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Polak
19-05-11, 19:47
Because I live in Britain I here a lot of discussion on this but what do you think about it? This might not apply only to Britain, also the USA and possibly some other countries.

My opinion is that they are to some degree. While I know some of the jobs taken by immigrants are jobs that a lot of British people do not want to do anyone and many British people do claim benefits and have no intention of going to work, I still do feel that now with so many immigrants who are willing to work hard for very little money, sometimes unofficially for lower than the minimum wage, it makes it so much harder to get a job for someone that is originally from the country. For the immigrants the low pay is still a lot in their country so they give someone that lives permanently in this country very little chance to compete with them in going for a job. This also means employers are now very greedy, they want people to be able to do a lot for very little money.

Alpharaider47
19-05-11, 19:51
Immigrants, not exactly. Illegal immigrants, most definitely.

TombRaiderLover
19-05-11, 19:52
This "woe is me, I hate the immigrants, they're stealing all our jobs" attitude bores me. I don't see the need to divide the planet through labeling different countries. I think people should live wherever they want. If you don't like it, tough.

TippingWater
19-05-11, 19:52
This "woe is me, I hate the immigrants, they're stealing all our jobs" attitude bores me. I don't see the need to divide the planet through labeling different countries. I think people should live wherever they want. If you don't like it, tough.

Exactly!:tmb:

Polak
19-05-11, 19:53
I think that is a very simplistic view. Just like saying it is the fault of the foreigners they are stealing jobs, saying it is fine and people need to stop whining about it is just the same.

jajay119
19-05-11, 19:54
No, they're not, one of the great advantages of being part of the European Union is the vast amount of work opertunities that that door opens up. Jobs do not belong to anyone, the person best suited to the job gets it and I think this whole 'immigrants stealing jobs' thing was invented by sore brits who are jealous that a foreigner was considered better than them.

Ok so there are a lot of black market jobs that immigrants will get because they will do it cheaper than native workers, but they are not to blame for that. The employers are. Not to mention it is the immigrants, in main, who do all the jobs in Britain that the brits thought they were too good to do before the recent troubles, now because they're having a hard time of it they want those menial labour jobs that immigrants have been doing for years? No, sorry!

Legend 4ever
19-05-11, 19:56
I don't think so. What I think is crazy is letting people study in your country, providing them with a great education and a respected diploma and then sending them back instead of keeping them so that they would eventually give back to your country with their knowledge and work.

Another Lara
19-05-11, 19:56
I don't think it's that much of a problem... I mean, if there are people who want to come to this country to work and earn money for their family, then fine; good luck to them! It's the people who come into this country illegally and start demanding something for nothing that really pisses me off!:mad:

jajay119
19-05-11, 19:57
I don't think so. What I think is crazy is letting people study in your country, providing them with a great education and a respected diploma and then sending them back instead of keeping them so that they would eventually give back to your country with their knowledge and work.

As long as they're from withing the EU it doesn't really matter, there will be funding of some sort and better economy for and EU country from UK education benefits the entire Union, not just that country.

Polak
19-05-11, 20:01
jayjay I think you miss the point a little. The pound is the strongest currency in the world [I think, or one of the strongest.] If someone moves here and intends to live here permanently that is one thing but if they are here for a few years to earn money and then leave and be well off in their own country it practicallt gives British competitors for jobs no chance as they are always going to be undercut by the immigrant who is happy to take less money. I do know some Brits are lazy but what about those who want a job but have no chance of obtaining one because of this reason I gave you?

trXD
19-05-11, 20:04
I don't know what makes people in first world countries think they deserve more than others, people who live in poverty and disease come here to have a chance in life and the British say "You're stealing our jobs, poor us".

IceColdLaraCroft
19-05-11, 20:05
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jajay119
19-05-11, 20:05
jayjay I think you miss the point a little. The pound is the strongest currency in the world [I think, or one of the strongest.] If someone moves here and intends to live here permanently that is one thing but if they are here for a few years to earn money and then leave and be well off in their own country it practicallt gives British competitors for jobs no chance as they are always going to be undercut by the immigrant who is happy to take less money. I do know some Brits are lazy but what about those who want a job but have no chance of obtaining one because of this reason I gave you?


I already gave you an answer to that question, it's the fault of the employer, they could hire British nationals for the job but they choose to hire immigrants who are willing to take a lower wage because that is what they are used to!


