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larafan25
21-08-10, 22:21
HIIII!!!:D

So I'm not sure how well this is stuited for my other thread about Aliens, if it should be put there then this can be closed, no big.:)

Anywho I often wondered and begin to question my own beliefs after watching a program about ancient aliens.

It was so awesome and it had a piece relating to the bible and basically Gods, could Gods have been other beings that just visited our planet and shared wisdom and ideas from their own world?

I haven't read the bible, I have only read a bit of a condenssed comic strip version in which there is no denying that whether you believe in this book or not, it's a good read.

I am just curious what other people think of this idea, perhaps there not Gods, but that is how we perceived them.

I don't have much more to say on the topic right now, I am just interested in thoughts, opinions, discussion, ideas, circulation.:)

Catracoth
21-08-10, 22:24
What?

dizzydoil
21-08-10, 22:25
What?
lol

aktrekker
21-08-10, 22:26
These claims have been made repeatedly.
The claims have been refuted repeatedly.
What's to discuss?

[Xmas]
21-08-10, 22:27
No. God and aliens are not the same.

God = doesn't exist.
Aliens = they exist.

:)

Dark Lugia 2
21-08-10, 22:27
This isnt about the bible, ( :p ) but I know that the Quran says that on judgement day (the end of the world) creatures never seen before will emerge from out of the ground or something simmilar (war of the worlds style?)

So I'd say aliens for that holy book? Maybe not the same type of aliens that we've created in fiction, but y'know. xD This really is an interesting concept though. I'm fascinated by religion, so any new interpretation on God(s) interest me. Nice thread :D

(I'm Athiest btw, just have a little background knowledge).

Legend of Lara
21-08-10, 22:27
What?

This.

larafan25
21-08-10, 22:29
Ouch, tuff crowd.

My point of view is that we have mistaken other beings for Gods.

There is tons to discuss by the way!

Uzi master
21-08-10, 22:29
;4839374']No. God and aliens are not the same.

God = doesn't exist.
Aliens = they exist.

:)

:hug:

larafan25
21-08-10, 22:31
;4839374']No. God and aliens are not the same.

God = doesn't exist.
Aliens = they exist.

:)

I personally do not believe in Gods, however I was not around for the events that unfolded and were written in the bible, so perhaps some of it did happen closely to how it was written and they are other beings.

Perhaps our morals abd beliefs etc of earth are shaped from those of another planet, sort of like a mosaic, wait...melting pot? Hmmm...:/

ace_85
21-08-10, 22:32
These claims have been made repeatedly.
The claims have been refuted repeatedly.
What's to discuss?

Agreed. Von Daniken was making exactly these sort of claims 40 or so years ago, and it didn't do his credibility any good whatsoever when people actually started cross-examining his 'evidence'

larafan25
21-08-10, 22:34
Agreed. Von Daniken was making exactly these sort of claims 40 or so years ago, and it didn't do his credibility any good whatsoever when people actually started cross-examining his 'evidence'

I'm sorry, I am not Von Daniken, I have no reputation that will be destroyed if I discuss such theories or ideas.

8DCCXbWTQNw

Interesting watch, based around the book Chariots of the Gods.

thecentaur
21-08-10, 22:36
;4839374']No. God and aliens are not the same.

God = doesn't exist.
Aliens = they exist.

:)

:tmb:

moodydog
21-08-10, 22:37
Lets discuss the difference between god and aliens.

God
http://www.abnoss.com/foto/fotohonary/YOU%20ARE%20THERE..jpg

and an alien
http://drwill.com/wp-content/uploads/alien.png


I think it is safe to assume that God and Aliens are not linked!

Your_Envy*
21-08-10, 22:38
What?

My thoughts exactly. :hug:

larafan25
21-08-10, 22:39
Lets discuss the difference between god and aliens.

God
http://www.abnoss.com/foto/fotohonary/YOU%20ARE%20THERE..jpg

and an alien
http://drwill.com/wp-content/uploads/alien.png


I think it is safe to assume that God and Aliens are not linked!

Oh, I actually didn't know that God was a bearded old man.

Fabulous artists back then, truly.

Uzi master
21-08-10, 22:40
:tmb:

huh, never knew you were an athiest, ;)

aktrekker
21-08-10, 22:40
;4839374']No. God and aliens are not the same.

God = doesn't exist.
Aliens = they exist.

:)

:vlol:

KurtisLonely
21-08-10, 22:40
moodydog, how do you know that god looks like that? He forbid to make pictures or statues of Him, remember? No one knows what He looks like.

Orionvalentine
21-08-10, 22:41
The OP wanted a discussion, not a bunch of people taking the proverbial ****. I think it's a very interesting theory and something I'd like to read more on.

larafan25
21-08-10, 22:43
The OP wanted a discussion, not a bunch of people taking the proverbial ****. I think it's a very interesting theory and something I'd like to read more on.

Thank you Jesus!

I mean, Orionvalentine.:hug:

ace_85
21-08-10, 22:45
I'm sorry, I am not Von Daniken, I have no reputation that will be destroyed if I discuss such theories or ideas.

Wasn't a personal attack. I'm simply stating that, in my opinion, the evidence for these sort of allegations tends to be insubstantial, highly anecdotal, or a combination of the two.

thecentaur
21-08-10, 22:46
huh, never knew you were an athiest, ;)

Well...now you know :B
It's not something major that I'd use to describe myself.

larafan25
21-08-10, 22:48
Wasn't a personal attack. I'm simply stating that, in my opinion, the evidence for these sort of allegations tends to be insubstantial, highly anecdotal, or a combination of the two.

I see.

Perhaps it's not about proving God vs. aliens, it does seem that way though.

It's about proving the bible and then thinking, hmmm could this have just been other beings? Not Gods?


It's fully open for discussion.

This is for once something that makes me go "Oh, now I am interested" that is really cool, and I think the bible is clearly something open to interpretation.

Super Badnik
21-08-10, 22:50
What?This

larafan25
21-08-10, 22:52
What?

This.

Orionvalentine
21-08-10, 22:53
This

Did you even read what he wrote on the first post? Watch the linked video the OP put up for you? It's really not that hard to understand if you just read what has been written instead of copying what others have densely wrote to look funny. Not just aimed at you, but the other people that are feigning confusion to bolster their post count...

Super Badnik
21-08-10, 22:53
This.Wait, didn't you make the orginal post that Catracoth was "what-ing"? :confused:

Anyways on topic. Isn't there a theory or something about ancient Egypt and Aliens?

larafan25
21-08-10, 22:57
The video is long guys, beware, it may have like 10 parts. Requires a good attention span, which I guess can varry from topic to topic.

Stuff I found interesting...

Clearing a path for God: What was this about, he asked them to clear a path for him? Is God obese?

Also, something I didn't know untill this thread..

So God didn't want us to make statues of him? or paintings? I think I remember a reason why...Oh BECAUSE HE IS AN ALIEN!!!111

No just kidding, I believe it had something to do with him not being full of himsef, he didn't want worship or something.

Catracoth
21-08-10, 22:58
;4839374']God = doesn't exist.

You had to go and open that can of worms, huh?

Wait, didn't make the orginal post that Catracoth was "what-ing"? :confused:

LOL

larafan25
21-08-10, 23:01
You had to go and open that can of worms, huh?



LOL

Where does that LOL come from D:

Anywho just ignore the blunt expression of ones opinion.

Would it be any different if God was infact just a being from another planet?

Who knows, maybe these beings have copies of us.... Maybe we are safe with them...like a God, but not.:pi:

Rai
21-08-10, 23:03
Well haven't there been cave paintings discovered that could depict aliens or alien spaceships? I think it is a very interesting theory and I've seen documentaries on it too. I haven't watched the video given yet, but I will. I don't know about Gods, but maybe some of our creations, the knowledge we have, things like the Pyramids and other monuments of archaeological significance have been speculated to have alien origins. Civilisations such as the Atlanteans have been linked to possible alien origins too (to bring in a TR link :p). I haven't heard of this Von Daniken, but just because his theories were knocked back 40 years ago, doesn't mean his theories should be completely ignored now. Society is a little more open to these sort of ideas now, I think.

Catracoth
21-08-10, 23:03
Where does that LOL come from D:

My...keyboard...? :confused:

dizzydoil
21-08-10, 23:03
Maybe God was trying to warn us about the Oil Spill. :p

http://www.circlemakers.org/Img/martinsell_hill_07.jpg
Date: July 19, 2007
Location: Martinsell Hill, near Oare, Wiltshire
Coordinates: 51 22' 30" North, 1 45' 22" West

Look familiar?
http://www.33mm.eu/en/backgrounds/images/bp_logo.jpg

:p! God/Alien = win.

Catracoth
21-08-10, 23:04
:vlol:
Watch out.

Cochrane
21-08-10, 23:06
Interesting idea, but no evidence to support it.

larafan25
21-08-10, 23:10
Interesting idea, but no evidence to support it.

There was a lot of evidence to support the idea in the documentary, I mean, the bible itself is evidence of God, why can't it be evidence of Other being that are not Gods?

Catracoth
21-08-10, 23:14
There was a lot of evidence to support the idea in the documentary, I mean, the bible itself is evidence of God, why can't it be evidence of Other being that are not Gods?

Because Jesus wasn't an alien.

larafan25
21-08-10, 23:15
Because Jesus wasn't an alien.

Jesus is a human, the son of God
Jesus is a human, claiming to be the son of God
Marry got abducted and have an egg implanted of either a human or another simillar yet alien race, out pops jesus claiming to be from someone in the sky.

dizzydoil
21-08-10, 23:16
Jesus is a human, the son of God
Jesus is a human, claiming to be the son of God
Mary got abducted and have an egg implanted of either a human or another simillar yet alien race, out pops jesus claiming to be from someone in the sky.
:vlol:

Catracoth
21-08-10, 23:19
Marry got abducted and have an egg implanted of either a human or another simillar yet alien race, out pops jesus claiming to be from someone in the sky.

Marijuana is bad.

Uzi master
21-08-10, 23:20
Jesus is a human, the son of God
Jesus is a human, claiming to be the son of God
Marry got abducted and have an egg implanted of either a human or another simillar yet alien race, out pops jesus claiming to be from someone in the sky.

well then i guess she is technically a virgin then...

larafan25
21-08-10, 23:23
^Exactly, I do not think a women got struck by lightning and then had a baby.

Marijuana is bad.

How is that idea far fetched? How would I need to be on marijuana to think of it? Explain the holes or parts that are so rediculous.

Rai
21-08-10, 23:23
Jesus is a human, the son of God
Jesus is a human, claiming to be the son of God
Marry got abducted and have an egg implanted of either a human or another simillar yet alien race, out pops jesus claiming to be from someone in the sky.

:vlol:

Is Larafan's theory so far fetched though? We hear of alien abductions even now. Who's to say that didn't happen to Mary? As opposed to the virgin conceiving theory that the bible gives us? Maybe Mary and Joseph believed that it was God as it was easier for them to explain than an alien. Maybe they understood the alien to be a god? I'm in no way religious, so maybe that helps me to believe 'far out' theories, I dunno, but maybe we're just so used to the bible's God story, even if you aren't religious, that hearing another idea about it, just seems too hard to comprehend?

EDIT: TRFan23's post also makes a lot of sense too. We can't prove God exists or doesn't exist, so why not believe that he came from another planet or that human knowledge or beliefs came from seeing an alien/aliens and coming up with the explaination of a God, as it was easier to understand or explain it that way back then. The bible is after all but a book, writeen by and translated by humans - and re-translated over time.

Uzi master
21-08-10, 23:24
Marijuana is good.

fixed;)

Trigger_happy
21-08-10, 23:25
I think that if Aliens came to Earth thousands of years ago, they would have done something better with their lives than getting themselves in a book for doing things like in the bible. I can't see them being annoyed with everyone having the same language, or deciding that everyone needs to follow one man, or do any of the other things that are mentioned in the bible.

