/tra contradiction is really confusing. I still have no idea where did Natla go after the Manhattan Project explosion and what did she do all those years? (1946-1996). Holy cow 50 frigging years!
rr_carroll
11-11-09, 09:37
...where did Natla go after the Manhattan Project explosion and what did she do all those years? (1946-1996). Holy cow 50 frigging years!
Learn English and American culture, build her financial (and probably criminal) empire. Concealing her longevity would be made easier by having close subordinates who were "used up" frequently. A psychopath like Natla would consider us ripe for exploitation. Quite an interesting tale could be written about how she depended on the generosity of Americans in the post-wars and then betrayed their trust. :mis:
Holy cow 50 frigging years!
It takes time building up a business from scratch. :p (edit: for a more elaborate response, see the post above)
As for what is (in my eyes unjustly) called a plot hole, I think it's pretty evident that Ms. Natla underestimated Lara, pure and simple. And being a former Atlantean Queen, who can blame her for possessing a bit of arrogance? Makes perfect sense to me, personally.
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/5004775/1/The_Atlantean_Way
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/5004775/1/The_Atlantean_Way
I've read through a good portion of this. I can't subscribe to all of its portrayal, such as Amanda being one of the supposed Seven Chloes or Lara being hired ultimately because the sixth Chloe mothered a child from the Croft line. Saying that, it does have some fun moments and is worth a read if you like speculative fan-fiction.
I only mention it as someone was asking about 1945-1996(?) and this covers some of that.
(Incidently is there such a thing as "non-speculative fan fiction"?)
I only mention it as someone was asking about 1945-1996(?) and this covers some of that.
(Incidently is there such a thing as "non-speculative fan fiction"?)
Well, I meant it as in that it covered a time-span largely neglected by both CORE and CD. Some fan fiction takes place within the established timeline during well-known events. That sort of fan fiction certainly speculative in that we are privy to something that wasn't seen in game, but not so much in that isn't trying to fill in gaps so much as expand upon existing narratives.
Natla sends the one woman who can "stamp out Bigfoot" to find a PIECE of the Scion, which would undoubtedly generate interest in Lara as to where the other pieces are, and cause her to go find them.
If Natla was so powerful/smart/hot/etc. why didn't she just find the whole Scion herself? She could fly past any traps, shoot fireballs at any villain, and make light of the whole thing.
Her plan would have succeeded. Obviously, she wasn't so smart.
Perhaps Natla having spent 10,000 odd years entombed alive has a fear of tombs or being trapped? If Tihocan or Qualopec had set traps to protect the scion why risk being entombed a second time, let someone else take the risks. In the end whether it was TR1 or TRA it was not the other previous rulers Natla had to worry about, it was Lara that entombed her the second time.
I reckon Natla hired several mercenaries simultaneously (including Lara) to get the Scion knowing how dangerous the tombs might be and didn't much care who succeeded provided someone retrieved the pieces of the Scion. Her decision was probably based purely on logic. In the good old days as Queen she could have just ordered some soldiers to do it, but she wakes up in a capitalist world where the only real power is cold hard cash, and so she gets rich instead and uses her financial clout to ensure loyalty from people who only care about money. The fatal flaw in the plan - only Lara doesn't need paying because Natla has correctly judged that Lara was nutty enough to do it (however dangerous) just for "kicks". Sadly this also means that Lara won't just accept a large suitcase full of cash to go away if she succeeds, and Natla is presumably smart enough to realise that Lara wants to keep the Scion for herself and will die trying to get it back. (After all she has already broken into the Natla Technology building, a fact no doubt picked up by security.) Therefore, unfortunately, Lara has to die when her task is over, whatever Natla's personal feelings on the execution. Lara's too much of a murderous nutcase (however attractive) to let go free. Sometimes as a leader you have to make the tough choices to make sure the mission succeeds.
