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Avalon SARL
09-11-10, 19:20
I received this e-mail recently from "Order of Engineers" at my country,
It is quite shocking and interesting at the same time :eek:

More girls are reaching puberty at a younger age, often as early as 7 or 8, according to a new study.

Published today in Pediatrics, the study links the alarming trend to rising levels of obesity and environmental chemicals found in everyday items-- like water bottles and makeup-- that mimic estrogen.

Dr. Frank Biro, lead author of the study and director of adolescent medicine at Cincinnati Children's Hospital Medical Center, told the New York Times: "It's certainly throwing up a warning flag... I think we need to think about the stuff we're exposing our bodies to and the bodies of our kids."

Obesity is cited as a major factor, because body fat produces estrogen, which in turn triggers breast development and menstruation. But he also suggests the role of endocrine-disrupting chemicals like Bisphenol-A (BPA), which is used to make the plastics in water bottles and baby bottles. In January 2010, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration raised concerns over the widespread use of BPA's in consumer products, but so far little has been done to regulate its usage.

The study measures puberty as the start of breast development, the most ostensible sign of puberty in girls. Biro's team took breast measurements of 1,239 girls aged 6 to 9 living in San Francisco Bay area, greater Cincinnati and East Harlem in New York. Each age group was made up of 30% each whites, blacks and Hispanics, and 5% Asians.

According to the study's abstract, at 7 years old, 10.4% of whites, 23.4% of blacks and 14.9% of Hispanic girls were developing breasts. At 8 years, the figures increased to 18.3%, 42.9% and 30.9%, respectively.

Interestingly, these proportions increased the most among whites when compared to 10 years ago, the study says. A Time magazine article questions exactly how young puberty can start -- and why this matters.
The fact that the onset of puberty has not shifted earlier among African-American girls over the last decade, says Biro, may simply reflect the fact that they have reached the minimum biological age at which sexual development can occur. "How young can you go? Maybe white populations have not arrived at that biologic minimum," he says.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/08/09/puberty-hits-girls-as-you_n_676020.html

xXhayleyroxXx
09-11-10, 19:43
Woa thats... insightful. I started at 12/13 I think. 0_0

robm_2007
09-11-10, 19:46
I was 15 when puberty hit.

but I wasnt a girl at the time, and im not one.................anymore.

Little-Lara
09-11-10, 20:52
It's not plastic.....it has been used for many years back.

It's milk and chicken stuffed with hormone products.

xXhayleyroxXx
09-11-10, 20:54
It's not plastic.....it has been used for many years back.

It's milk and chicken stuffed with hormone products.

Yep I'm backing that up :tmb:

Lizard of Oz
09-11-10, 21:01
I imagine how hard it must be for them!

And yeah, I think it's happening because of the carelessness of humans (hormones in processed meat, etc.)

robm_2007
09-11-10, 21:05
Is this the same chicken that makes men in Chile (or some other SA country) gay?

:pi:

Chocola teapot
09-11-10, 21:09
Is this the same chicken that makes men in Chile (or some other SA country) gay?

:pi:

You're gonna wish you hadn't said that.

ultima espio
09-11-10, 21:13
It's not plastic.....it has been used for many years back.

It's milk and chicken stuffed with hormone products.

Yeah, I've heard that too.

Apparently regular tap water has oestrogen in it from Women taking the pill. At least that's what my teacher said when I was at school.

Tony9595
09-11-10, 21:14
Is this the same chicken that makes men in Chile (or some other SA country) gay?

:pi:

:vlol:

:D

EmeraldFields
09-11-10, 21:16
That's quite young! I think I started puberty around 12.

Horus-Goddess
09-11-10, 21:16
I didn't hit puberty until 13 if I remember right... but back then it was expected that as young as 10 you could. 7 or something is really really young though, it's quite surprising.

But yeah I'd attribute it to the stuff in food we eat these days... all the fast food and crap definitely doesn't help much. Then the hormones and things they pump into meats ... Just not good overall really. Not just in terms of puberty.