I don't think Aliens came to Earth, and that we then decided they were Gods and wrote about them. Plus, it never says anywhere that Jesus was 7ft tall, green and had a huge domed forehead...

larafan25
21-08-10, 23:26
Is Larafan's theory so far fetched though? We hear of alien abductions even now. Who's to say that didn't happen to Mary? As opposed to the virgin conceiving theory that the bible gives us? Maybe Mary and Joseph believed that it was God as it was easier for them to explain than an alien. Maybe they understood the alien to be a god? I'm in no way religious, so maybe that helps me to believe 'far out' theories, I dunno, but maybe we're just so used to the bible's God story, even if you aren't religious, that hearing another idea about it, just seems too hard to comprehend?

I think this is the case.

It really isn't far fetched.

I fyou believe there is another intelligent life in the universe, check.

If you believe they have the ability to travel and safely land on our planet, check.

If you think they are curious like humans, scientists, exploers, and would take samples and abduct people for scientific reasons, check.

It's really simple I find.:/

Catracoth
21-08-10, 23:26
How is that idea far fetched? How would I need to be on marijuana to think of it? Explain the holes or parts that are so rediculous.

Perhaps it's just my faith in the Bible preventing me from thinking abstractly, but it all seems a bit too ridiculous. A much more likely scenario would be the other ways of being pregnant without sexual intercourse.

Trigger_happy
21-08-10, 23:27
I think this is the case.

It really isn't far fetched.

I fyou believe there is another intelligent life in the universe, check.

If you believe they have the ability to travel and safely land on our planet, check.

If you think they are curious like humans, scientists, exploers, and would take samples and abduct people for scientific reasons, check.

It's really simple I find.:/

Yes, but there's a difference between doing a few studies and being around long enough to get mentioned in a huge book lots of times, and being credited with thousands of things.

larafan25
21-08-10, 23:28
I think that if Aliens came to Earth thousands of years ago, they would have done something better with their lives than getting themselves in a book for doing things like in the bible. I can't see them being annoyed with everyone having the same language, or deciding that everyone needs to follow one man, or do any of the other things that are mentioned in the bible.

I don't think Aliens came to Earth, and that we then decided they were Gods and wrote about them. Plus, it never says anywhere that Jesus was 7ft tall, green and had a huge domed forehead...

Who said that is how aliens look?

If there are other beings then there is not one group of a ton of beings who all look th same.

Also, if the idea of Jesus not being human doesn't cater t you, then perhaps this theory.

Aliens visited earth, the human race was made by an early civilization of beings from earth and from beings from another planet.

KyleCroft
21-08-10, 23:29
My thoughts on this thread...
http://ui17.gamespot.com/1744/lolwut_2.jpg

larafan25
21-08-10, 23:29
Perhaps it's just my faith in the Bible preventing me from thinking abstractly, but it all seems a bit too ridiculous. A much more likely scenario would be the other ways of being pregnant without sexual intercourse.

There are other ways of being pregnant without having intercourse?

Was the syringe invented by then?

Catracoth
21-08-10, 23:30
There are other ways of being pregnant without having intercourse? Was the syringe invented by then?

A syringe into the vagina?
Can't imagine that being pleasant.

I suppose a man could ejaculate into a cup...

Trigger_happy
21-08-10, 23:30
If Aliens were able to visit Earth and breed and entire new race of animals- i.e us humans- thousands of years ago, I think they would have stuck around a bit, and we would know about them. If your doing a science experiment growing mould, you don't just grow mould, and then disappear, never to be seen again.

knightgames
21-08-10, 23:34
HIIII!!!:D

So I'm not sure how well this is stuited for my other thread about Aliens, if it should be put there then this can be closed, no big.:)

Anywho I often wondered and begin to question my own beliefs after watching a program about ancient aliens.

It was so awesome and it had a piece relating to the bible and basically Gods, could Gods have been other beings that just visited our planet and shared wisdom and ideas from their own world?

I haven't read the bible, I have only read a bit of a condenssed comic strip version in which there is no denying that whether you believe in this book or not, it's a good read.

I am just curious what other people think of this idea, perhaps there not Gods, but that is how we perceived them.

I don't have much more to say on the topic right now, I am just interested in thoughts, opinions, discussion, ideas, circulation.:)


You know. I was going to steer that topic toward this direction, larafan. There are many instances where the bible talks about strange craft. Elijah was taken by chariot. Ezekiel saw a wheel within a wheel, way up in the middle of the air. Daniel describes god's throne room that comes to the earth as a flying type craft. Christ talks about coming back in the clouds on glory. Israel was followed by a pillar of fire in the night and a cloud during the day.


Considering the finite amount of information about god, and humanity's total accumulation of knowledge, I think it's quite possible that god is an alien being. Certainly not in the gray lip-less creatures we imagine in horror movies and books, but something more divinely human.


Have you seen the movie KNOWING with Nicholas Cage? I loved it because I saw it as a mixture of Sci Fi and fictional biblical prophecy. The things warned in the bible may not be as literal as we think, but the natural explanation wasn't even comprehend-able. So when god says he makes the world new again by flame humanity thinks god is going to wave his arm and "poof" we're a vapor. Instead it may be because of solar flares. Check it out if you've not seen it.

larafan25
21-08-10, 23:34
A syringe into the vagina?
Can't imagine that being pleasant.

I suppose a man could ejaculate into a cup...

Syringe was the wrong word, my bad. Turkey baster.

I've actually never thought of just using a pot or cup, very primitiv.

If Aliens were able to visit Earth and breed and entire new race of animals- i.e us humans- thousands of years ago, I think they would have stuck around a bit, and we would know about them. If your doing a science experiment growing mould, you don't just grow mould, and then disappear, never to be seen again.

Did God dissapear? Did he stay with angels for a while? I haven't read the actual bible. This is why I don't know much about it, but I do believe God was able to watch over us without being on earth.

Aliens could do the same. We inspect life on mars.

Rai
21-08-10, 23:37
A syringe into the vagina?
Can't imagine that being pleasant.

I suppose a man could ejaculate into a cup...

What was Mary supposed to have done? Drunk it? Ewww *gags*. The syringe is more feasible actually, women use that method today :whi:.

If Aliens were able to visit Earth and breed and entire new race of animals- i.e us humans- thousands of years ago, I think they would have stuck around a bit, and we would know about them. If your doing a science experiment growing mould, you don't just grow mould, and then disappear, never to be seen again.

I'm not sure that Larafan is saying we were created by aliens, rather we adopted alien sciences/knowledge and beliefs etc. But in trying to make sense of them, we said they came from God - as a title, but instead it was what we refer to as aliens today. As I said in my previous post, what about Atlantis, the Egyptian pyramids, where did that knowledge come from?

larafan25
21-08-10, 23:37
You know. I was going to steer that topic toward this direction, larafan. There are many instances where the bible talks about strange craft. Elijah was taken by chariot. Ezekiel saw a wheel within a wheel, way up in the middle of the air. Daniel describes god's throne room that comes to the earth as a flying type craft. Christ talks about coming back in the clouds on glory. Israel was followed by a pillar of fire in the night and a cloud during the day.


Considering the finite amount of information about god, and humanity's total accumulation of knowledge, I think it's quite possible that god is an alien being. Certainly not in the gray lip-less creatures we imagine in horror movies and books, but something more divinely human.


Have you seen the movie KNOWING with Nicholas Cage? I loved it because I saw it as a mixture of Sci Fi and fictional biblical prophecy. The things warned in the bible may not be as literal as we think, but the natural explanation wasn't even comprehend-able. So when god says he makes the world new again by flame humanity thinks god is going to wave his arm and "poof" we're a vapor. Instead it may be because of solar flares. Check it out if you've not seen it.

I like that you popped in here and were able to type your thoughts out nicely and in good order, unlike me.:p

I have heard of all those instances. I also heard of from the video one of the men taken by God, or who went up with God and wrote about his experience, the only piece related to the bible written in first person. The book of....and now I forget his name.:(

I'd love to see that movie, provided there is nothing scary, I went without sleep for a week after watching dumb alien hoaxes.:pi:

Also Aliens do not need to look like the pop culture icons, they can be more human looking.

Catracoth
21-08-10, 23:39
What was Mary supposed to have done? Drunk it? Ewww *gags*.

:vlol:
No, pour it down...there.

larafan25
21-08-10, 23:40
What was Mary supposed to have done? Drunk it? Ewww *gags*. The syringe is more feasible actually, women use that method today :whi:.



I'm not sure that Larafan is saying we were created by aliens, rather we adopted alien sciences/knowledge and beliefs etc. But in trying to make sense of them, we said they came from God - as a title, but instead it was what we refer to as aliens today. As I said in my previous post, what about Atlantis, the Egyptian pyramids, where did that knowledge come from?

I am open to many theories, one theory I heard had to do with the very first successful civilization on earth. It was in a place that we now call Iraq. Apparently these people were visited by a being from another planet and they were unable to reproduce or something (I may have added it in) and they seeked to make a new race of beings, and thus we evolved from them. Apparently it was mutual satsfaction because the already existing race on earth was dying out or something. Yet how would it be able to support other life? Hmm... plot hole.:p

You will not become impregnated from drinking sperm BTW.:pi:

Trigger_happy
21-08-10, 23:41
Yes,if they exist they might inspect us and watch us, but if Aliens are accountable for everything in the bible, why would they do what they did? Why would they be Jesus and go around preaching? Why would they destroy the Tower of Babel and the whole Sodom and Gomorrah thingy? Why would they perform miracles? If they had the power to fly millions of light years here to Earth and make a race of intelligent beings and then watch us undiscovered for millennia, why would they do the stuff mentioned in the Bible? Why stop at all that stuff? Why not enslave us, or take us to other planets or use their Alien powers to do horrifying stuff to us?

Uzi master
21-08-10, 23:41
:vlol:
No, pour it down...there.

in her nose? belly-button?

knightgames
21-08-10, 23:42
Interesting idea, but no evidence to support it.

There's no evidence to support a god either. ;) :ton:

larafan25
21-08-10, 23:44
Yes,if they exist they might inspect us and watch us, but if Aliens are accountable for everything in the bible, why would they do what they did? Why would they be Jesus and go around preaching? Why would they destroy the Tower of Babel and the whole Sodom and Gomorrah thingy? Why would they perform miracles? If they had the power to fly millions of light years here to Earth and make a race of intelligent beings and then watch us undiscovered for millennia, why would they do the stuff mentioned in the Bible? Why stop at all that stuff? Why not enslave us, or take us to other planets or use their Alien powers to do horrifying stuff to us?

These are only a couple questions unfortunately, I can answer one, but that answer is one out of a million other ideas, and when we do answer it, we get more questions.:)

Shark_Blade
21-08-10, 23:45
*reads about Mary, syringes and cups*
...

*leaves thread*

Trigger_happy
21-08-10, 23:45
These are only a couple questions unfortunately, I can answer one, but that answer is one out of a million other ideas, and when we do answer it, we get more questions.:)

Thats not an answer, its a very politican-y thing to say.

Rai
21-08-10, 23:45
I am open to many theories, one theory I heard had to do with the very first successful civilization on earth. It was in a place that we now call Iraq. Apparently these people were visited by a being from another planet and they were unable to reproduce or something (I may have added it in) and they seeked to make a new race of beings, and thus we evolved from them. Apparently it was mutual satsfaction because the already existing race on earth was dying out or something. Yet how would it be able to support other life? Hmm... plot hole.:p

You will not become impregnated from drinking sperm BTW.:pi:

I hadn't heard that one. And yeah, that's why I said that :pi:.

larafan25
21-08-10, 23:46
Thats not an answer, its a very politican-y thing to say.