But in TRA? Like I said, Lara was a very poor choice indeed when it comes to getting someone to find the Scion. Anybody could tell Lara would never let go of it; even Natla herself knew. So, why?
But in TRA? Like I said, Lara was a very poor choice indeed when it comes to getting someone to find the Scion. Anybody could tell Lara would never let go of it; even Natla herself knew. So, why?
In both TR1 and TRA Natla knew Lara was capable of getting it and getting out alive, all she needed was to be told where to look. Why Lara wanted it would make no difference to Natla, in both games she sent Larson to retrieve it from Lara. Even in the original game Natla never trusted Lara to give her the scion piece. All TRA did was give a better reason than greed for Lara wanting it herself, or the even more improbable "I only play for sport" which made it seem like Lara was some sort of idiot who would risk her life for a thrill. It was a smart answer for Natla waving her money around thinking Lara would want it, but at least for me I would never have thought that a reason for what Lara does.
But with all that power, why didn't Natla just get it herself?
But in TRA? Like I said, Lara was a very poor choice indeed when it comes to getting someone to find the Scion. Anybody could tell Lara would never let go of it; even Natla herself knew. So, why?
I don't really undestand the plot of TRA. I was thinking of the original plot in TR1. I'm sure Natla felt she could easily get rid of Lara if Lara forced her to. Maybe Natla was too blinded by Lara's beauty to think straight and made a bad choice, though. Even supervillians can fall in love.
But with all that power, why didn't Natla just get it herself?
Maybe there was a religious or supernatural reason why Natla wouldn't enter the tombs of her fellow rulers? Or maybe she figured that they'd have booby-trapped the tombs so that she'd never be able to walk in and just collect the pieces of the Scion. Tihocan and Qualopec probably realised that no prison can be guaranteed to last for eternity and took the appropriate precautions, and whatever else Natla is, she's smart enough to work that out for herself. Hence the "hired help".
Natla only has godlike powers in TRA (which as I said elsewhere has a nonsensical plot as far as I'm concerned). However in TR1 you get the impression that she's an ordinary human with access to ancient technology.
Maybe there was a religious or supernatural reason why Natla wouldn't enter the tombs of her fellow rulers? Or maybe she figured that they'd have booby-trapped the tombs so that she'd never be able to walk in and just collect the pieces of the Scion. Tihocan and Qualopec probably realised that no prison can be guaranteed to last for eternity and took the appropriate precautions, and whatever else Natla is, she's smart enough to work that out for herself. Hence the "hired help".
this theory sounds plausible to me. maybe Tihocan and Qualopec condemned those places from their unholy sister Natla and she somehow believed that. She definitely felt fear towards T and Q hence all those years she was busy with all her preparations of these bold "crusades" on their tombs.
Natla only has godlike powers in TRA (which as I said elsewhere has a nonsensical plot as far as I'm concerned). However in TR1 you get the impression that she's an ordinary human with access to ancient technology. Origins of Natla are still unknown and it seems they will remain this way. Maybe she is a creature that has great powers or maybe she's not stronger than ordinary human but possesses some cool technology. Either way she seems to be immortal, that's pretty obvious. Maybe she's even some ancestor of all humankind. Who knows for sure. Is she from Earth or just another alien from other galaxy or even dimension.
edit: Other question is still bothering me: how Atlantean guards got to Egypt? Why we didn't see them in Peru and Greece? (only two centaurs were in the end of the Greece level)
Sgt BOMBULOUS
12-11-09, 18:02
this theory sounds plausible to me. maybe Tihocan and Qualopec condemned those places from their unholy sister Natla and she somehow believed that. She definitely felt fear towards T and Q hence all those years she was busy with all her preparations of these bold "crusades" on their tombs.
