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Profc
05-11-11, 08:57
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb30/Denzillan/Obscura-3.jpg

I have finally managed to find the Obscura painting under X-ray texture. But for some reason it is not the painting we stole from the Brother Obscura's tomb.

At least it is now clear why they removed this feature.

Maybe there was a reason this painting was showing on the Cabal meeting cutscene?

Caesum
05-11-11, 10:00
I don't think that it was the reason, but it's a nice, infact, brilliant finding, because I was really interested in how it looked. Good job! :tmb:

Anyway, I'll say once more, I don't think it was deleted because of just one texture. It's a five minutes work to add another painting as a background for this symbol and if Core had no time to delete Lara's glasses from cutscenes or improve graphical part of bunch of PC levels then I don't think they've deleted whole X-ray feature because of just one texture. ;)

Anyway, this part of the Sanglyph is strange though. Ingame we can see that the Sanglyph is a big piece of metal, while here it looks rather more like a connected wires.

Profc
05-11-11, 18:54
I don't think that it was the reason, but it's a nice, infact, brilliant finding, because I was really interested in how it looked. Good job! :tmb:

Anyway, I'll say once more, I don't think it was deleted because of just one texture. It's a five minutes work to add another painting as a background for this symbol and if Core had no time to delete Lara's glasses from cutscenes or improve graphical part of bunch of PC levels then I don't think they've deleted whole X-ray feature because of just one texture. ;)

Anyway, this part of the Sanglyph is strange though. Ingame we can see that the Sanglyph is a big piece of metal, while here it looks rather more like a connected wires.

THank you. ;) It was quite difficult to find this painting actually. Texture editor doesn't show it. I only managed to find it with the texmod.

I wonder why it was the different painting. Maybe were seeing the original painting that Eckhart painted :confused: before the repaint. After all this painting looks more evil. (Actually this doesn't make much sense either because we saw all these painting in the Carviers Room) So who knows :cool:

tomee
05-11-11, 19:25
Anyway, this part of the Sanglyph is strange though. Ingame we can see that the Sanglyph is a big piece of metal, while here it looks rather more like a connected wires.

isn't it just a piece of the sanglyph? I mean, I thought that's why all the painting is needed, because each one contains a piece of the Sanglyph.

Caesum
05-11-11, 21:40
Yeah, I know. The thing is ingame you can see that the whole Sanglyph is a piece of metal with some fancy ornamentations. On this texture though it looks like the X-Ray thingy sees just these ornamenations while it should the whole piece.

Charlie91
05-11-11, 21:54
Interesting find. I always wondered how are the pieces of Sanglyph hidden in the Paintings...

SLAYER
05-11-11, 22:18
where did you find that?

Edit: gfgfg gfg fgh g fg may we all live happy? lol

Profc
05-11-11, 22:20
With texmod. It was in the Galleries under siege level.

It is a shame that even the metal parts are not arranged correctly. http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb30/Denzillan/Manuscript.jpg?t=1318248984

tomee
06-11-11, 08:45
Yeah, I know. The thing is ingame you can see that the whole Sanglyph is a piece of metal with some fancy ornamentations. On this texture though it looks like the X-Ray thingy sees just these ornamenations while it should the whole piece.

Ah, okay, now I get what youn mean.
http://www.tombraiderwiki.com/images/0/09/EckSang2.jpghttp://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb30/Denzillan/Manuscript.jpg?t=1318248984

Aurimas
07-11-11, 01:04
Another amazing find. I think I will have to check textures again. Hope someday we will know why these paintings are different.

In the concepts art of room with ghost there is the same painting we got in game.

aussie500
07-11-11, 05:48
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb30/Denzillan/Obscura-3.jpg

I have finally managed to find the Obscura painting under X-ray texture. But for some reason it is not the painting we stole from the Brother Obscura's tomb.

At least it is now clear why they removed this feature.

Maybe there was a reason this painting was showing on the Cabal meeting cutscene?

It has been a while since I played AOD so I might be wrong, but what makes you think that is not the painting Lara stole from Brother Obscura's tomb? That is the painting the statues were all holding, that is the painting that comes up when Lara collects it and that is the painting that is shown on the screen when the Cabal are discussing having obtained the painting. It is even the painting shown in the official guide so I do not see how it can be the wrong painting when we never saw Lara collect anything different. The X-Ray feature was used another way and they used different symbols for the puzzle to get into the area beneath the dig site. But since they never used this texture in the game there was no inconsistency, Lara did not need to know what the symbols of the Sanglyph were.

