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View Full Version : My Diminishing Love for Tomb Raider


charlie904
28-06-03, 04:39
I became a fan of tomb raider and Lara croft when the third installment was released. the game captivated me with its large environments and its then modern and beautiful graphics. I enjoyed exploring the jungle and training in Lara's mansion. Within a year I became a Tomb Raider fanatic. I knew that I was playing part three so I wondered what the first two would be like. I purchased them and enjoyed them very much. I soon found out that a tomb raider game was released every year. I couldn't wait until Tomb Raider 4 was released. I couldn't wait to see Lara's mansion and the outdoor bright areas and how much it improved. That Christmas when I got tomb raider the last revelation I pope it into my playstation and got so excited just watching it load. when I got to the menu screen and saw that there was only a new game option and no house I was devastated. it was the best part of the game. I wondered why core would take something great and throw it out the window for something new. little did I know that this would soon become a pattern.

I didn't really enjoy the game as much as tomb raider 3. it didn't have as many outdoor bright locations and you couldn't even visit Lara's mansion. So I waited the next year hoping the next game would be a bit better. It wasn't just as I expected. the movies were great and the game play was good, but nothing spectacular. I guess I could wait for the next one to see if it was better.

I waited for 3 years for the next game. delay after delay until it finally came out. when I got it at first I was excited to see the new Lara. I had seen fmvs and game play movies and anticipated what it would feel like to control Lara again. I took the controller in my hand and moved Lara forward. the camera angle was strange. I dealt with it for the time being. I tried to move her left. hmm that was kind of hard to do. I tried to perform simple tasks such as aligning Lara up for a jump but these simple tasks were so tedious and took a lot of time because of the controls. I knew then that the tomb raider game would never be the same. I progressed through the game and learned the controls a little more after about 4 hours only to be stopped dead in my tracks by bugs. I was very disappointed in this tomb raider game. at first I didn't admit that I wasn't satisfied with it. I was in denial. but after about half the game I realized the only thing that kept me going was the story. so I tried to keep going to find out what happens but I couldn't. the bugs were too much to deal with. ever since I realized how much I don't like this game I haven't really posted at the forum as much. my interest in tomb raider isn't as strong as it used to be when the game was fun.

The biggest disappointment of this game was the absence of its grid base controls. I loved tomb raider because Lara could walk in every square inch of the level. it felt as if you could explore anywhere in the level. sure sometimes Lara sank into the walls but couldn't that have been fixed without taking out the grid base. the precision the player must use is what got me hooked on to tomb raider. I love the precision jumping. I loved how exact the controls were. I loved how you had to do things manually and press jump and hold x and push up in order to climb things and how u had to hold x to not let go. I loved the mechanics of the game. I knew there was something missing in this game but I couldn't put my finger on it until now. I could've dealt with the bugs. I could've dealt with the retarded AI. I could've even dealt with the new dark tone to the game. but what I cant take is a new game completely called tomb raider just because Lara is in it.

I know what I'm asking for is an old tomb raider with just better graphics and most of you will oppose this, but really, would that be so bad? I would prefer a traditional tomb raider game with better graphics than a horrible new buggy tomb raider with a new engine but horrible controls with better graphics. I want to go back to a real tomb raider game. I'm sure all you die hard fans of tomb raider that fell in love with it for what it was will agree with me. What I want more than anything is a real tomb raider game.

Yes I'm still a fan of tomb raider, and I will continue to post on the forums every now and then, but I haven't loved tomb raider the same way since her playstation 1 games. I know core said that they're not going to mess with the engine for another 10 years, so I guess I wont appreciate Lara as much. core said that they know the fans want more of the old games back, but what they're bringing back is the same kind of levels when what we really want is the same way to play levels. Well anyway I cant wait until core realizes that their new engine is utter garbage and the engine is rebuilt so that I can play a real Tomb Raider game again and enjoy it as much as I did when I was first introduced to the series.

-Charlie

Flipper1987
28-06-03, 04:56
Charlie 904 asked:
I know what I'm asking for is an old tomb raider with just better graphics and most of you will oppose this, but really, would that be so bad? I agree! One thing CORE/Eidos doesn't understand is that many TR fans like the traditional TR storyline/gameplay, & they don't mind if the next TR game isn't revolutionary. They enjoy the character & the adventures/challenges that she undertakes. It's familiar yet challenging at the same time.