Origins of Natla are still unknown and it seems they will remain this way. Maybe she is a creature that has great powers or maybe she's not stronger than ordinary human but possesses some cool technology. Either way she seems to be immortal, that's pretty obvious. Maybe she's even some ancestor of all humankind. Who knows for sure. Is she from Earth or just another alien from other galaxy or even dimension.
edit: Other question is still bothering me: how Atlantean guards got to Egypt? Why we didn't see them in Peru and Greece? (only two centaurs were in the end of the Greece level)
There was also a mummy that concerned Lara in Qualopec's tomb... The one you can shoot and counts as a kill. That would count for at least one Atlantean being in Peru (since once we get to Atlantis we realize that all of the mummies are really of Atlantean origin).
I don't recall anything in TR1 that said Natla was literally immortal. Where Tihocan and Qualopec immortal too and if so, why build themselves tombs?
There was also a mummy that concerned Lara in Qualopec's tomb... The one you can shoot and counts as a kill. That would count for at least one Atlantean being in Peru (since once we get to Atlantis we realize that all of the mummies are really of Atlantean origin). First when I saw mummies in Peru I thought they were regular mummies because many mummies were found in Peru even in present days. Especially in 2008. When I saw mummies in Egypt I thought about Egyptian mummies. Only In Atlantis I realized that those were no human mummies, they were Atlanteans. But I still have no idea how they were reanimated.
I don't recall anything in TR1 that said Natla was literally immortal. Where Tihocan and Qualopec immortal too and if so, why build themselves tombs? Nuclear explosion already said that. I don't think Natla was so deep in the ground and her cell was so strong so she could survive such a mess. I know some creatures are radiation-proof but what about explosion? Ok Natla was preserved because she was in a long anabiosis but how about her age? She didn't age from 1946 till 1996. Ok maybe she can regenerate her dna, whatever she is she's not a goddess or something but she's an immortal creature.
About tombs: I think word "tomb" meant something else for Atlanteans. Maybe it was a teleport to another dimension, maybe it was a cell to put themselves in a long stasis. Sounds bit Stargate-esque tho. Anyways we didn't see T and Q. We can't say that they died.
Another thing: What if the Manhattan Project wasn't an accident. How come that they decided to explode the A-Bomb exactly in Los Alamos? Maybe someone found out something about Natla and decided to set her free and caused this experiment? Maybe it was Qualopec? I read somewhere (maybe in magazine) that after Natla's betrayal Qualopec betrayed Tihocan .....
Maybe it was Natla's and Qualopec's plans
First when I saw mummies in Peru I thought they were regular mummies because many mummies were found in Peru even in present days. Especially in 2008. When I saw mummies in Egypt I thought about Egyptian mummies. Only In Atlantis I realized that those were no human mummies, they were Atlanteans. But I still have no idea how they were reanimated.
I don't think TR1 Atlantis had mummies. Only the mutants. They have the unfortunate tendency to behave like the mummies in Egypt, but if the two are interconnected, it's more likely that Egypt had mutants disguised as mummies.
Nuclear explosion already said that. I don't think Natla was so deep in the ground and her cell was so strong so she could survive such a mess. I know some creatures are radiation-proof but what about explosion? Ok Natla was preserved because she was in a long anabiosis but how about her age? She didn't age from 1946 till 1996. Ok maybe she can regenerate her dna, whatever she is she's not a goddess or something but she's an immortal creature.
Not only that, but she did survive the fall into the lava pit below as well, even in TR1. Of course, unlike TRA, we never actually SEE her hit the lava, so it's possible she was rescued at the last moment by a flyer. Or, alternatively, if the mutation we see on her at the end is actually HER and not a mutant riding her body, then she could have saved herself from the fall.
She also survives a heck of a lot of lead in the final battle as well, getting up after the first assault brought her to the ground.
About tombs: I think word "tomb" meant something else for Atlanteans. Maybe it was a teleport to another dimension, maybe it was a cell to put themselves in a long stasis. Sounds bit Stargate-esque tho. Anyways we didn't see T and Q. We can't say that they died.
Tihocan and Qualopec were pretty specific that Natla was being into a stasis.