Melonie Tomb Raider
09-11-10, 21:18
It's not plastic.....it has been used for many years back.

It's milk and chicken stuffed with hormone products.

This is true.

I hit puberty at about 13 or 14. Girls are hitting it so much younger these days, though. I know of a girl who did at 8 years old. :eek:

Minty Mouth
09-11-10, 21:24
Perhaps puperty isn't becoming oddly onset, rather, in the past few decades/centuries we made it particularly offset, and now it's going back to normal. Just throwing that out there :p

robm_2007
09-11-10, 21:33
You're gonna wish you hadn't said that.

No I wont. :wve:

I got one person to laugh, or at least humor me buy pretending to laugh over the internet.
*
I was referencing the thread on here, that had an article where some South American President was saying that the chicken there had too many female hormones, thus causing men to become gay. :pi:

i was making fun of it, and asking if they were the same chickens :p

*He's my evidence:
:vlol:

:D

Chocola teapot
09-11-10, 21:43
No I wont. :wve:

I got one person to laugh, or at least humor me buy pretending to laugh over the internet.
*
I was referencing the thread on here, that had an article where some South American President was saying that the chicken there had too many female hormones, thus causing men to become gay. :pi:

i was making fun of it, and asking if they were the same chickens :p

*He's my evidence:

Right, I'd asumed it was a snide and ignorant comment towards Homosexuals...

And That there'd be SOME EPIC DRAMA.

You MUST add white text. :p

Scurvy
09-11-10, 21:46
oooo WHITE text, hahaha :vlol:

Chocola teapot
09-11-10, 21:47
Yep, The ':pi:' made it look more like a sly comment rather than a joking one.

[Xmas]
09-11-10, 21:52
Yep, The ':pi:' made it look more like a sly comment rather than a joking one.So everytime I want to post a 'sly' comment, I should post ':pi:' smiley, right? :D

robm_2007
09-11-10, 21:52
Right, I'd asumed it was a snide and ignorant comment towards Homosexuals...

And That there'd be SOME EPIC DRAMA.

You MUST add white text. :p

Yep, The ':pi:' made it look more like a sly comment rather than a joking one.

Just kidding! i totally hate all homosexual chickens

Encore
09-11-10, 21:54
http://i45.************/2v1u4qh.jpg

Cochrane
09-11-10, 22:02
Just kidding! i totally hate all homosexual chickens
Stop being so ignorant! It doesn’t matter who someone loves when you’re eating them

Perhaps puperty isn't becoming oddly onset, rather, in the past few decades/centuries we made it particularly offset, and now it's going back to normal. Just throwing that out there :p
Interesting thought, could be. In many historic societies, girls were married at extremely early ages, after all, and expected to produce children pretty much right from the start. I guess we’d need more data, though.

Mad Tony
09-11-10, 22:05
What exactly signifies the start of puberty anyway, and when does it end?

Cochrane
09-11-10, 22:08
In this study they used the start of breast growth. No idea how it is measured for males, or how the end is marked in either case.

Encore
09-11-10, 22:14
Perhaps puperty isn't becoming oddly onset, rather, in the past few decades/centuries we made it particularly offset, and now it's going back to normal. Just throwing that out there :p


Interesting thought, could be. In many historic societies, girls were married at extremely early ages, after all, and expected to produce children pretty much right from the start. I guess we’d need more data, though.

Problem is, if you're really gonna be serious about this argument, you'll have to define what's normal and what isn't. Otherwise, all you have is varying trends, which makes much more sense to me since apparently there are many factors that can influence the start of puberty.

Cochrane
09-11-10, 22:20
True; I guess the term normal doesn’t hold much weight here. But there may be different trends (or not, as I said I don’t have any data), and I think that may still be interesting.

aurora89
09-11-10, 22:26
It's not plastic.....it has been used for many years back.