And on the topic of people coming to the UK to make a quick buck then leaving, it doesn't seem to be a problem when Brits do it then swan off to spain to build a house and open a bar. Double standards is what it is.

xXhayleyroxXx
19-05-11, 20:22
I don't think it's that much of a problem... I mean, if there are people who want to come to this country to work and earn money for their family, then fine; good luck to them! It's the people who come into this country illegally and start demanding something for nothing that really pisses me off!:mad:

This >:I

Simochka
19-05-11, 20:31
It's hard to find a job and apartment in Sweden. But still they are pumping in thousands and thousands of immigrants. Sadly I'm against it and I don't support it at all.

They are also lacking money in day care, schools, hospitals, nursing homes but still they can afford billions for immigrants.

Mad Tony
19-05-11, 20:42
As long as they're from withing the EU it doesn't really matter, there will be funding of some sort and better economy for and EU country from UK education benefits the entire Union, not just that country.One of the many reasons why I don't like the EU.

I don't think it's that much of a problem... I mean, if there are people who want to come to this country to work and earn money for their family, then fine; good luck to them! It's the people who come into this country illegally and start demanding something for nothing that really pisses me off!:mad:I agree with this. Nothing wrong with the former but definitely the latter. The worst thing about it is the government (past and present) seem to treat the latter group better.

Polak
19-05-11, 20:44
This is what I mean. I am not fully British although I understand the situation. Countries should be taking care of situations in them first and not constantly taking in immigrants with tough situations. I know third world countries have problems but truth is a lot of them have terrible leaders that take any money meant for the country, in to their pockets. This example concerns the EU though and legal immigrants from it. Actually I am sceptical about the whole 'one Europe' situation and breaking down the boarders stuff. I wonder who it is really supposed to serve.

Cochrane
19-05-11, 21:13
I wouldn't say "steal", but immigrants do compete with locals for jobs. There are definitely people who are jobless now and wouldn't be if it weren't for immigrants. But I think the number is far lower than many people would think, and it's far more complicated than just immigration.

Generally, immigrants are really at a disadvantage, because many (not all, of course) have poorer language skills and skills certifications that are not as easily accepted in the host country. If they manage to win jobs regardless, then it's because they offer advantages over local workers. These can be better education (for many jobs, someone with a university degree from Italy is far better qualified than a british person without a degree) or the willingness to work for wages that locals cannot or do not want to accept.

All of these are really not problems with the immigrants, but with the host country. If a country needs qualified workers, but does not have enough, then its education system is at fault; not the immigrants who actually solve the problem. If a business is allowed to pay wages that are simply too low for locals to accept for a given work, then it is the business that is at fault. You could, if you are conservative, argue that the problem may also be all those working-class idiots who are too lazy to work for honest (but very little) money. Either way, though, the immigrants are not the problem. They are a solution to the underlying issue, but probably not the best one.

The impact on the overall economy of the country is also hard to measure. Yes, the own people have less purchasing power, but at the same time workers who work for less or whose education has been paid by other societies are a huge advantage.

CiaKonwerski
19-05-11, 21:22
This "woe is me, I hate the immigrants, they're stealing all our jobs" attitude bores me. I don't see the need to divide the planet through labeling different countries. I think people should live wherever they want. If you don't like it, tough.

If people want to live in our country they should do it the legal way and not be given any special benefits.

Mad Tony
19-05-11, 21:25
If people want to live in our country they should do it the legal way and not be given any special benefits.I don't think that's what he meant but at the same time I don't agree with the "let everyone live wherever they want" thing.

DragonSlayer
19-05-11, 21:33
Because I live in Britain I here a lot of discussion on this but what do you think about it? This might not apply only to Britain, also the USA and possibly some other countries.

My opinion is that they are to some degree. While I know some of the jobs taken by immigrants are jobs that a lot of British people do not want to do anyone and many British people do claim benefits and have no intention of going to work, I still do feel that now with so many immigrants who are willing to work hard for very little money, sometimes unofficially for lower than the minimum wage, it makes it so much harder to get a job for someone that is originally from the country. For the immigrants the low pay is still a lot in their country so they give someone that lives permanently in this country very little chance to compete with them in going for a job. This also means employers are now very greedy, they want people to be able to do a lot for very little money.

Not to appear rascist or whatever, but that is exactly what is happening and it's not just in Britain it's happening everywhere, i remember ex-pm Gordon Brown saying British jobs for British workers in the run up to the election, when he didn't follow through on that, there was a lot of understandable anger about that, i'm not surprised about that, i'd be :cen: if an Irish politician said that and then did a u-turn he would be thrown out of the frying pan and into the fire.

Mr.Burns
19-05-11, 23:45
And I see the troll is back. Okay, I'll bite.

One problem is when you have overseas workers or illegals, or new immigrants that are willing to do a job at a mere fraction of what a native would ask for. Bit hard to compete with that.