Only critics are expecting each new game to be revolutionary; TR fans aren't. Just look around & see how many fans are griping about a lot of the numerous, unnecessary changes. CORE/Eidos needs to spend more time listening to the fans who actually BUY the game, instead of the self-righteous critics who have some sort of agenda.

Just give us a challenging, exciting game that actually lasts for 50 hours! Merely changing action buttons isn't progress.

TR fills a basic need in the video game arena: it's a Tomb Raider game! To be anything more will hurt the game.

Of course, I could be wrong! http://www.tombraiderforums.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

FLIPPER

[ 28. June 2003, 05:58: Message edited by: Flipper1987 ]

Duhlevon
28-06-03, 05:24
if you liked the traditional Tomb Raider 1-3 i recommend downloading the gold levels for PC.
in fact, you should get every TR for PC, that way, all framerate problems will be gone with a system update. And you will be able to download patches to fix the other bugs.

croft28
28-06-03, 11:46
I really think the new look of the new game is making it a fresher game. Its good seeing her go into different direction, why only limit her to tombs?.....it DOES get a bit repetative after 5 games. I dont mind if they go back to a bit more of the older style raiding like they said they might with the next game next year....but i really still want the darker elements too it, i love it.

BkBaby999
28-06-03, 12:10
i agree charlie that's how I've been feeling and you said it very well. Many people are trying to convince themselves that the bugs don't matter that the controls are simple and easy to deal with and that this is the greatest game ever.....but some people can't lie to themselves. I too am just playing the game because I have to, not because I really want to.

obiwanquinobi
28-06-03, 13:36
Hmmm...

Some very good points of view there guys/girls!

Its kind of like when you first had your favourite ice cream, the first time its like "Wow" then after wards the taste buds dullen and its never quite the same as that very first time. But you keep buying that very same ice cream, in the hope that one day, it will taste just like it did the very first time you had it! :(

But it never does !

Thats my analagy anyway...

Another point: How long can you keep banging games out with the same engine and gameplay elements?

These days, the game playing public are a hungry and consuming beast, and they want the latest and greatest product NOW.

Peer pressure is also a crucial element in how games are developed these days, there is always some other developer/software house raising the bar and pushing the technology envelope almost every couple of months.

You only have to look at some of the games that are out today to realize that things move forward very quickly. If games developers dont follow trends they will be left behind and eventually they will die!
Old TR fans would probably welcome a new TR game using the old engine, with just some nicer eye candy ect, but new kiddies on the block want the latest cutting edge graphics and a super slick game engine..
I really think Core has tried to cater for everyone with this release, weather they have flew wide of the mark or not remains to be seen by those of us still waiting to see the finished game.

AS far as the bugs are concerned - I cant comment on that, but I do feel for those who have paid their hard earned money and are less than satisfied.
IF.... the game is REALLY that bad, Im sure Core will take the critisism on board and learn from the mistakes made. Too little too late? I dont know.
This is after all a brand new engine, and I seem to remember the old TR engine not maturing fully until we got TR3.
So hopefully theres still a lot to be squeezed from this new engine.

Im not making excuses for core, and the jury is still out on weather this game cuts the mustard or not!
http://www.tombraiderforums.com/images/smilies/privateeye.gif

War Baby
28-06-03, 13:40
I have to say I enjoyed The Last Revelation and the training level in it. I was hoping for her mansion, but I enjoyed the look of Angkor Wat and seeing a young Lara.

But I didn't enjoy Chronicles very much. Didn't like training level, either. I haven't played AoD yet, so I can't comment on that. I would however like to see some more original TR types of storylines and game play in the upcoming games.

Apofiss
28-06-03, 13:44
Hi charlie! I really like your bio-story, cos mine is almoust the same and TR3 is really the best one! And yea TR3 was mine first too! http://www.tombraiderforums.com/images/smilies/wave.gif

Valcor
28-06-03, 14:36
Some very good thoughts there Charlie IMHO! TR2 was my first, a friend lent it to me to try and I nearly gave up cos I couldn't climb up the 'Great Wall' (Was that the right one I'm thinking of, it's been so long!) I got so frustrated I almost didn't bother but once I got up there I was so chuffed, and there we are I was hooked!! I then proceeded to play all the other games TR3>TR4>TR5 and TR1 in that order, plus all the add-ons. I am currently working my way through the many custom levels, which I find great fun - some of them are better than the Core/Eidos stuff - keep me going til 'the cows come home' (sorry British expression), means 'til Lara gets back on UK shelves!!??