It's milk and chicken stuffed with hormone products.

that's definitely a factor, but certain chemicals in plastic have also been linked to hormonal problems too.

I developed breasts at 7 or 8, could not function without a bra by 9, and experienced menarche right after I turned 10.

cbragg09
10-11-10, 00:38
I hit puberty at like 13-14

leglion
10-11-10, 01:10
I hit puberty sooner than anyone has listed so far. I hit puberty at 9.

aurora89
10-11-10, 02:21
I hit puberty sooner than anyone has listed so far. I hit puberty at 9.

Did you miss the part where I said I started hitting puberty at 7? :confused:

robm_2007
10-11-10, 02:34
Did you miss the part where I said I started hitting puberty at 7? :confused:

He's trying to One-Up everyone else, it seems. Or just posting out of nowhere adn not noticing posts that would make his puberty age not as exciting.

Little-Lara
10-11-10, 03:20
Yeah, I've heard that too.

Apparently regular tap water has oestrogen in it from Women taking the pill. At least that's what my teacher said when I was at school.

that's definitely a factor, but certain chemicals in plastic have also been linked to hormonal problems too.

I developed breasts at 7 or 8, could not function without a bra by 9, and experienced menarche right after I turned 10.

I'm gonna try to find out about these bottles and tap-water. Water is a tricky business though, cause I keep hearing the rumors that some are actually "bottled" tap-water. And I gave up on commercial bottles (Rubbermaid reusable bottles for me.)....(and glass-bottles for my future child...)

amaris
10-11-10, 03:33
Interesting indeed. :p

I hit puberty at around 12-13, which seems to be rather normal. :p (For guys at least, but idk, this whole 7 and 8 thing is just weird! :o)

aurora89
10-11-10, 06:12
I'm gonna try to find out about these bottles and tap-water. Water is a tricky business though, cause I keep hearing the rumors that some are actually "bottled" tap-water. And I gave up on commercial bottles (Rubbermaid reusable bottles for me.)....(and glass-bottles for my future child...)

Yeah, I only use Nalgene or other BPA-free bottle. I have enough hormonal crap going on with my pituitary damaged and my genes not working right! I also try to avoid animal products, especially when they're not organic. My doctor said any break I can give my body in the hormone department will help, and that just makes sense to me...

leglion
10-11-10, 09:51
Did you miss the part where I said I started hitting puberty at 7? :confused:

Ah sorry i missed your post. :p

He's trying to One-Up everyone else, it seems.
Nope. My wording suggests that I knew someone would come along sooner or later that started before me. Besides, I was just stating a fact.

Shark_Blade
10-11-10, 11:28
I thought average girls hit puberty around 9 and boys around 15, so this is not really surprising to me.

Now if a girl hits around 5 or 6, then I'll raise an eye brow.

interstellardave
10-11-10, 11:34
When I was a teenager 15-17 was not unusual for girls, I believe. This trend has been going on for decades now. I think it's a combination of things like hormones as well as plastics (I've read articles about both). Fascinating, really... and it does seem to be more pronounced in girls.

tampi
10-11-10, 11:38
If I thought that someone close to me, reached puberty at age seven, I don't know what I could do. :pi:

I thought about this thread yesterday.
I wanted to say:
"I reached puberty 13 or 12 or 14 years, I don't remember it. My nipples ached and were stiff, my armpits itched me like crazy"


I'm a man.http://img547.imageshack.us/img547/5720/rockw.gif (http://img547.imageshack.us/i/rockw.gif/)





Oh, sorry, but it is a fact.:o

patriots88888
10-11-10, 12:12
According to Merriam Webster's Dictionary (which I trust as the best source for official definition)...

pu·ber·ty noun \ˈpyü-bər-tē\
Definition of PUBERTY
1: the condition of being or the period of becoming first capable of reproducing sexually marked by maturing of the genital organs, development of secondary sex characteristics, and in the human and in higher primates by the first occurrence of menstruation in the female
2: the age at which puberty occurs often construed legally as 14 in boys and 12 in girls

...I fail to see how puberty at age 7 is even possible. :/ Is it actually possible for a child (because that's what a 7 year old is in actuality) to have developed his/her reproductive organs to this extent? I guess it's easier to conceive (believe me, no pun intended) for females, but for males, I really have a difficult time believing this could be possible.