Here's an article featuring Mike Rowe from "Dirty Jobs". Not quite on the line as this topic but still an interesting read.

http://money.cnn.com/2011/05/18/news/economy/mike_rowe_dirty_jobs/

larafan25
19-05-11, 23:49
How do you steal a job?:confused:

Tombraiderx08
20-05-11, 00:09
How do you steal a job?:confused:
People are just upset that big businesses would much rather employ foreigners or immigrants (legal or otherwise) who will work for less, than natural born American citizens.

domino92
20-05-11, 00:39
Okay:

Almost every corporation or company, is responsible for everything made with a neat little TM behind, and those are in third world countries, or other foreign soils. Look at your computer right now. Likely it says Japan on it. Now at your clothes. Taiwan I imagine. Now whatever trinkets you have nearby. Chances are they say Made in China.

How did I do that?

Well there's this little thing called outsourcing, where American companys take their factories overseas or down south, build a cheaper factory, pay it's worker's wages that would get you a few Fuzzy Peaches at the store, and then import everything to America and Canada with statements like, "Good old fashioned American/Canadian products."

See, here's where you come in, yes you my friend! You find all of these clothes and laptops and trinkets and you buy them and become happy with them! You end up supporting labour in other countries, which may or may not include sweat shops and child labour, but hey, as long as we get our trinkets!

So as we speak, likely some child or mother, barely making a dollar a day is breathing in chemicals in unsafe work environments, to make a pair of jeans so we can laugh and say, "Thank God we're not them!" And the world relies off of these businesses. Take away China, and there goes North America. Gone forever. Weclome to Somalanada!

So when you or somebody else says, "Immigrant (or illegal immegrants) are stealing our jobs", remember, those foreigners are just trying to get out of the situation we put them in, and if they weren't here packing meat for $10 an hour they'd be in their own country making our toys for a dollar a day.

\Tomb Raider/
20-05-11, 01:22
This is my take on it as i am one :o


illegal immigrants move to other countries to look for better futures for their kids, some just come here to work for a certain amount of time and go back to provide the sufficent needs for their families back home.

In my position i wasnt born in the US and came here since about 3 or 4 years old and i had no idea as to what was going on or how i got here. ( i cant remember ) but anyway my parents have always worked hard to have all the basic needs ...food, home , clothes... :p i attended elementary school, middle and high school and have graduated :cln: now after i graduated i have the age and responsiblities to work for myself ...but the only thing bad about graduating is i dont have Citizenship in the US and cant, well couldnt continue my studies :( ....moving along to make this short...well i have been working for two years at a dealership place doing advertisment and doing paperwork here and there to be able to put myself through college somehow..till today i have enough money to put myself to school :jmp: and i cant be any happier :o if i lived in my country of origin, the highest education my family would be able to afford would be middle school :( and basically jobs there sux and the goverment is a total joke!! :cen: so if i ever had to go back for some reason i would probably live on the streets :( The only thing that sickens me is watching students not putting enough effort on their studies when others want what they cant have. <--- does that make sense :p

SOOOOO...to the point i think illegal immigrants are like everyone else and are just looking for brighter futures here and for their kids, and i hope that one day the good people will come out of the darkness and show their wonderful talents and help provide wonderful ideas and make the US more welcoming and wonderful :D

remote91
20-05-11, 01:23
I enjoy your username, Polack.

I mean Polak.

NRO.
20-05-11, 04:42
Immigrants are stealing jobs from immigrants. :pi:

!Lara Croft!
20-05-11, 04:49
768h3Tz4Qik

Evan C.
20-05-11, 04:58
No.

QiX
20-05-11, 05:02
Stealing is not quite the precise word. It's all a matter of lower salary expectations making your low qualifications more competitive in a saturated labor market. We latinos are learning capitalism through harsh ways :p

Drone
20-05-11, 05:27
Nationality shouldn't matter at all. If someone does their work better than you then it's not their fault. Good specialists will never be unemployed and if one is nothing special then anyone can steal their job.

Encore
20-05-11, 11:22
What I think is - LOL.
I facepalm whenever I hear this argument and gave up on arguing against it long ago.

Bottomline, people will believe anything that makes them feel better about not having a job, and there's nothing you can do against it.

jaywalker
20-05-11, 11:30
This will cause a ruckus am sure, but no they are not stealing jobs. they are simply less `picky` then others at what jobs they will take.

I've known people who are unemployed for over 2 years who dont take jobs as they have this belief they should only take jobs `above or at least on par with` their old ones.. crazy.. and yes THEY moan about people taking jobs from them!? erm.. right..

Whilst there IS a problem with people coming into this country and then just sponging off the state, there are just as many `locals` doing that already. So dont just blame the ones not born here. :)