You actually want an answer, from me!? I'll try, but this is all theoretical.

Also what I said in my last post applies even more now.

Rai
21-08-10, 23:49
Yes,if they exist they might inspect us and watch us, but if Aliens are accountable for everything in the bible, why would they do what they did? Why would they be Jesus and go around preaching? Why would they destroy the Tower of Babel and the whole Sodom and Gomorrah thingy? Why would they perform miracles? If they had the power to fly millions of light years here to Earth and make a race of intelligent beings and then watch us undiscovered for millennia, why would they do the stuff mentioned in the Bible? Why stop at all that stuff? Why not enslave us, or take us to other planets or use their Alien powers to do horrifying stuff to us?

I dunno, the same reason why the biblical god left humans to fend for ourselves? If aliens did create us, maybe they watch over us but visit now and then (as has been documented too often for me to ignore), they're watching their human creation, see how we do.

larafan25
21-08-10, 23:54
Yes,if they exist they might inspect us and watch us, but if Aliens are accountable for everything in the bible, why would they do what they did?

Why would they be Jesus and go around preaching?

They wouldn't be Jesus. Jesus could be an alien like them (aliens could look close to what humans are, it's actually said there there is an alien race that could fit into society, but that is not for now) or he could simply be a human they created so they could preach information. Who knows, maybe it was part of developing the culture, your guess is as good as mine, but you are not guessing.

Why would they destroy the Tower of Babel and the whole Sodom and Gomorrah thingy?

Why did God destroy the tower? Was it so they couldn't reach the heavens, maybe it was a flight obstruction.

Why would they perform miracles?

Miracles could be anything, they could have been highly advanced technologically, well they would have been. They could have been spiritually advanced.

If they had the power to fly millions of light years here to Earth and make a race of intelligent beings and then watch us undiscovered for millennia, why would they do the stuff mentioned in the Bible? Why stop at all that stuff? Why not enslave us, or take us to other planets or use their Alien powers to do horrifying stuff to us?

If they created us, they did not want to enslave us.

The way you are talking is as if aliens are aliens, green short people up in the sky, they all look the same, done.

Aliens would be beings, not all of the beings in one alien race look the same, do all humans look the same? There would not be just one alien race. Perhaps only one race discovere dour planet, perhaps multiple races discovered multiple parts of the planet and influenced each culture and location.

Do all humans do horrifying stuff to eachother.

One Aline race is like the Nazis. One aline race is very peacefull. One alien in the Nazi race wants peace and wants out of that environment, one alien in the peacefull world wants war.

Think of humans.

Also, something neat...

So I stumbled upon a most likely hoax picture of an alien peaking into a window, the usualy short grey guy with large almond shaped dark brown eyes.

Why is it interesting? I mean aside from it being an alien? Because it's an explorer. It's on a strange planet, it's peaking into a window, trying to see what's up.

Some humans explored to find the places we are living in right now, I think it is important to ..humanize the Alien. Strange thing to say, but we can better relate to it.

Rai
22-08-10, 00:00
^I agree here. Different alien races for different cultures perhaps? We learn from alien beliefs and technology etc, but different ones, so that could explain why we, humans have different ideas etc. We may not come from aliens, but learn from them. (instead of the everything was Atlantean theory that CD cooked up :pi:).

larafan25
22-08-10, 00:02
^I agree here. Different alien races for different cultures perhaps? WE learn from alien beliefs and technology etc, but different ones, so that could explain why we, humans have different ideas. We may not come from aliens, but learn from them. (instead of the everything was Atlantean theory that CD cooked up :pi:).

Well there is still also that theory of humans being created from alines and other human like beings. If that is the case, we populate somewhere, and then move, as we move, the climate changes and we adapt.

So we could still evlve from ourselves, yet the roots of humanity be from a long lost rac eof beings and a race of beings from beyond this planet.

Trigger_happy
22-08-10, 00:04
Ok, I get the feeling that no one's views are going to change. I personally don;t believe that we were created by Aliens as they were bored, so that they would have something cool to do. I don't think that they then got bored after that and decided to pretend to be God and get us to write down the Bible. I don't think they are here today among us.

I don't think the Bible is necessarly true, and I'm not religious, but I think its slightly more possible then Aliens doing it all. Anyway, in the Bible, it says that god created everything -i.e, the Big Bang- so he would have created the Aliens anyway.

larafan25
22-08-10, 00:08
Ok, I get the feeling that no one's views are going to change. I personally don;t believe that we were created by Aliens as they were bored, so that they would have something cool to do. I don't think that they then got bored after that and decided to pretend to be God and get us to write down the Bible. I don't think they are here today among us.

I don't think the Bible is necessarly true, and I'm not religious, but I think its slightly more possible then Aliens doing it all. Anyway, in the Bible, it says that god created everything -i.e, the Big Bang- so he would have created the Aliens anyway.

My views are likely to change as this thread is about discussing multiple theories. You asked me a question, I gave you one or two answers each and beforehand explained that I do not know the definate answer and with every answer comes a 100000 more questions.

I never thought the bible was true, and it's not like I think it is true now either, I am just exploring ideas and perhaps I will come to a personal conclusion to base my beliefs on.

I was unaware God created the actual planet, that is interesting, something to take into account for the Aliens creating the earth.

However perhaps someone passed down the story of this being having such a huge impact on the evolution of the planet that in some way, they did infact create earth, just not the rock itself.

We could go make mars, by the mean with the right technology and climates on mars, we could create like and create something, and call that mars, and we would have, in some way, created mars.

Trigger_happy
22-08-10, 00:11
I was unaware God created the actual planet, that is interesting, something to take into account for the Aliens creating the earth.

However perhaps someone passed down the story of this being having such a huge impact on the evolution of the planet that in some way, they did infact create earth, just not the rock itself.

We could go make mars, by the mean with the right technology and climates on mars, we could create like and create something, and call that mars, and we would have, in some way, created mars.

He didn't just create Earth, he made everything. The whole Universe and everything in it. Before he decided to make it, it was all just black nothingness. I

larafan25
22-08-10, 00:13
He didn't just create Earth, he made everything. The whole Universe and everything in it. Before he decided to make it, it was all just black nothingness. I

Oh I understand.

That still doesn;t rule out Aliens being God, as explained above there are more theories as to how it could work.

However perhaps someone passed down the story of this being having such a huge impact on the evolution of the planet that in some way, they did infact create earth, just not the rock itself.

Tommy123
22-08-10, 00:32
i think that some gods could possibly be based off of aliens.

For example i was watching some show where they saw on a mural people worshiping a man coming down from a dozen UFO lookin things up in the sky


:pi:

larafan25
22-08-10, 00:34
i think that some gods could possibly be based off of aliens.

For example i was watching some show where they saw on a mural people worshiping a man coming down from a dozen UFO lookin things up in the sky


:pi:

There a lot of religious paintings with such imagery.

moodydog
22-08-10, 00:56
moodydog, how do you know that god looks like that? He forbid to make pictures or statues of Him, remember? No one knows what He looks like.

G-d is more or less of 'spiritual power'! So if you want the most accurate image of god... then you need to find an image of the atmosphere and the heavens, or everything-ness!
However, in our physical minds... that is the simplest way to visualise G-d, even if its forbidden... (but everyone does it :P).

larafan25
22-08-10, 01:01
G-d is more or less of 'spiritual power'! So if you want the most accurate image of god... then you need to find an image of the atmosphere and the heavens, or everything-ness!
However, in our physical minds... that is the simplest way to visualise G-d, even if its forbidden... (but everyone does it :P).

You are right that many people do it. I do it.

Why do we imagine an old man when we think of God?:0

Capt. Murphy
22-08-10, 02:46
I'm subscribed to a channel on Youtube... The guy has some videos that speak of Aliens (or 'Grays') and how they often appear when demonic, and/or occultic activities are going on. There are other demonic forms that could be seen, but 'Grays' were often a type that was seen -not ALL the time though. Sometimes people that would see these things would experience sleep paralysis, and sometimes being assaulted in a particular manner. The other forms that would appear would be insect like beings, or what one would imagine a 'demon' to look like, and/or something hideous.

These videos do talk on other things, but the 'Alien' thing (somewhere in one of these) gets mentioned. And it's pretty interesting. You might think some of it is conspiracy theories if you don't believe it. But at least watch some of these for a good "scary story" before you go to sleep tonight. :)

Here's part 1 of 10

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RF8QwKZxMVw

cbragg09
22-08-10, 03:06
My thoughts on this thread...
http://ui17.gamespot.com/1744/lolwut_2.jpg

This



Although I agree aliens arent necessarily green or tall. They may look just like humans that have changed appearance cause of a different evolution path? More intelligent to the point that space travel is possible.



But, really who knows. We are all searing for answers we'll never find. I like Kyles response the best so far too :D

CerebralAssassin
22-08-10, 03:27
I'm subscribed to a channel on Youtube... The guy has some videos that speak of Aliens (or 'Grays') and how they often appear when demonic, and/or occultic activities are going on. There are other demonic forms that could be seen, but 'Grays' were often a type that was seen -not ALL the time though. Sometimes people that would see these things would experience sleep paralysis, and sometimes being assaulted in a particular manner. The other forms that would appear would be insect like beings, or what one would imagine a 'demon' to look like, and/or something hideous.

These videos do talk on other things, but the 'Alien' thing (somewhere in one of these) gets mentioned. And it's pretty interesting. You might think some of it is conspiracy theories if you don't believe it. But at least watch some of these for a good "scary story" before you go to sleep tonight. :)

Here's part 1 of 10

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RF8QwKZxMVw

I've had sleep paralysis before but never saw any demon faces...strange.and also....sometimes...when I'm half-asleep in bed just before sleep swallows me whole,I get this odd feeling of "losing balance" like I'm falling off somewhere,like the bed just dissapears underneath me and I'm falling....and I jitter suddenly.it's very odd

Catracoth
22-08-10, 03:28
Although I agree aliens arent necessarily green or tall.

Have you seen an alien for yourself?
Otherwise, I believe any idea of what an alien looks like is valid. :)

Draco
22-08-10, 03:40
There is nothing in the Bible that can't be replicated with sufficiently advanced technology.

Indiana Jones 4 addresses this a bit.

Catracoth
22-08-10, 03:43
There is nothing in the Bible that can't be replicated with sufficiently advanced technology.

What piece of technology can turn water into wine?
I'd like to get such a device.

Draco
22-08-10, 03:44
What piece of technology can turn water into wine?
I'd let to get such a device.

I didn't say we had the technology, don't get smart with me.

Apathetic
22-08-10, 03:45
I'm subscribed to a channel on Youtube... The guy has some videos that speak of Aliens (or 'Grays') and how they often appear when demonic, and/or occultic activities are going on. There are other demonic forms that could be seen, but 'Grays' were often a type that was seen -not ALL the time though. Sometimes people that would see these things would experience sleep paralysis, and sometimes being assaulted in a particular manner. The other forms that would appear would be insect like beings, or what one would imagine a 'demon' to look like, and/or something hideous.

These videos do talk on other things, but the 'Alien' thing (somewhere in one of these) gets mentioned. And it's pretty interesting. You might think some of it is conspiracy theories if you don't believe it. But at least watch some of these for a good "scary story" before you go to sleep tonight. :)

Here's part 1 of 10

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RF8QwKZxMVw

That's so strange, a few years ago I used to ALWAYS get sleep paralysis and see frightening images of crazy looking faces.. ?!

Catracoth
22-08-10, 03:48
I didn't say we had the technology, don't get smart with me.

Well give me an example then.
What technology are you imagining that can replace features of the Bible?
Duck feet for humans perhaps, so we can walk on water? Perhaps a revitalization potion to rise on the seventh day. Help me out here. :p

Draco
22-08-10, 03:51
Well give me an example then.
What technology are you imagining that can replace features of the Bible?
Duck feet for humans perhaps, so we can walk on water? Perhaps a revitalization potion to rise on the seventh day. Help me out here. :p

Ducks can't walk on water.