I've always believed that in simplest terms, it meant the age at which one became aware (both physically and mentally) of their sexuality... that being in the sense of physical attraction towards others.

All I can say is, I must be really behind the times because when I was at that age, age 12 for girls and age 13 for boys was the norm and I still believe it is. I believe these are extreme cases and are not any indication of 'changing times' or trends.

interstellardave
10-11-10, 12:17
About 15 years ago we were visiting friends and I looked out back and saw this super-busty girl in the pool next door. Well, as most guys would, I was checking out that rack; yeah I figured she was probably young--but young as in 16, I thought--until our friend said "better watch out, that girl is 9!" :o

That was 15 years ago (or thereabouts)! This is a trend, not an aberration.

The Great Chi
10-11-10, 12:44
Exterminated message :D

patriots88888
10-11-10, 12:50
About 15 years ago we were visiting friends and I looked out back and saw this super-busty girl in the pool next door. Well, as most guys would, I was checking out that rack; yeah I figured she was probably young--but young as in 16, I thought--until our friend said "better watch out, that girl is 9!" :o

That was 15 years ago (or thereabouts)! This is a trend, not an aberration.

Breast development isn't what I would consider the same as having physical attraction towards another... and certainly not equal to having the mental/emotional capacity to do so. I guess it all depends on how one chooses to define puberty. By my previous definition, I definitely would have to disagree with you.

interstellardave
10-11-10, 13:21
Breast development isn't what I would consider the same as having physical attraction towards another... and certainly not equal to having the mental/emotional capacity to do so. I guess it all depends on how one chooses to define puberty. By my previous definition, I definitely would have to disagree with you.

Actually the definition you quoted is all about development of the physical characteristics; as for "physical attraction" I don't know, but when the body is ready for sex the desire has to come with it, I would think. It's all part of the changing hormones. If or how anyone can deal with it emotionally when it happens--especially so young--is a real problem but doesn't change the fact that it has, in fact, happened.

aurora89
10-11-10, 13:27
Yeah, puberty is all about the physical changes. It has nothing to do with being emotionally ready for sex or self-aware of one's sexuality, even though those things often happen at the same time if the person is the right age when puberty hits. Even though I started developing at 7, was a size C or D by age 9, and started my period less than a month after I turned 10, I was definitely well into year 11 before I started having my perverted lesbian fantasies and discovering my sexual side. :p And I wasn't ready to have sex or figure out/accept my sexuality until somewhere between 18 and 20.

I think people typically go through the emotional puberty you're describing around the same age, i.e. 11-15, regardless of when their body decides to change.

interstellardave
10-11-10, 13:34
Hmmm... maybe there is somewhat of a "lag" between physical changes and the development of attractions and desires... it's been a long time since that happened to me, and I'm a guy, too. I don't know if that means anything; all these stories are focused on girls.

patriots88888
10-11-10, 13:45
Actually the definition you quoted is all about development of the physical characteristics; as for "physical attraction" I don't know, but when the body is ready for sex the desire has to come with it, I would think. It's all part of the changing hormones. If or how anyone can deal with it emotionally when it happens--especially so young--is a real problem but doesn't change the fact that it has, in fact, happened.

I was referring to how I choose to define it... I've always believed that in simplest terms, it meant the age at which one became aware (both physically and mentally) of their sexuality... that being in the sense of physical attraction towards others. It seems many are so focused on strictly the physical changes/development that they often overlook the other factors that are of importance in defining puberty in a complete sense.

aurora89
10-11-10, 13:50
I was referring to how I choose to define it... It seems many are so focused on strictly the physical changes/development that they often overlook the other factors that are of importance in defining puberty in a complete sense.