The only inconsistency I remember with the paintings was this was also the painting Lara threw to Eckhardt, supposedly in Prague when she had collected a different painting from the Vault of Trophies.

And as already mentioned, if the painting was X-Rayed it would not come up with such a clear symbol, since we saw the individual pieces and although they looked similar, they contained more metal, maybe that was why Core Design changed that part of the game.

Profc
07-11-11, 06:45
There were several problems with the paintings,

This is the painting that appeared in the cabal meeting cutscene...
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb30/Denzillan/ekran.jpg

This was the one we collected from Brother Obscuras Tomb
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb30/Denzillan/obscura-1.jpg

This was what the X-ray machine was going to show
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb30/Denzillan/Obscura-3.jpg

And this is the texture of the painting Kurtis stole from Lara during the cutscene. ( The actual first painting according to the manuscript in Carviers office)

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb30/Denzillan/obscurakurtis.jpg

This is the bigger version of the Last one, (from the comicbook)

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb30/Denzillan/Obscura4-1.jpg

-----Prague

This painting also appears in the Louvre Texture files and Lara throws this to Echart during the Boaz cutscene...

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb30/Denzillan/Obscura3-2.jpg

aussie500
07-11-11, 07:44
Your right, I apologise my memory is faulty, I remember the lighter sky and forgot about the yellow in the descending nephilim/angels one.

I went and checked and it is the descending angels in both guide, level and inventory. Now I do not have time to check but would I be right that we never saw which painting Kurtis took, so there would be no contrary evidence there. The X-Ray texture was never used in the game, and perhaps Eckhardt already knew what the 5th Obscura painting looked like so it was on the screen because it was the one they still needed? Which still leaves the problem of the mismatched painting in the cutscene.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j215/aussie500/AOD/AOD-VOTwrongpainting.jpg

The engraving missing was the death one and so was the painting Lara picked up in the Vault of Trophies, so presumably the cutscene was a mistake. The cutscenes were done back in 2002 so Core Design might have changed the picture in the level, and not in the two cutscenes.

Profc
07-11-11, 08:36
I went and checked and it is the descending angels in both guide, level and inventory. Now I do not have time to check but would I be right that we never saw which painting Kurtis took, so there would be no contrary evidence there.

The cutscenes were done back in 2002 so Core Design might have changed the picture in the level, and not in the two cutscenes.

We only saw a very small part of the painting that Kurtis took, for a split second. It was mostly white and brown. I always knew something was not right but I had no idea that it was a different painting back then. So it is not exactly in-game. Only someone with the texture editor could see it.


The cutscenes were done back in 2002 so Core Design might have changed the picture in the level, and not in the two cutscenes.

:tmb: Thanks for this info. I didn't know that cutscenes were finished one year before the release. It certainly explains these problems.

Aurimas
07-11-11, 10:03
How do we know that all cutscenes were exactly made in 2002? I think Core-design planned to put a painting with the light from a very start of the development because it is already in the concept. But then there is a painting with angel in the x-ray machine and even another painting Kurtis took from Lara. Same in Prague. We took the painting from Vaulth of Trophies but then there was painting with angel Lara threw to Eckhardt. I do not see the reason for changing those paintings so much.

http://www.tombraiderchronicles.com/images/angelofdarkness_concept5/screen2.jpg

aussie500
07-11-11, 10:28
How do we know that all cutscenes were exactly made in 2002? I think Core-design planned to put a painting with the light from a very start of the development because it is already in the concept. But then there is a painting with angel in the x-ray machine and even another painting Kurtis took from Lara. Same in Prague. We took the painting from Vaulth of Trophies but then there was painting with angel Lara threw to Eckhardt. I do not see the reason for changing those paintings so much.



Core Design never did most of the cutscenes, Attitude Studios did, and the game was originally meant to come out Nov 2002. I am sure Attitude Studios would have managed to get their contribution done well before Core Design were originally going to need the FMV and cutscenes.

http://www.cgw.com/Publications/CGW/2002/Volume-25-Issue-12-Dec-2002-/Virtual-Makeover.aspx