Valcor ;)

sebuzzie
28-06-03, 15:47
Originally posted by Valcor:
all the add-ons...

Valcor ;) The add-ons were never available over here!! :mad:

BunnyGirl
28-06-03, 16:00
I know exactly what you mean charlie904, your story is strikingly similar to mine.

I started with TR3, and fell in love immediately with everything to do with the game. Bought the others as they came out, then bought the older TR's to complete my collection.

I'm interested in the new and improved AOD, I can't wait to see the differences. But in my heart of hearts, I hope its not too diffrent from the previous games, because IMO they were perfect, and I still enjoy playing them, even after playing them many many times.

badfatt
28-06-03, 16:14
Originally posted by Duhlevon:
if you liked the traditional Tomb Raider 1-3 i recommend downloading the gold levels for PC.
in fact, you should get every TR for PC, that way, all framerate problems will be gone with a system update. And you will be able to download patches to fix the other bugs.I'll ask you again... who rattled your cage? Or are you being sponsored by Microsoft or something?

jfkexpressmail
28-06-03, 19:20
You know, Charlie, you should really try the PC versions. I've noticed that the graphics in the computer world are a hell of a lot better and there aren't as many bugs. I've played and beaten all games [except for AOD, that comes to me on the first] on the PC, and when I tried to play on Play Station I about died because the controls were too hard to figure. I didn't like it.

And I too, am ****ed about Lara's mansion being taken out of the game. That was the best part!

MissKitty
28-06-03, 19:59
I became a TR fan when I first tried the demo for TR1 a few years ago, got totally hooked and bought the game, I have been with it ever since and I love them all to some degree, I agree with the differences and the loss of the mansion level etc although I liked TR4 and playing young lara, I mean when she picks up her trusty backpack from a skeleton would bring a tear to a glass eye ;) touching moment. I have to say that my least liked of the series so far has been TR2 and TR3 to some degree although I still enjoyed playing them. TR5 chronicles to me seemed too short, as much as I enjoyed the game it seemed a thin fill in to the much awaited AOD that follows on from Lara's entrapment at the end of TR4. All in all I think all the games have had something to offer If we could keep the balance from good gameplay and new additions without losing our old favorites I think Eidos & Core would be on to a big winner. As they say if it aint broke why fix it! http://www.tombraiderforums.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

[ 28. June 2003, 21:00: Message edited by: MissKitty ]

Valcor
29-06-03, 22:02
Originally posted by sebuzzie:

[/qb]The add-ons were never available over here!! :mad: [/QB][/QUOTE]

Sad to hear that sebuzzie :( , I really enjoyed The Lost Artifact (TR3Add on)! The other thing I love About PC TR games is being able to save immediately of course! Saves me tearing my hair out!!

Valcor

Valcor
29-06-03, 22:03
Sorry - messed up my attempt at quoting - never done it before http://www.tombraiderforums.com/images/smilies/redface.gif

obiwanquinobi
29-06-03, 22:22
No need to apologise ;)

FYI - You can edit your posts if you make a mistake!

Peace!

Valcor
30-06-03, 11:16
Thanks Obiwan, I'll get the hang of it soon!

Valcor http://www.tombraiderforums.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

universaldave
30-06-03, 11:38
Charlie904, you've struck a chord with me. I've played every TR game from the first game on (bought it the day it came out). They were all hard but enjoyable because you had to figure out what to do and even though the games were full of perilous jumps from one ledge to the next I could almost always size them up without too much trouble. AOD has introduced so many areas where you have to make jumps of so many different distances that you have to try over and over again. "Now let's see... do I do a standing jump from the edge or from the middle of this platform? Or is it a hop? Where on this platform should I hop from? Etc..."
The only way to cope with the frustration of dying from all these missed jumps is to save every time you make one, but that destroys any flow the game would have. But dying destroys that anyway. I don't want to play TR in 10 second intervals!!!! Give me large environments; Give me maddening puzzles; Give me diabolical traps--but enough with enless platform jumping that's harder than ever before! Is it just me or does anyone else agree? Or do you want to play for 10 seconds then save 'cause you finally made that jump you've tried 5 times only to do it all over again with the very next jump? I can't count how many times I've died and reloaded or how many times I've saved the game for that matter. It makes it hard to get into the game, although as a TR fan I feel I have to! :(