Yes, that is a factor, but that's not what the scientists from this study are focusing on. You're just muddling the issue for yourself (and maybe others).

Physical changes are happening earlier and earlier in girls, and researchers are concerned about the physical reasons for this to be happening so much earlier now than it used to be. Especially because precocious physical puberty has been linked to certain health problems later on in women's lives.

If a social scientist wanted to study some emotional aspect of puberty, that would be interesting and probably helpful, but puberty is defined by the physical/hormonal changes that go on in someone's body during their teen/pre-teen years.

interstellardave
10-11-10, 14:03
I was referring to how I choose to define it... It seems many are so focused on strictly the physical changes/development that they often overlook the other factors that are of importance in defining puberty in a complete sense.

Don't get me wrong, that's an important part of it... that's why I actually brought this issue up in another recent topic. Girls physically maturing at earlier ages can cause big problems for them emotionally. Issues that teenage girls have had to deal with in the past (how to deal with the physical changes, unwanted attention from men, etc) might now be faced by girls at even younger ages. They are woefully unprepared unless parents and others help them through it.

Encore
10-11-10, 14:03
According to Merriam Webster's Dictionary (which I trust as the best source for official definition)...



...I fail to see how puberty at age 7 is even possible. :/ Is it actually possible for a child (because that's what a 7 year old is in actuality) to have developed his/her reproductive organs to this extent? I guess it's easier to conceive (believe me, no pun intended) for females, but for males, I really have a difficult time believing this could be possible.

I've always believed that in simplest terms, it meant the age at which one became aware (both physically and mentally) of their sexuality... that being in the sense of physical attraction towards others.

All I can say is, I must be really behind the times because when I was at that age, age 12 for girls and age 13 for boys was the norm and I still believe it is. I believe these are extreme cases and are not any indication of 'changing times' or trends.

When speaking to doctors, they have always used the first menstruation to define when I started puberty, which makes perfect sense because (if you're a girl) that's what really indicates that you're ready to begin reproducing. From a medical standpoint it's difficult to define puberty solely through psychological criteria, as it's not easy to know exactly when you begin feeling sexually attracted (for example, a lot of very young children will appear to simulate sexual curiosity when in reality they don't know exactly what they're doing - for instance playing with naked Ken and Barbie :D).

However, there are two sides to this issue which I think it's important to separate: one is the medical side, the other is the social/legal side. From a legal standpoint I believe the psychological element (sexual awareness and maturity) IS fundamental. And considering the complexities of the human mind, it's blind and ignorant to completely ignore such factors. The impact of sexual experiences in children who aren't mentally prepared to deal with them is devastating, as numerous examples have shown. These children often become severely traumatized and many move on to abuse other people when they grow up. This alone is an indication that the issue shouldn't be taken lightly. We're not just animals anymore, guided by our biology. If we were, everything would be much simpler.

patriots88888
10-11-10, 14:04
Yes, that is a factor, but that's not what the scientists from this study are focusing on. You're just muddling the issue for yourself (and maybe others).

I posted the official definition for that reason, because I realize and understand that it is the widely accepted one, however I don't feel like it defines all aspects of it. Of course, that is just a matter of how I personally see it. To continue in more detail, I happen to disagree with the notion that girls who start to develop breasts at such an early age (before age 12) that it automatically means that they have hit puberty. I believe to define it as such, is limiting the entire scope of the very definition.

Avalon SARL
10-11-10, 14:15
^^^
If this process had no consequences in the future, it would be considered something normal, because though evolving is how we continue spreading

Too bad, scientists realized that this will cause later problems, which is not safe and the reasons behind this must be very well examined and given some sort of solution

Squibbly
10-11-10, 14:48
I first got my period when I was seven, and I had fully developed breasts by the time I was ten-eleven or so. I was not at all, by any means, "mature" at this point. The stage my body was at was entirely opposite to where my mind was. Maturity isn't only about your body.