Another thing: What if the Manhattan Project wasn't an accident. How come that they decided to explode the A-Bomb exactly in Los Alamos? Maybe someone found out something about Natla and decided to set her free and caused this experiment? Maybe it was Qualopec? I read somewhere (maybe in magazine) that after Natla's betrayal Qualopec betrayed Tihocan .....
Maybe it was Natla's and Qualopec's plans
There would be better ways of setting her free, such as simply digging her up. I can't imagine anyone would have trumped up the necessity of the atomic bomb in World War II simply to free Natla.
I don't think TR1 Atlantis had mummies. Only the mutants. They have the unfortunate tendency to behave like the mummies in Egypt, but if the two are interconnected, it's more likely that Egypt had mutants disguised as mummies. yup right mummies were same mutants but in bandages.
she did survive the fall into the lava pit below as well. Of course, unlike TRA, we never actually SEE her hit the lava, so it's possible she was rescued at the last moment by a flyer. very good idea. I think a flyer had saved her from the fall.
Tihocan and Qualopec were pretty specific that Natla was being into a stasis. right this makes me think that they didn't want to kill her. Natla didn't suffer in stasis, she just hibernated. Maybe Qualopec wanted to keep her alive so they could unite against Tihocan.
There would be better ways of setting her free, such as simply digging her up. I can't imagine anyone would have trumped up the necessity of the atomic bomb in World War II simply to free Natla. digging would be simple but maybe nuclear blast was the only way to open the cell
digging would be simple but maybe nuclear blast was the only way to open the cell
We don't know that for sure. Even then, the cell didn't open until after the blast, so we have no way of knowing why exactly it opened, only that the blast uncovered it.
We don't know that for sure. Even then, the cell didn't open until after the blast, so we have no way of knowing why exactly it opened, only that the blast uncovered it.
maybe it got needed temperature so her cryonic state got needed energy from the blast.
maybe it got needed temperature so her cryonic state got needed energy from the blast.
Sure, that's one possibility. But even then we don't know that a nuclear blast was required to breach the cell. The cell was underground at the time, it had to be unearthed. It could have simply been the EMP negating the lock, or the pressure of the earth cracking the cylinder walls, etc. Any number of other things could have happened that the blast assisted with, but wasn't necessary for.
Sure, that's one possibility. But even then we don't know that a nuclear blast was required to breach the cell. The cell was underground at the time, it had to be unearthed. It could have simply been the EMP negating the lock, or the pressure of the earth cracking the cylinder walls, etc. Any number of other things could have happened that the blast assisted with, but wasn't necessary for.
True, many things could had caused that. I like EMP idea. Maybe cell was locked by some kind of code. And strong impulse has deciphered the lock.
If Natla was frozen in stasis underground, then the nuclear blast would not have affected her. In TR1 the blast blows the lid off her prison and then afterwards we hear the "ice" started to crackle. We never saw her fall into the lava in TR1, and even if she did maybe there was some other explanation for her survival other than her being immortal; I think you're confusing immortal with indestructable. As for the bullets, maybe she was armoured or Lara was a bad shot? Whatever the reason, being apparently bullet proof doesn't automatically make you an immortal god. 1945-1996 is 50 years, which although it indicates that Natla is long lived certainly doesn't make her immortal. And the simplest definition of "tomb" is where you bury a dead body which indicates to me that Tihocan and Qualopec died or expected to die, and therefore were not immortal.
This need to try and make Natla immortal only really started when people started to try and reconcile TR1 with TRA (which is of course impossible as TRA wasn't a remake of TR1, but part of a complete reboot of the franchise.)
Nobody said that Natla was a goddess. It's maybe because of that idiotic Lara's monologue in TRU I need a hammer to .... blah blah blah. After Lara shot her down unlike other Atlanteans Natla didn't explode.
If an organism doesn't age and doesn't die it can be called immortal. Indestructible or immortal all the same .... it's a word game
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