200+
30-06-03, 13:51
:rolleyes: I agree with Charlie i too love the game play of the mansion and the trying to out all the special precision jumps you use to use like flip turn around grab my flavorite move..

But there also was another reason for my love of Tomb Raider.( THE STORY SO FAR ) it was in the load section of all the games 1 2 3 4 5 and (statistics) under start..

This A O D game had a helpful hand to simplify the game play and make it to easy,but the graphics were simply awsome.I over looked all those bugs but yet found them too :( CORE should have used that hand thing as ( a help under options menu like subtitles on or off ) and in the pamplet they should have said square did the targeting instead of triangle and they should have never said THE STORY SO FAR was included cause i was real dissapointed,,

I loved Tomb Raider II it was my favorite because you got to drive stuff and I could do a 1 and a 1/2 Gainer of the top of that Great Wall.I think we all loved looking at the Cut seens of the STORY SO FAR..and knowing the STATISTICICS. The hunting for the three little dragons to get an upgrade of weapons or as in T R III finding them all and getting an extra lvl

well thats my thoughts http://www.tombraiderforums.com/images/smilies/love4.gif

[ 30. June 2003, 14:59: Message edited by: 200+ ]

Uvavoo
30-06-03, 16:22
I agree with many of the sentiments above.
I think the single most thing which makes the Tomb Raider series so playable is the absolute precision in which you can control Lara (over 400 separate animations). Never had that kind of control with any other game.
If you make a jump and fall to your death, its your own fault!
I still get a kick when I do a long running jump and cling to the distant wall.
It therefore disconcerts me to hear that there are control problems with AOD. As I am in the UK I have yet to play AOD, so I reserve judgment, nevertheless if the control system is poor, then one of the key elements of Tomb Raider has sadly gone.

WhosaidAODwasbad
30-06-03, 16:34
ya unlike some I ve been here since the first one in 1996 my grampa bought me and my family a computer after about about 2 months (november 96) my dad came home with tomb RAider aclaimed for when best game of the year and so forth we played and played and feel in love with the scary moments raiding tombs and fighting outragous mythical and extinct creatures. then i got a sony and bought it for the sony playtation been playing them for 7 years now and loved each one specially revalation what a cool game all in one place my favorite egypt i can't wait for the sequel to AOD they said they are returning to the catacombs tombs back alleys and mythical creatures under turkey very cool I just can't wait!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D :D :D :D http://www.tombraiderforums.com/images/smilies/music2.gif http://www.tombraiderforums.com/images/smilies/yikes.gif http://www.tombraiderforums.com/images/smilies/yikes.gif

Sassafras
30-06-03, 18:34
TRIII was my first TR game. It's still my favorite. After that, I got TRII, the golds for TRIII and TRII, TRI, TRIV TLR, TRV Chronicles. TRV was the buggiest so far. It really annoyed me, but the game itself was fun.

My least favorite is TRIV. I didn't like the darkness of the storyline and of the locales. And I didn't like that Lara was in Egypt the whole time.

In TRVI AOD, I'm in the Hall of Seasons right now. So far, I really like the game. Even with the few bugs I've encountered and the jumps not being the way they used to be. I agree about that. They shouldn't have changed the jumps.

I don't know if Lara will be going to any other countries in AOD. I hope she does. And I'll be glad when I get out of this other-worldly, creepy underground area. I prefer when Lara is in the "real world" dealing with "real" people.

I really like the look of the new Lara. She's prettier and seems more real. I do miss the FMVs between levels, but sometimes it's hard to tell when one level actually ends and another begins. Sometimes it's more like pauses between sections of one level. I miss there being obvious, separate levels. But that's really a minor complaint.

I'm liking AOD so far and hope that the rest of the game will be just as fun.