All I said is that nothing is limited to the realm of god, not even creation.

Catracoth
22-08-10, 03:56
Ducks can't walk on water.

No?
Hmm, learn something new every day.

All I said is that nothing is limited to the realm of god, not even creation.

I'm pretty sure some creations aren't able to be man made.

aktrekker
22-08-10, 03:59
Is Larafan's theory so far fetched though? We hear of alien abductions even now. Who's to say that didn't happen to Mary? As opposed to the virgin conceiving theory that the bible gives us?
The virgin theory is very believable.
There are many animals that are able to spontaneously reproduce when the population gets out of whack. The females are able to produce offspring without fertilizing their eggs. It's called parthenogenesis.
Why couldn't it happen in a human?
http://www.findingdulcinea.com/features/science/environment/Parthenogenesis--When-Animals-Reproduce-Without-a-Mate.html
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/21/extra-chromosomes-allow-all-female-lizards-to-reproduce-without-males/


The bible is after all but a book, writeen by and translated by humans - and re-translated over time.
The dead sea scrolls have shown that with 2000 years of copying and translating the original writing is still intact. There are very few copy mistakes and they are easily detected and don't change the meaning of the passages.

We inspect life on mars.
There is no life on Mars.

Why would they destroy the Tower of Babel and the whole Sodom and Gomorrah thingy?
God didn't destroy the Tower of Babel.

There is nothing in the Bible that can't be replicated with sufficiently advanced technology.
Walking on water? Floating up into space without any protection? Suddenly appearing inside a locked room?

Indiana Jones 4 addresses this a bit.
That's a reliable source :p

tranniversary119
22-08-10, 04:00
I think it's possible these "gods" were really aliens that visited our planet, key word "possible". Here's a good read (http://www.crystalinks.com/ancientastronauts.html) on Aliens and Ancient Civilizations

Draco
22-08-10, 04:16
Walking on water? Floating up into space without any protection? Suddenly appearing inside a locked room?

Who says any of those happened exactly as they appeared? Or for that matter, how could an ignorant observer know it was technology?

Alpharaider47
22-08-10, 04:19
Who says any of those happened exactly as they appeared? Or for that matter, how could an ignorant observer know it was technology?

"After all, no one wants to hear 'Willy toiled for many a year to perfect the curious mechanisms that would send a sharpened spike up the arse of the unwary intruder.'"

aktrekker
22-08-10, 04:20
^:vlol:

Who says any of those happened exactly as they appeared? Or for that matter, how could an ignorant observer know it was technology?
What grounds do you have to say it didn't happen that way?
If you don't believe the bible, then fine, it didn't happen at all. But to say it happened differently you need some evidence. And something besides a conspiracy theorist to even plant the idea in your head.

robm_2007
22-08-10, 04:38
kinda OT:

my art history teacher said that the Virgin Mary might not have actually been a virgin. when the Bible was translated, they used a synonym for 'young woman' to name her, but it was a word that wasnt used in English, and they might have confused it with 'virgin' and used that word instead.

has anyone else heard that before?

Alpharaider47
22-08-10, 04:39
^:vlol:


I have to thank Hayley and Dragon Age for that little gem :p

remote91
22-08-10, 04:45
I'll have what he's sniffing.

Tyrannosaurus
22-08-10, 04:50
kinda OT:

my art history teacher said that the Virgin Mary might not have actually been a virgin. when the Bible was translated, they used a synonym for 'young woman' to name her, but it was a word that wasnt used in English, and they might have confused it with 'virgin' and used that word instead.

has anyone else heard that before? I've heard that, too. I've also heard that the term "virgin" simply meant "unmarried woman", so technically prostitutes could have been virgins as well. My own feelings about Mary are ambiguous. I'll accept the Christian story of Jesus' conception as is, but I wouldn't be surprized if some scholar finds evidence that the virgin birth is actually misunderstood. I think it's less important to Christianity (and certaintly less well documented) than the life, ministry, death and resurrection of Christ anyway.

Anyway, regarding the whole "God vs. Aliens" thing, I know there was actually a survey conducted which has shown that the non-religious are more likely to believe in nonsense like alien abductions and astrology than religious people. Everyone needs something to believe in, I guess.

aktrekker
22-08-10, 05:23
The birth of Christ was supposed to be a miracle of God. It was meant to be a sign to prove that God did it.
An unmarried woman getting pregnant would not be a miracle (in fact it would be a sin punishable by death). A virgin getting pregnant would be a miracle.

So that "interpretation" simply doesn't fly. The bible clearly meant a virgin.

Apathetic
22-08-10, 05:27
God, shmod..

Draco
22-08-10, 05:28
^:vlol:


What grounds do you have to say it didn't happen that way?
If you don't believe the bible, then fine, it didn't happen at all. But to say it happened differently you need some evidence. And something besides a conspiracy theorist to even plant the idea in your head.

What god is or isn't has nothing to do with the Bible. The OP was wrong to suggest it did.


The birth of Christ was supposed to be a miracle of God. It was meant to be a sign to prove that God did it.
An unmarried woman getting pregnant would not be a miracle (in fact it would be a sin punishable by death). A virgin getting pregnant would be a miracle.

So that "interpretation" simply doesn't fly. The bible clearly meant a virgin.

The problem is, the entire event is here-say. There is no way to know it actually happened to her that way or not.

aktrekker
22-08-10, 05:37
Yeah, we can't believe eyewitnesses or people who were given the story by God. But we must believe Indian Jones. :rolleyes:

scoopy_loopy
22-08-10, 05:46
Yeah, we can't believe eyewitnesses or people who were given the story by God. But we must believe Indian Jones. :rolleyes:

Yeah, eyewitnesses from thousands of years ago where history was often written in prose anything but biased, all of which was written as second-hand accounts later or neatly-arranged into a nice fat book by a buch of Romans. TOTALLY reliable.

aktrekker
22-08-10, 05:49
And Indiana Jones and conspiracy theorists are reliable?
Sorry, but that is really hilarious. :vlol:

If it wasn't for those people from thousands of years ago we wouldn't know anything about the past. At some point we have to believe those people or lose who we are and where we came from. And repeat their mistakes.

Draco
22-08-10, 05:49
Yeah, we can't believe eyewitnesses or people who were given the story by God. But we must believe Indian Jones. :rolleyes:

You can't trust the word of god to define god.

aktrekker
22-08-10, 06:00
Logically that is true.
But by the same logical rule you can trust the people who wrote it.

If you can trust conspiracy theorists and people who have no proof of their fantastic claims, you can surely believe the bible. It's a matter of choice and you choose that which does not require you to admit there is a creator you must answer to.

The stories in the bible are no more fantastic than these alien stories. If they might be true because god is an alien, they might be true because god is God.

Lara_Fan_33
22-08-10, 06:17
Im a firm believer in logic, and the possability of a white bearded humble man in a cloke who lives up in the sky and created everything based on what he thought was needed, seems a little far fetched compared to life beings from another planet that could very well be far more advanced then we are comign to earth and starting life, then leaving. but both of those sound ridiculous when you compare them to the possability of life forms evolving from organisms that were made from the heat and melding of the earth when it was just forming. i mean come on, wouldnt a plane hit god or something? :rolleyes: no offence, i just cant believe something like that. :p I've read the bible too, and its a bunch of balognie IMO

scoopy_loopy
22-08-10, 06:20
Im a firm believer in logic, and the possability of a white bearded humble man in a cloke who lives up in the sky and created everything based on what he thought was needed, seems a little far fetched compared to life beings from another planet that could very well be far more advanced then we are comign to earth and starting life, then leaving. but both of those sound ridiculous when you compare them to the possability of life forms evolving from organisms that were made from the heat and melding of the earth when it was just forming. i mean come on, wouldnt a plane hit god or something? :rolleyes: no offence, i just cant believe something like that. :p I've read the bible too, and its a bunch of balognie IMO

INB4 Aktrekker takes your jokes as serious criticisms of Christian faith.

Lara_Fan_33
22-08-10, 06:21
INB4 Aktrekker takes your jokes as serious criticisms of Christian faith.

well he shouldnt because he should be very aware that not everybodies opinions are the same and that i should be entitled to my opinion without him deleteing it because he doesnt feel its right. and im extremly serious. i respect his opinon, and he should respect mine too.
btw i wrote that post without reading the rest of the thread, if that makes a difference

aktrekker
22-08-10, 06:32
Hey, he can criticize if he wants to, as long as he's civil about it.

And the bible doesn't say God is a white-haired old man. In fact it makes it very clear he isn't a man at all. And he doesn't live in the sky or in space. By definition he must exist outside the universe. So no airplane or space ship can ever "hit" God (no matter what Star Trek says).

And the bible isn't bologna. You believe it is bologna. It's your opinion.

I say the idea of aliens visiting Earth is bologna. That's my opinion.

Uzi master
22-08-10, 06:36
Hey, he can criticize if he wants to, as long as he's civil about it.

And the bible doesn't say God is a white-haired old man. In fact it makes it very clear he isn't a man at all. And he doesn't live in the sky or in space. By definition he must exist outside the universe. So no airplane or space ship can ever "hit" God (no matter what Star Trek says).

And the bible isn't bologna. You believe it is bologna. It's your opinion.

I say the idea of aliens visiting Earth is bologna. That's my opinion.

within the laws of science it is bologna :wve:

Alpharaider47
22-08-10, 06:36
within the laws of science it is bologna :wve:

That's your opinion :p

aktrekker
22-08-10, 06:38
Only the laws of science as we know them.
We've only started to know them. And much of what we know is still wrong. We learn that constantly. Always check the science headlines, you'll see.

Uzi master
22-08-10, 06:38
no it's the law, of science. science isn't an opinion.:p

and until we can create matter god can't have created the universe

scoopy_loopy
22-08-10, 06:38
Lmao, all this talk of bologna is making me think of the Pastafarian worshippers of the Giant Flying Spagetti Monster!

Alpharaider47
22-08-10, 06:39
no it's the law, of science. science isn't an opinion.:p

What I mean is that it's your opinion that it doesn't work within those laws :p
Basically I'm saying that aktrekker has a point. Our interpretations of things are just that- *ours* We can and will choose to believe whatever we want to.

Uzi master
22-08-10, 06:41
you can beleive in santa clause and the tooth fairy as well, doesn't make it true.

Alpharaider47
22-08-10, 06:41
you can beleive in santa clause and the tooth fairy as well, doesn't make it true.

Now you're getting it ;)

But even truth is clouded by opinion.

Lara_Fan_33
22-08-10, 06:42
well has nobody even considered what i thought? they even did an experiment where they had absolutely nothing but this stuff and it was in a barel tumbling and it has been for years and yeears and the ehat was incredible, to imitate the ebginning of the planet and stuff started growing from absolutely nothing just recently! IMO

Uzi master
22-08-10, 06:42
Now you're getting it ;)

so, what do you think of my aktrekker impersonation?:p


(with my veiws)

aktrekker
22-08-10, 06:42
And you can believe in aliens - that doesn't make them real.

Your own arguments go both ways. Can't you see that?

scoopy_loopy
22-08-10, 06:42
you can beleive in santa clause and the tooth fairy as well, doesn't make it true.

Actually, if you believe in those things, then in your opinion they would be true.

I can respect an opinion, but I would expect the person holding that belief to also respect mine.



However - as it is a FACT that neither Santa nor the Tooth Faerie exist, it wouldn't see it "wrong" to really hammer home that the other was incorrect in their beliefs. However as religion and aliens can not be proved to be correct or exist by facts - neither side of the fence should either state their opinions as facts, or disqualify a different opinion as falsity.