When speaking to doctors, they have always used the first menstruation to define when I started puberty, which makes perfect sense because (if you're a girl) that's what really indicates that you're ready to begin reproducing. From a medical standpoint it's difficult to define puberty solely through psychological criteria, as it's not easy to know exactly when you begin feeling sexually attracted (for example, a lot of very young children will appear to simulate sexual curiosity when in reality they don't know exactly what they're doing - for instance playing with naked Ken and Barbie :D).

However, there are two sides to this issue which I think it's important to separate: one is the medical side, the other is the social/legal side. From a legal standpoint I believe the psychological element (sexual awareness and maturity) IS fundamental. And considering the complexities of the human mind, it's blind and ignorant to completely ignore such factors. The impact of sexual experiences in children who aren't mentally prepared to deal with them is devastating, as numerous examples have shown. These children often become severely traumatized and many move on to abuse other people when they grow up. This alone is an indication that the issue shouldn't be taken lightly. We're not just animals anymore, guided by our biology. If we were, everything would be much simpler.

Fully agree with all of the above. Pretty well everything I would have said if I continued with my post without noticing this. :tmb:

Dark Lugia 2
10-11-10, 16:16
Puberty has always been defined as starting with physical changes. When a person enters puberty the body changes, hence the definition. Yes psychological aspects come in later - but thats just a part of process, not the start.

robm_2007
10-11-10, 16:33
Considering i live in the city with the highest teen pregnancy rate in the US (:whi:), i wonder if the girls here will develop faster, and we can be "upgraded" to having the highest Childhood pregnancy Rate in the US :pi:

i seriously hope not, but the teens here seem to be drug-crazed skanks.

NRO.
10-11-10, 16:46
(hormones in processed meat, etc.)

Well, that explains many things.

jackles
10-11-10, 16:49
There is also the issue of nutrition. Years ago we didn't have so much junk food and stuff. (I can barely remember eating chips as a kid unless it was a special treat) Puberty also has a basis in body weight. Periods tended not to start until you reach a certain level of weight. Hence historically girls started much later because they were smaller and skinnier. Many year 6 girls at our school are taller (and indeed heavier)than I am now. Is this weight gain an additional result of earlier puberty.


As an eleven year old I was like a rake with breasts. It was horrible. Excitable teenage boys hit on me, I was groped without my consent and generally treated as if I was nothing but a pair of breasts. No way was I able to handle the level of attention that I recieved at that age.

Squibbly
10-11-10, 16:58
There is also the issue of nutrition. Years ago we didn't have so much junk food and stuff. (I can barely remember eating chips as a kid unless it was a special treat) Puberty also has a basis in body weight. Periods tended not to start until you reach a certain level of weight. Hence historically girls started much later because they were smaller and skinnier. Many year 6 girls at our school are taller (and indeed heavier)than I am now. Is this weight gain an additional result of earlier puberty.


As an eleven year old I was like a rake with breasts. It was horrible. Excitable teenage boys hit on me, I was groped without my consent and generally treated as if I was nothing but a pair of breasts. No way was I able to handle the level of attention that I recieved at that age.

I think this could have a lot to do with it, definitely.

I know how you felt, too. I was a thin kid but I had breasts. School was not fun. Boys were jerks towards me, and girls hated me, possibly due to the extra attention I received. It's beyond me why anyone would want that kind of attention, though.

lara c. fan
10-11-10, 17:01
It's beyond me why anyone would want that kind of attention, though.

It might be the fact that it isn't there for them... They wouldn't know what that kind of attention entailed, and hey, it's attention. Most kids are going to want it, no matter what they say.

jackles
10-11-10, 17:05
But for a young girl there is no choice. You get attention if you have the obvious signs of a developing body.

lara c. fan
10-11-10, 17:09
But for a young girl there is no choice. You get attention if you have the obvious signs of a developing body.

Maybe so, but some would naturally get more attention than others.