Alpharaider47
22-08-10, 06:43
so, what do you think of my aktrekker impersonation?:p


(with my veiws)

I didn't stop to ponder it :D

*edit* after a small amount of thought I've come to the conclusion that if that isn't your opinion then you'll mislead the forums and potentially make yourself look like a fool :p

Lara_Fan_33
22-08-10, 06:44
this conversation is going in circles :rolleyes: i guess nothing is true.

Uzi master
22-08-10, 06:45
And you can believe in aliens - that doesn't make them real.

Your own arguments go both ways. Can't you see that?

well, the concept of aliens is likeley, there are billions of planet's, and we have proof that it could be, us. And it is possible for there to be a planet similer to earth somewhere.

(also, frozen micro-organisms have been found on mars)

aktrekker
22-08-10, 06:46
I can respect an opinion, but I would expect the person holding that belief to also respect mine.
I believe I'm respecting everyone's opinion as much as they are respecting mine.
At least I didn't start the bologna name calling. :p

Uzi master
22-08-10, 06:47
I believe I'm respecting everyone's opinion as much as they are respecting mine.
At least I didn't start the bologna name calling. :p

but bologna is a complement!:p

and a lot of the time you completley dissrespect other people with no provokation.

Lara_Fan_33
22-08-10, 06:48
I believe I'm respecting everyone's opinion as much as they are respecting mine.
At least I didn't start the bologna name calling. :p

i started it, you continued it. dont even put the blame on me for something you didnt even have to aknowledge.

aktrekker
22-08-10, 06:48
well, the concept of aliens is likeley, there are billions of planet's, and we have proof that it could be, us. And it is possible for there to be a planet similer to earth somewhere.
There is as much possibility that the bible is true.

(also, frozen micro-organisms have been found on mars)
Link please?

Uzi master
22-08-10, 06:50
I rememberd it from somewhere but can't remember whether it was a fact, not that YOU ever say the stuff you post may be false.


I found something, but it's not quite the thing I was remembering, still saying theres at least a probability:
In 1996, scientists led by David S. McKay, a geologist at the National Aeronautics and Space Administration's Johnson Space Center in Houston, reported that scientists there had found evidence of microscopic Martian life. They discovered this evidence inside a meteorite that had made its way to Earth. The meteorite had been blasted from the surface of Mars, almost certainly by the impact of a much larger meteorite. The small meteorite had then journeyed to Earth, attracted by Earth's gravity. The trip may have taken millions of years.
The evidence included complex organic molecules, grains of a mineral called magnetite that can form within some kinds of bacteria, and tiny structures that resemble fossilized microbes. The scientists' conclusions are controversial, however. There is no general scientific agreement that Mars has ever harbored life.
http://www.nasa.gov/worldbook/mars_worldbook.html

QiX
22-08-10, 06:53
Mankind created both God and aliens in its own image. The same way that God was portrayed as a bearded old man by italian painters centuries ago, the fact that life is likely to exist everywhere in the universe doesn't mean they will evolve into post-industrial capitalism and colonize other planets. Maybe the most intelligent alien creatures are like our dolphins. Even better, maybe the most intelligent creatures on Earth are the dolphins. Come on, do you think mankind is that perfect?

aktrekker
22-08-10, 06:53
and a lot of the time you completley dissrespect other people with no provokation.
Really? Nobody has told me before. Unless you're referring to a single post made today?

I respect other people's opinions and their right to have that opinion. I defend my own opinions. I have that right just as you do. Defending my opinions is not disrespectful.

Alpharaider47
22-08-10, 06:56
Mankind created both God and aliens in its own image. The same way that God was portrayed as a bearded old man by italian painters centuries ago, the fact that life is likely to exist everywhere in the universe doesn't mean they will evolve into post-industrial capitalism and colonize other planets. Maybe the most intelligent alien creatures are like our dolphins. Even better, maybe the most intelligent creatures on Earth are the dolphins. Come on, do you think mankind is that perfect?

This reminds me, if i remember right, those images of "God" that people often refer to (the old bearded guy) came from images of Zeus. (Oh noes Uzi I just might be wrong! :ton:) Just playing there, don't mean to offend you

Douglas Adams seems to have had that theory, but I think it's a valid thought. Just because we were more successful than cockroaches at spreading across the globe doesn't mean we're the smartest thing on the planet. But, based on how we judge intelligence, we're likely biased against allowing anything of this world to be placed above us.

Lara_Fan_33
22-08-10, 06:56
this thread is just too much for me to handle! *goes to bed*
PS. Atrekker i like your cat

Uzi master
22-08-10, 06:58
This reminds me, if i remember right, those images of "God" that people often refer to (the old bearded guy) came from images of Zeus. (Oh noes Uzi I just might be wrong! :ton:) Just playing there, don't mean to offend you

Douglas Adams seems to have had that theory, but I think it's a valid thought. Just because we were more successful than cockroaches at spreading across the globe doesn't mean we're the smartest thing on the planet. But, based on how we judge intelligence, we're likely biased against allowing anything of this world to be placed above us.

hehehe:p


btw, I'm still talking like aktrekker, recently he had a really, shall I say snorky attitude.:ton:

aktrekker
22-08-10, 07:04
I rememberd it from somewhere but can't remember whether it was a fact, not that YOU ever say the stuff you post may be false.
It's my opinions and my beliefs. I have no problem admitting that.
If I state something as a fact I provide evidence, or will if asked.


I found something, but it's not quite the thing I was remembering, still saying theres at least a probability:
http://www.nasa.gov/worldbook/mars_worldbook.html
I assume you mean this.
In addition, a group of researchers has claimed to have found evidence that living things once dwelled on Mars. That evidence consists of certain materials in meteorites found on Earth. But the group's interpretation of the evidence has not convinced most scientists.
A majority of scientists do not believe it. They can explain all the evidence in other ways. Most scientists consider the matter closed.

QiX
22-08-10, 07:04
Just because we were more successful than cockroaches at spreading across the globe doesn't mean we're the smartest thing on the planet. But, based on how we judge intelligence, we're likely biased against allowing anything of this world to be placed above us.

If you judge their evolution by adaptation to the environment the cockroaches are the most successful creatures on Earth, with a little help from us men, of course :p

Alpharaider47
22-08-10, 07:06
If you judge their evolution by adaptation to the environment the cockroaches are the most successful creatures on Earth, with a little help from us men, of course :p

I suppose you've got me there :vlol: but you see what I mean :p

QiX
22-08-10, 07:12
Yeah, I do. Just couldn't resist the joke :D

Uzi master
22-08-10, 07:12
It's my opinions and my beliefs. I have no problem admitting that.
If I state something as a fact I provide evidence, or will if asked.



I assume you mean this.

A majority of scientists do not believe it. They can explain all the evidence in other ways. Most scientists consider the matter closed.

not all, and really its you're OPINION:p
it's still a possibility, and it's likley that there are earth like planets out there, utterly denieing any possibility of alien life is just ignoring what's in front of you.

Lara_Fan_33
22-08-10, 07:13
Opinion = Truth pretty much

Alpharaider47
22-08-10, 07:14
not all, and really its you're OPINION:p
it's still a possibility, and it's likley that there are earth like planets out there, utterly denieing any possibility of alien life is just ignoring what's in front of you.

I don't think he's ever utterly denied the possibility though. Maybe in *this* circumstance, but not overall to my knowledge.

Uzi master
22-08-10, 07:15
Opinion = Truth pretty much

define truth:p

Lara_Fan_33
22-08-10, 07:18
define truth:p

no.

Uzi master
22-08-10, 07:19
alright.

Lara_Fan_33
22-08-10, 07:22
lol jk :pi: who knowas what truth is, truth is in the eye of the beholder :mis:

Uzi master
22-08-10, 07:23
so it;s an opinion not a fact?:p

Lara_Fan_33
22-08-10, 07:26
so it;s an opinion not a fact?:p

omg my brain cant handle this :pi: pretty much, i dont think theres truth unless its been proven, when something hasnt been officially proven anyones view on that thing is an opinion, who knows who knows who created life! it could have been some prehastoric monkey chicken hybrid that just layed people egges magicaaly one day, then they evolved to look like how poeple look like today :rolleyes: so yeah pretty much, unsolved truths are opinions IMO

Uzi master
22-08-10, 07:34
let's see what dictionary.com has to say....

the true or actual state of a matter: He tried to find out the truth.
2. conformity with fact or reality; verity: the truth of a statement.
3. a verified or indisputable fact, proposition, principle, or the like: mathematical truths.
4. the state or character of being true.
5. actuality or actual existence.
6. an obvious or accepted fact; truism; platitude.
7. honesty; integrity; truthfulness.
8. ( often initial capital letter ) ideal or fundamental reality apart from and transcending perceived experience: the basic truths of life.
9. agreement with a standard or original.
10. accuracy, as of position or adjustment.
11. Archaic . fidelity or constancy.

Lara_Fan_33
22-08-10, 07:36
let's see what dictionary.com has to say....

oops misread the post

Uzi master
22-08-10, 07:44
what, did you think I said?

aktrekker
22-08-10, 07:46
I think finding life on another planet would be cool. But I don't think we'll find any other intelligent life.
If we do find life on another planet, how can we know if it originated there? It could have come from somewhere else, even Earth.
http://hubpages.com/hub/Life-on-Earth-May-Be-Of-Extraterrestrial-Origin
The article talks about how life on Earth may have been seeded from somewhere else by spores and bacteria coming to Earth.
But in the same way, Earth is sending out spores and bacteria that could seed life on other planets.
Indeed, some astronomers think that Earth is seeding the interstellar environment right now as spores and viruses lofted high into the atmosphere, escape the confines of earth and get carried out into space by the influence of the solar wind. On the other hand, life in this form drifts from other sources into the solar system. Another method of escape is thought to be via high acceleration provided near the site of a meteorite impact such as a sizable comet or asteroid. Only small forms like spores and viruses can survive such impact acceleration and the rigors of ionizing radiation.

So if we do find life on another planet it may very well have come from Earth. So we still may be the only source of life in the universe.

More links:
http://www.panspermia.org/
http://astrobiology.arc.nasa.gov/news/expandnews.cfm?id=295
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ciencia/esp_ciencia_life02a.htm
http://www.springerlink.com/content/lx6w030517n3m528/

QiX
22-08-10, 07:57
I have one simple objection against alien origin theories. Even if it's possible (and it is) it just transfers the problem to somewhere else: there is a planet where life must have started without any alien interference, and this planet can be the Earth. If life can travel through the space in flying saucers or as genetic material petrified in an asteroid the fact is that this cycle must have started somewhere.

knightgames
22-08-10, 07:59
This is the beginning portion of the story of Job.

Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came among them.

The LORD said to Satan, "From where do you come?" Then Satan answered the LORD and said, "From roaming about on the earth and walking around on it."

Who were these sons of god? Not angels. They are always identified as angels and seraphim. Could they have been other inhabited planets 'created' by god? Are there other planets with life on them? If there is a god I believe there are countless planets with life them. Why would he create one planet with life on it amongst the billions of planets in space?

Scientifically, apart from any religious interpretation at all, it is impossible to think there is no life on other planets. A BIG BANG happens and our rock is the only one to have life? Naaaaaaaaaah. I don't buy that.

Now, whether god is an alien in the sense of another planetary inhabitant coming and populating Earth - that I don't believe. I do believe in the divinity of god (should he exist) though I think many of the machinations in the bible are alien like as we've come to understand them.

Lara_Fan_33
22-08-10, 07:59
And then theres always the famed question, Who/What created God? Who/What created aliens? just what created the creator of us? whas it even a living being? probably not. But we may never know....
^ we already know that it wasnt as simple as earth just surviving the big bang, earth was formed after millions of years of intergalactic space dust and space rock collecting together to form something spherical, it was in the perfect place...

Uzi master
22-08-10, 08:05
And then theres always the famed question, Who/What created God? Who/What created aliens? just what created the creator of us? whas it even a living being? probably not. But we may never know....
^ we already know that it wasnt as simple as earth just surviving the big bang, earth was formed after millions of years of intergalactic space dust and space rock collecting together to form something spherical, it was in the perfect place...

a living being, by definition is something that:
grows
reproduces
need's energy
makes waste
and one other thing I cannot recall at the moment.

Lara_Fan_33
22-08-10, 08:08
a living being, by definition is something that:
grows
reproduces
need's energy
makes waste
and one other thing I cannot recall at the moment.

i see.

aktrekker
22-08-10, 08:19
The Earth would always have come after the "big bang" so it didn't have to survive anything.

We don't know for sure how it formed. Recent discoveries have shown us that star and planet formation is much more complicated than has ever been believed. Some can form very quickly, some can take a very long time. They can form smaller and larger than ever believed.

How and when Earth formed will always be conjecture unless we find a way to go back in time and observe it. Any "evidence" will always be circumstantial, never conclusive.
Every time we try to say we know how something works, the universe throws us a twist.

As for how God was created, that is temporal thinking, something we can't avoid given our time-bound existence. God by definition exists outside the universe. This means he would also exist outside of time. Without time there is no beginning or end of anything. Therefore God would not require creation.

As for life having to exist elsewhere in the universe, that's an assumption. No matter how great the probability of something happening, it is still only a probability, not a certainty. Just because life exists here does not mean it must exist somewhere else. The probability is much lower than people think, but the scientific community keeps that information pretty well hidden so they can continue to get funding for their projects.
I've given links in another thread showing that recent astronomical discoveries have concluded that at best 10% of stars in our galaxy might have a planet capable of supporting life. That's a best case. And it doesn't mean life will develop on those planets.

Uzi master
22-08-10, 08:38
considering how many stars there are in our galaxy alone, let alone ALL the other one's the probability is high overall, and where have I ever said that there must conclusivley be life, I just said that the though of there being no chance of life anywhere else is ludicrouse.

aktrekker
22-08-10, 09:12
I just said that the though of there being no chance of life anywhere else is ludicrouse.
That's equal to saying it must exist elsewhere.

This is the beginning portion of the story of Job.

Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came among them.

The LORD said to Satan, "From where do you come?" Then Satan answered the LORD and said, "From roaming about on the earth and walking around on it."

Who were these sons of god? Not angels. They are always identified as angels and seraphim.
Not always. In Genesis, 2 "men" came to Abraham on their way to Sodom and Gomorrah. They had special powers (we learn this later in Sodom) and were obviously angels. But they were repeatedly called men.
In the New Testament we are told that many people have "entertained angels" unknowingly - in other words they do (or can) look like us.
But no, the sons of God are not angels.
What are they? The bible mentions many other types of creatures that are in heaven, or at least can go there. Besides angels there are Cherubim and Seraphim. There are the 4 living creatures that are around God's throne crying Holy, Holy Holy. There are the 24 elders before the throne of God. The sons of God could very well be some other race of beings in heaven. It doesn't mean aliens, and it doesn't mean they exist on some planet in the universe.

Also consider Isaiah 1:12-13 When you come to appear before Me, who requires of you this trampling of My courts? Bring your worthless offerings no longer, their incense is an abomination to Me.
This is talking about the people coming to the altar to make sacrifices. It calls it "coming before" God. This is very likely the meaning.

There are other explanations as well. None of them have to do with aliens.

Could they have been other inhabited planets 'created' by god? Are there other planets with life on them? If there is a god I believe there are countless planets with life them. Why would he create one planet with life on it amongst the billions of planets in space?
The more we learn about science, the more we learn that everything is tied together. Something as simple as a gravity wave from a supernova billions of light years away can affect life on Earth. All those other stars and their planets are not just for show. They serve a purpose, and help to support life on Earth, however indirect that help might be. They don't have to support life themselves.

Scientifically, apart from any religious interpretation at all, it is impossible to think there is no life on other planets. A BIG BANG happens and our rock is the only one to have life? Naaaaaaaaaah. I don't buy that.
It's not impossible to think that. It's not even unreasonable to think that.

Now, whether god is an alien in the sense of another planetary inhabitant coming and populating Earth - that I don't believe. I do believe in the divinity of god (should he exist) though I think many of the machinations in the bible are alien like as we've come to understand them.
Do you mean they seem alien to us because we don't understand them and can't duplicate them? That's a weak argument. We have no way of knowing if we will ever understand them, or if it's even possible for us to learn those things. Sure, we would like to learn things that would give us god-like abilities. We would like to think that technology will be able to solve every problem that exists, even death. But so far it seems that most advanced technology we have discovered only helps with 2 things - killing and multimedia. It seems to create more problems than it solves. Of course that is because we are the real problem. So nothing will ever change as long as we are in control.
And that, of course, leads us to God....

ryan91
22-08-10, 09:16
i think aliens exist and they worship for god too :D.

Dustie
22-08-10, 09:29
Lol, we won't know until there's a day of resolution or something like that... or maybe until we die...

It was sooo long ago that the Bible was written, or other texts, we can't tell what people had in mind when they wrote about 'fallen angels', 'nephilims', etc...

Johnnay
22-08-10, 11:31
What?

This

Draco
22-08-10, 11:59
However - as it is a FACT that neither Santa nor the Tooth Faerie exist, it wouldn't see it "wrong" to really hammer home that the other was incorrect in their beliefs. However as religion and aliens can not be proved to be correct or exist by facts - neither side of the fence should either state their opinions as facts, or disqualify a different opinion as falsity.

What a load you got there.

How do you know Santa isn't real? And if he isn't, why do people still believe he does?

And since when could aliens not be proven to exist or not? Just because we can't, doesn't mean itcannot be done.


EDIT: as for the odds of life being found elsewhere, the odds that there is life on another world somewhere are infinitely higher than the odds that there isn't.

scoopy_loopy
22-08-10, 12:07
And since when could aliens not be proven to exist or not? Just because we can't, doesn't mean itcannot be done.

What on earth are you so ****ed off at me for? I haven't said they can't be proven to exist! I meant my post in the present tense - aliens haven't been proven to exist - yet - and they haven't be proven to not exist - yet.

Legend 4ever
22-08-10, 12:15
The setup of this thread is a disaster. In the Bible, there is God, not Gods, so what is that? And then again, I don't see any mention of aliens in the Bible, so I'm really confused with where this info came from? Are you comparing angels of God to aliens? Is God an alien? What are we talking about?

Chocola teapot
22-08-10, 12:40
Maybe...

We'll never know.

moodydog
22-08-10, 12:40
You are right that many people do it. I do it.

Why do we imagine an old man when we think of God?:0

Because people generally associate age with wisdom. :o

Dennis's Mom
22-08-10, 13:48
The problem is that the idea simply doesn't jive with time and space (as in the size of the earth, not outer.)

This idea presumes that some alien entity appeared about 2500 BC to instill the idea of a single God in Abraham---that is the basis for the Bible.

However, you have other, vastly different concepts for god(s) arriving at different times all over the planet. We had multiple, ongoing visits from aliens that were mistaken for "gods", but suddenly they stopped?

I simply don't buy the idea that the earth was visited over and over by ancient aliens, interacted with us, gave us technology and then just vanished, never coming back to see "how we're doing."

It bothers me that I can't reconnect with some friends in high school. You would think an advanced culture would be rather interested in their "brainchild" (for want of a better term). What would be the point of visiting us only up to a certain point, then vanishing without a trace?

Chocola teapot
22-08-10, 13:55
The problem is that the idea simply doesn't jive with time and space (as in the size of the earth, not outer.)

This idea presumes that some alien entity appeared about 2500 BC to instill the idea of a single God in Abraham---that is the basis for the Bible.

However, you have other, vastly different concepts for god(s) arriving at different times all over the planet. We had multiple, ongoing visits from aliens that were mistaken for "gods", but suddenly they stopped?

I simply don't buy the idea that the earth was visited over and over by ancient aliens, interacted with us, gave us technology and then just vanished, never coming back to see "how we're doing."

It bothers me that I can't reconnect with some friends in high school. You would think an advanced culture would be rather interested in their "brainchild" (for want of a better term). What would be the point of visiting us only up to a certain point, then vanishing without a trace?

Perhaps all of the apparent UFO's and Abductions are the Alien's way of checking out how far we've come.

Also, They would probably be weary to show themselves because knowing us, There'd be mass Panic and we'd attack them.

Admles
22-08-10, 14:02
;4839374']No. God and aliens are not the same.

God = doesn't exist.
Aliens = they don't exist either.

:)

Fixed :D

Chocola teapot
22-08-10, 14:05
;4839374']No. God and aliens are not the same.

God = May exist.
Aliens = Probably exist.

:)

FIXED AGAIN.

:p

Ward Dragon
22-08-10, 14:07
We had multiple, ongoing visits from aliens that were mistaken for "gods", but suddenly they stopped?

Maybe we gave them the plague and they all died off :p H. G. Wells for the win :D

Dennis's Mom
22-08-10, 14:08
Perhaps all of the apparent UFO's and Abductions are the Alien's way of checking out how far we've come.

Also, They would probably be weary to show themselves because knowing us, There'd be mass Panic and we'd attack them.

Why? There's wasn't mass panic the first time they showed themselves apparently. We're clearly better able to understand what's going on now. Half the population of the planet would be thrilled as we've been awaiting some contact for decades.

I think the whole "visiting in secret" thing is just a convenient excuse and not really indicative of how thinking beings behave. Abduction stories never seem like fact finding missions for civilization and technology, just biological investigations. That stuff hasn't changed since they first visited.

*high fives Ward Dragon* HG Wells wins always!

knightgames
22-08-10, 15:04
Maybe we gave them the plague and they all died off :p H. G. Wells for the win :D

I HAD a full mouth of coffee when I read your post. Now I have to go get Bounty (the quicker picker upper) napkins. TYVM!!!!!:D

Ward Dragon
22-08-10, 15:08
*high fives Ward Dragon* HG Wells wins always!

Indeed :D

I HAD a full mouth of coffee when I read your post. Now I have to go get Bounty (the quicker picker upper) napkins. TYVM!!!!!:D

Oops :p

digitizedboy
22-08-10, 15:21
What would be the point of visiting us only up to a certain point, then vanishing without a trace?

Maybe they all died out eventually because of their collapsing world or maybe they didn't see any further point in checking up on us because of the way we turned out and especially if our genes are that of those beings. Probably that would be an insult to them?

Mad Tony
22-08-10, 15:42
;4839374']No. God and aliens are not the same.

God = We don't know
Aliens = We don't know

:)
Properly fixed.

knightgames
22-08-10, 16:04
That's equal to saying it must exist elsewhere.


Not always. In Genesis, 2 "men" came to Abraham on their way to Sodom and Gomorrah. They had special powers (we learn this later in Sodom) and were obviously angels. But they were repeatedly called men.
In the New Testament we are told that many people have "entertained angels" unknowingly - in other words they do (or can) look like us.
But no, the sons of God are not angels.
What are they? The bible mentions many other types of creatures that are in heaven, or at least can go there. Besides angels there are Cherubim and Seraphim. There are the 4 living creatures that are around God's throne crying Holy, Holy Holy. There are the 24 elders before the throne of God. The sons of God could very well be some other race of beings in heaven. It doesn't mean aliens, and it doesn't mean they exist on some planet in the universe.

Also consider Isaiah 1:12-13 When you come to appear before Me, who requires of you this trampling of My courts? Bring your worthless offerings no longer, their incense is an abomination to Me.
This is talking about the people coming to the altar to make sacrifices. It calls it "coming before" God. This is very likely the meaning.

There are other explanations as well. None of them have to do with aliens.

I don't think the ruse to conceal the identity of the angels in Sodom is the same as calling angels by another name.... ie, man..... but point taken. Nice explanation of coming before the lord with Isiah. I believe you are probably correct in that sense. though it still brings us (me specifically) no closer to understanding who these 'people' were in Job 1. I personally believe there are other created planets with populations of unfallen humans.

For clarification when I used the term aliens it's NOT one of those cow stealing, anal probe, night stalkers with gray skin and big black eyes. I DON'T believe in that form of alien existing. That's a figment of a wild imagination. I use the term alien as in "unidentified, unknown humans from a different planet."

NOR, do I believe we are currently being visited today by aliens.


The more we learn about science, the more we learn that everything is tied together. Something as simple as a gravity wave from a supernova billions of light years away can affect life on Earth. All those other stars and their planets are not just for show. They serve a purpose, and help to support life on Earth, however indirect that help might be. They don't have to support life themselves.

When you look at the symbiotic relationship between man, nature, and even planets/universe it's amazing life is sustainable at all. If it's all from a BIG BANG then what a crap shoot that was, huh? If it was designed and engineered, then what an extraordinary feat. Amazing, no matter how one views it.

If all the other planets are there to help support the Earth, then can this portion of the galaxy not be a support for other inhabited planets?


It's not impossible to think that. It's not even unreasonable to think that.

I'll rephrase then. It's impossible for me not to believe there's no intelligent human life on other planets.


Do you mean they seem alien to us because we don't understand them and can't duplicate them? That's a weak argument. We have no way of knowing if we will ever understand them, or if it's even possible for us to learn those things. Sure, we would like to learn things that would give us god-like abilities. We would like to think that technology will be able to solve every problem that exists, even death. But so far it seems that most advanced technology we have discovered only helps with 2 things - killing and multimedia. It seems to create more problems than it solves. Of course that is because we are the real problem. So nothing will ever change as long as we are in control.
And that, of course, leads us to God....

I don't think I made my thoughts understood on the alien machinations in heaven. Why are UFOs (as in the current pulp fiction sci-fi classification) called flying saucers? Because they represent a common shape that many today recognize as 'dining room place settings' ... aka, saucers.

We might see what Elijah was taken up to heaven in and call it that - a flying saucer. God's throne room? probably the same. It's that context I was trying to elaborate on when I said, "many of the machinations in the bible are alien like as we've come to understand them."

You'll have to forgive me. English is my first language. :D

Rai
22-08-10, 16:08
The virgin theory is very believable.
There are many animals that are able to spontaneously reproduce when the population gets out of whack. The females are able to produce offspring without fertilizing their eggs. It's called parthenogenesis.
Why couldn't it happen in a human?
http://www.findingdulcinea.com/features/science/environment/Parthenogenesis--When-Animals-Reproduce-Without-a-Mate.html
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/21/extra-chromosomes-allow-all-female-lizards-to-reproduce-without-males/



The dead sea scrolls have shown that with 2000 years of copying and translating the original writing is still intact. There are very few copy mistakes and they are easily detected and don't change the meaning of the passages.




To the first point: Yes, I've heard of that. And well, medical science has so far proven that humans can't do that - yet. Was human kind out of whack in Mary's time? Perhaps she was further advanced as a human being - or an alien :eek: (I'm kidding :p). I'm more inclined to go with the artificial insemination theory.


As for your second: well, I guess my knowledge isn't that great about the the translations. I don't even know that much about the dead sea scrolls. :o


kinda OT:

my art history teacher said that the Virgin Mary might not have actually been a virgin. when the Bible was translated, they used a synonym for 'young woman' to name her, but it was a word that wasnt used in English, and they might have confused it with 'virgin' and used that word instead.

has anyone else heard that before?

I've heard of this too, just can't remember where. Or at least a similar explanation that pointed out Mary may not have been a virgin after all.

I dunno really about all this, I'm just fascinated by possibilities.

knightgames
22-08-10, 16:13
I simply don't buy the idea that the earth was visited over and over by ancient aliens, interacted with us, gave us technology and then just vanished, never coming back to see "how we're doing."

It bothers me that I can't reconnect with some friends in high school. You would think an advanced culture would be rather interested in their "brainchild" (for want of a better term). What would be the point of visiting us only up to a certain point, then vanishing without a trace?


Does the amoeba understand it's being examined through a microscope?

(Since Wells said it so well (pun unintended), and I love continuing the reference from W.D.)

No one would have believed in the last years of the nineteenth century that this world was being watched keenly and closely by intelligences greater than man's and yet as mortal as his own; that as men busied themselves about their various concerns they were scrutinised and studied, perhaps almost as narrowly as a man with a microscope might scrutinise the transient creatures that swarm and multiply in a drop of water.

digitizedboy
22-08-10, 16:46
^ I'll go along with that.

Catracoth
22-08-10, 16:50
Properly fixed.

Hallelujah.

Capt. Murphy
22-08-10, 20:01
That's so strange, a few years ago I used to ALWAYS get sleep paralysis and see frightening images of crazy looking faces.. ?!

Here's something about that. I hope it helps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIMo84XkG5I



And something on topic...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bMmNjD1HA4

I have yet to watch all of it. :)

larafan25
22-08-10, 20:08
Here's something about that. I hope it helps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIMo84XkG5I



And something on topic...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bMmNjD1HA4


I have yet to watch all of it. :)

Both the links go to the sleep paralysis video.:)

Capt. Murphy
22-08-10, 20:32
Both the links go to the sleep paralysis video.:)

D'oh. :o

Thanks. Link fixed.

Dennis's Mom
22-08-10, 20:44
Does the amoeba understand it's being examined through a microscope?

No, but don't you think we'd talk to the amoeba if we could?

Aphrodite22
22-08-10, 20:45
Ouch, tuff crowd.

My point of view is that we have mistaken other beings for Gods.

There is tons to discuss by the way!

Who knows. I like that theory.

larafan25
22-08-10, 20:47
Here's something about that. I hope it helps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIMo84XkG5I



And something on topic...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bMmNjD1HA4

I have yet to watch all of it. :)

I'm having a hard time watching this video, the audio sucks, but also because his belief differs from mine, I'll hang in there though.

However in the first part, he is showing examples and how they say in very basic terms that so and so were taken with God, or went with God. Yet then he adds at the end that clearly they have gone to heaven.:pi:

Uzi master
22-08-10, 20:51
Indeed :D



Oops :p

TROUBLE MAKER


you caused trouble:ton:

larafan25
22-08-10, 21:01
This video is saying that the Lord appears with the chariot and flames and horses. Clearly there is a chariot, and horses, there are also flames and a wirlwind.

Elijah is not taken in the chariot of the horses he is taken in the wirlwind.

So perhaps there is a lot of wind being created by this form of transportation and he is pulled up by some sort of ray of light.

There is always a chance that a space craft has trhe appearence of a chariot, however the horses cannot be explained in any other way.:/

Also something I do not understand, God creates everything, and then we, simple mortals are able to go from chariots to aire planes and flying machines. If we can make these and more advanced transportation, then why the heck is God in a chariot? Yes it flies, and the horses clearly fly too, but I do not understand, why not get something a little faster.

I also don't like how this guy says "Perhpas this wirlwind event happened a little more" regarding all the people knowing this was going to happen. If he is allowing tat idea to breath in the bible, saying they simply were not recordedm then why can't something was recorded be interpreted and stretched?

Why doesn't God still abduct people?

Draco
22-08-10, 22:34
Your mind would fill in the blanks. There was a chariot so there must have been horses, but you didn't necessarily see them.

robm_2007
22-08-10, 22:36
The birth of Christ was supposed to be a miracle of God. It was meant to be a sign to prove that God did it.
An unmarried woman getting pregnant would not be a miracle (in fact it would be a sin punishable by death). A virgin getting pregnant would be a miracle.

So that "interpretation" simply doesn't fly. The bible clearly meant a virgin.

why was Mary still a virgin if she was already married? do they ever explain that?

i wasnt saying that i believed that the interpretation of the word virgin was misconstrued, i was just saying something that i heard.

Capt. Murphy
22-08-10, 22:46
why was Mary still a virgin if she was already married? do they ever explain that?

i wasnt saying that i believed that the interpretation of the word virgin was misconstrued, i was just saying something that i heard.

That is a myth (I suppose) or a fallacy of logic... The perpetual "virginity" of Mary. Jesus had biological siblings from Mary and Joseph after he was born/M&J were married.

larafan25
22-08-10, 23:16
That is a myth (I suppose) or a fallacy of logic... The perpetual "virginity" of Mary. Jesus had biological siblings from Mary and Joseph after he was born/M&J were married.

Wait, so are there ancestors of Jesus?

Was his last name actually Christ?

robm_2007
22-08-10, 23:19
Was his last name actually Christ?

in my art history class, my teacher said that it wasnt (or might not have been).

it derives from an Archaic Greek word for "leader" or "savior", or something like that.

i guess they gave it to Jesus more as a title, than an actual last name.

larafan25
22-08-10, 23:27
in my art history class, my teacher said that it wasnt (or might not have been).

it derives from an Archaic Greek word for "leader" or "savior", or something like that.

i guess they gave it to Jesus more as a title, than an actual last name.

I see....

If God made Jesus...wait...why is Jesus so special? I thought we were all the children of God?

robm_2007
22-08-10, 23:32
I see....

If God made Jesus...wait...why is Jesus so special? I thought we were all the children of God?

Jesus is more of a direct child of God, because God impregnated Mary.

in our time, God makes us, using a man and woman (or sperm and egg if it's invetro-fertilization or something).

Jesus was the one who died for our sins; which makes me wonder how sinful ppl were back then compared to now; i can only imagine that we are teetering on the verge of Apocalypse if God had to sacrifice His son back in those days becuase ppl were too sinful.

(of course, i dont read the Bible or go to curch, so my thoughts or ideas are basic info that i have or they are assumptions :))

larafan25
22-08-10, 23:39
Woah, wait, Jesus is born before God makes earth! D:

I am clearly a little confused.:o

Catracoth
22-08-10, 23:39
larafan25, sir you are confusing the hell out of me. :p

trlestew
22-08-10, 23:40
Woah, wait, Jesus is born before God makes earth! D:

I am clearly a little confused.:o

...
The Bible

read it.


:p

larafan25
22-08-10, 23:42
^I tried, too many words, it was like reading a different language. Brick testements for now.

larafan25, sir you are confusing the hell out of me. :p

I am getting very confused myself.

Jesus doesn't come for quite some time, because after God makes everything, people sin, and that is why he sends down Jesus, to pay for our sins. (Sucks to be Jesus).:pi:

You would think God would have done something during the scary time of the Nazis.:/

trlestew
22-08-10, 23:43
Well then...erm... your theory... nevermind.
I have nothing else to say now (Ignore this post :o )

larafan25
22-08-10, 23:48
No I had a brain fart that's all.

For some reason I thought Jesus came to earth and then bad stuff happened and it got destroyed...oh god, it was...

I understand now, I got it.:)

aktrekker
22-08-10, 23:54
Jesus existed before he was born into a body. He has always existed. It was Jesus who created the Earth.

I don't know why it's so hard to understand. Many people believe in an eternal spirit, past lives, etc. Why can't you accept Jesus always existing?

larafan25
22-08-10, 23:57
Jesus existed before he was born into a body. He has always existed. It was Jesus who created the Earth.

I don't know why it's so hard to understand. Many people believe in an eternal spirit, past lives, etc. Why can't you accept Jesus always existing?

Wait!!! Jesus created earth? I thought God created earth.

You guys are throwing me for a loop, I have never heard any of this!

Or is it because God is a divinity or somrthing, so if Jesus is a part of God then he is God because God divided by anything is always the same amount of God?

Lizard of Oz
23-08-10, 00:11
;4839374']
God = doesn't exist.
Aliens = they exist.

:)

I wouldn't put it so "as-a-matter-of-fact-ly," but those are basically my beliefs. I always wondered why some people who believe in god do not believe in Aliens. If you think there is an invisible man in the sky, an entity that created everything and it's everywhere, why can't you believe in beings who fly around in spaceships? OMG! Spaceships are real!! :rolleyes::D

Catracoth
23-08-10, 00:14
Wait!!! Jesus created earth? I thought God created earth.

Jesus is God. It's all one divine power. The Holy Trinity.

larafan25
23-08-10, 00:15
Jesus is God. It's all one divine power. The Holy Trinity.

Is a Holy Trinity only 2 people? To me it seems like it's 3.:/

Ward Dragon
23-08-10, 00:19
Is a Holy Trinity only 2 people? To me it seems like it's 3.:/

Third is the holy spirit.

larafan25
23-08-10, 00:22
Third is the holy spirit.

Oh yes, I often forget about or simply associate him directly with God, as in he is God, but like God, not just part of his devin-ness.

So, do each have a different purpose?

aktrekker
23-08-10, 00:22
I always wondered why some people who believe in god do not believe in Aliens.
I always wondered why people who can believe in aliens can't believe in God. :p

Whenever anyone says they believe in aliens it reminds me of a scene from Red Dwarf.

LISTER: What do you believe in, then? Do you believe in God?
RIMMER: God? Certainly not! What a preposterous thought! I believe in
aliens, Lister.
LISTER: Oh, right, fine. Something sensible at last.

larafan25
23-08-10, 00:25
I always wondered why people who can believe in aliens can't believe in God. :p

Whenever anyone says they believe in aliens it reminds me of a scene from Red Dwarf.

I think Aliens are easier to believe in, honestly.

I believe there is an insect on this planet that we have yet to discover, I am sure there are creatures at the bottom of the ocean that we have yet to discover. I am sure there are other beings in the universe who are just as intelligent as humans or even more intelligent.

However all of this being created by someone, I get stuck at a brick wall.

The idea of all this being natural seems very...flowy, like it has roots and everything evolves into stuff. Whereas with God, who created God? How is there just a God, it is truly the most mind baffeling idea in the world. How can something just be or come to be, I just can't understand it, but of course that doesn't mean It is not true. It's just so far over my head. O.O

aktrekker
23-08-10, 00:35
Whereas with God, who created God? How is there just a God, it is truly the most mind baffeling idea in the world. How can something just be or come to be, I just can't understand it, but of course that doesn't mean It is not true. It's just so far over my head. O.O
I attempted to give a very basic explanation in a previous post.
http://www.tombraiderforums.com/showpost.php?p=4840323&postcount=161

Draco
23-08-10, 00:36
I see....

If God made Jesus...wait...why is Jesus so special? I thought we were all the children of God?

Jesus wasn't any more special than any other prophet until the Catholic Church needed a justification not to be Jewish.

larafan25
23-08-10, 00:40
I attempted to give a very basic explanation in a previous post.
http://www.tombraiderforums.com/showpost.php?p=4840323&postcount=161

I still cannot understand God being outside of time and the universe.

Anywho I heard there is a very high probability of life other places in the universe, perhaps not in this specific galaxy, but in the universe there are probably ten thousand planets just like earth.

aktrekker
23-08-10, 00:49
I still cannot understand God being outside of time and the universe.
It's a very difficult concept. All we know is the universe, how can there be anything outside of it?
We are bound to time, even our brains are wired for the idea of time. How can we possibly understand being outside of time, eternity, and similar concepts?

But to show this isn't just a religious idea, here's an article from Discover magazine about the Multiverse theory.
http://discovermagazine.com/2008/dec/10-sciences-alternative-to-an-intelligent-creator

larafan25
23-08-10, 01:13
It's a very difficult concept. All we know is the universe, how can there be anything outside of it?
We are bound to time, even our brains are wired for the idea of time. How can we possibly understand being outside of time, eternity, and similar concepts?

But to show this isn't just a religious idea, here's an article from Discover magazine about the Multiverse theory.
http://discovermagazine.com/2008/dec/10-sciences-alternative-to-an-intelligent-creator

How....absolutely...mind numbingly...chaotic.

I love the theory though, but it is sooo...endless....unimaginable yet so realistic. D:

Draco
23-08-10, 01:50
The bigger the universe gets, the less the odds of god existing also get.

aktrekker
23-08-10, 01:56
Sorry, I find it impossible to follow that logic. Or did you not use logic to arrive at that conclusion?

Draco
23-08-10, 02:02
What possible reason could god have to create an entire set of universes with only one interesting planet?

Now that is just plain silly.

larafan25
23-08-10, 02:05
What possible reason could god have to create an entire set of universes with only one interesting planet?

Now that is just plain silly.

I'm sure there are other planets out there as interesting as earth.

Tyrannosaurus
23-08-10, 02:12
If God can't be quantified mathematically, then it's useless to talk about the odds of God's existence. The likelihood is either 100% or 0%.

Draco
23-08-10, 02:13
I'm sure there are other planets out there as interesting as earth.

Of course there are, but he believes that we are alone.

larafan25
23-08-10, 02:14
Of course there are, but he believes that we are alone.

Oh, well then yes, why would God create all that extra space. Why even create us.

Are we like, toys?

^Nobody needs to answer that BTW!:p

aktrekker
23-08-10, 02:25
You buy a large piece of land.
You plant most of the land with crops to feed yourself.
But in one small area you build a house and plant a special garden. That's where you live.

Same with the universe.
It's very large. Most of it is like a farm, planted with "crops" that feed us.
We live in one small area, a special garden in the middle of the universe.

It makes sense to me.

larafan25
23-08-10, 02:27
You buy a large piece of land.
You plant most of the land with crops to feed yourself.
But in one small area you build a house and plant a special garden. That's where you live.

Same with the universe.
It's very large. Most of it is like a farm, planted with "crops" that feed us.
We live in one small area, a special garden in the middle of the universe.

It makes sense to me.

Yet the multiple universes may all have different characteristics that cannot support life for us. How would they have resources for us?

Unless I am misunderstanding your point.

aktrekker
23-08-10, 02:38
If multiple universes exist they would obviously not be able to affect us (or could they:confused:).

But the multiverse theory is simply an attempt by scientists to eliminate the need for a creator. If you read the article it explains it pretty well. The idea was to have something "scientific" that has the same properties as God - outside the universe, outside time, eternal, responsible for the existence of the universe, not requiring a cause.

In any case we can only ever know our own universe. That is what my comments were based on.

larafan25
23-08-10, 02:40
If multiple universes exist they would obviously not be able to affect us (or could they:confused:).

But the multiverse theory is simply an attempt by scientists to eliminate the need for a creator. If you read the article it explains it pretty well. The idea was to have something "scientific" that has the same properties as God - outside the universe, outside time, eternal, responsible for the existence of the universe, not requiring a cause.

In any case we can only ever know our own universe. That is what my comments were based on.

So within our universe, we are alone, and the rest of the planets and galaxies are...gardens and farm land. However gardens and farm land have purpose. Do you think this extra space in our universe will ever have a purpose?

[Xmas]
23-08-10, 02:47
Do you think this extra space in our universe will ever have a purpose?How do you know it already doesn't have a purpose?

larafan25
23-08-10, 02:50
;4842850']How do you know it already doesn't have a purpose?

I was asking aktrekker as he said that is how he thought of the space around us, it doesn't need to be inhabited, it could be space simillar to gardens on a farm or something.

I'm sure it has a purpose now, I am sure there is a lot f other life in our universe right now.

knightgames
23-08-10, 03:14
Woah, wait, Jesus is born before God makes earth! D:

I am clearly a little confused.:o

Jesus and god are one, yet two distinct "individuals." They both created man and woman. He said, "Let us make man in our own image."

The plan of salvation was in place before man fell... a "plan B" if you will. And in that plan it was the intention for Jesus to sacrifice himself for man. In that plan there would be a time when he would be born as a child, taught, brought up and given free choice. There was no special powers afforded him until after his baptism, which he used to cure the sick, feed the hungry, raise the dead.

The Jews could have accepted Christ 2000 years ago, and had that happened the Kingdom of God would have transpired then. But..... they didn't.

aktrekker
23-08-10, 03:16
It does affect our life on Earth. It is all connected, the entire universe. There doesn't have to be other life out there for it to serve a useful purpose.
Conditions on Earth would not be suited to life if the entire universe did not form the way it did. All of the stars and planets, all of the dark matter and energy, everything influenced the formation of the Earth and life on it.
The entire universe was necessary in order for us to be here discussing this topic right now.

cbragg09
23-08-10, 05:13
Have you seen an alien for yourself?
Otherwise, I believe any idea of what an alien looks like is valid. :)

Note the word necessarily? That throws some doubt in to the mix. Nor did I say Ive ever seen an alien. Mkaythanks :rolleyes:


Besides, I believe in Jesus as our savior and that he died on the cross for us. I am, however, open minded enough to explore the possibilities. You should try that. If humans are the most intelligent creature in the universe, then I feel sorry for us. We do some incredibly great things as well as some exceptionally dumb things :)

Dennis's Mom
23-08-10, 12:33
Jesus doesn't come for quite some time, because after God makes everything, people sin, and that is why he sends down Jesus, to pay for our sins. (Sucks to be Jesus).:pi:

The timing of Jesus is not an accident. He was not "plan B"; he was always the plan. However, for him to succeed certain other things had to be in place.

1. Monotheistic people awaiting his arrival.
2. Common language (thank you Alexander the Great)
3. Infrastructure so people can move around freely (what have the Romans ever done for us? :p)

Back on topic, I see no reason that there aren't planets teeming with life all over the galaxy.

Draco
23-08-10, 14:31
It does affect our life on Earth. It is all connected, the entire universe. There doesn't have to be other life out there for it to serve a useful purpose.
Conditions on Earth would not be suited to life if the entire universe did not form the way it did. All of the stars and planets, all of the dark matter and energy, everything influenced the formation of the Earth and life on it.
The entire universe was necessary in order for us to be here discussing this topic right now.

So we are the center of the universe now? And I thought I was arrogant.

knightgames
23-08-10, 16:34
The timing of Jesus is not an accident. He was not "plan B"; he was always the plan.


I didn't want to get into the whole "god knew the end from the beginning thing," and he knew man would fall. After all we don't raise our children with the hope they'll be monsterous adults or criminals, but it could happen. Perchance...maybe... just quite possibly man might have made the right decision and the plan of salvation wouldn't have been necessary. We all know how that went.

IOW. I wasn't being literal when I said "plan B". :D

Dennis's Mom
23-08-10, 17:20
I don't want to get into anything either. http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y97/LisaB1138/smilies/57.gif I do think there's reasons Jesus appeared when he did though, and I thought I'd point them out.

IceColdLaraCroft
23-08-10, 17:33
I've been watching too much Pixar I thought this was Aliens VS. the bible

Catracoth
23-08-10, 17:37
I've been watching too much Pixar I thought this was Aliens VS. the bible

:vlol:

Surely would have been a much more interesting topic.

IceColdLaraCroft
23-08-10, 17:49
Carbon based life form locally known as "jebes" has acquired the quantonium

knightgames
23-08-10, 18:18
I don't want to get into anything either. http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y97/LisaB1138/smilies/57.gif I do think there's reasons Jesus appeared when he did though, and I thought I'd point them out.


Works for me.

silver_wolf
23-08-10, 18:22
I don't want to get into anything either. http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y97/LisaB1138/smilies/57.gif I do think there's reasons Jesus appeared when he did though, and I thought I'd point them out.
If you really examine history, Jesus appearing when he did makes perfect sense.:D