View Full Version : The Future of Level Editing

29-05-07, 19:07
What suggestions or hopes do you have for level editing in the future? These things have been in my head for a while now, so Iíll get them down here.

Legend/Anniversary Engine
This would be a major step in editing, but will Eidos make it available? If they did, would it be extremely time consuming to work with? It might leave all the current builders behind, and make way for a new editing community, which would be a bit sad. Nevertheless, this would be brilliant. Even a mesh-ripper for Legend/TRA would be great, allowing us to use new objects in accordance with the new vertex limitations available with TREP.

An improved version of the AOD engine
I know the controls were bad, but surely with a bit of work the LE world would be able to smooth them out, or maybe even Core themselves could do so. I think an AOD editor is quite unrealistic though with Crystal taking over and whatnot.

I am so excited about this! Just for a rundown, Barry Matharoo posted this a while back:

its not an update or a patch but a brand new engine
there will be no such things as .tr2; .tr4; .trc; .wad; .was etc
as the levels will be built using dxtre3d version 3
there will be no back compatabiltiy with projects
there is a demo already out that aloows u to build and play levels in prototype of the engine. It only displays the rooms with correct collesions.

it will support diagonal walls
ability to export rooms in 3dm format for editing
but collesion will be original and edited room will act as a mask on old collesion

u can even write codes for your enemy behaviour and everything like doors; dragones; flames etc
nothing will be hardcored in it

enemy will have skinjoints
as it uses skeleton technology used in ps2 games like aod and legend

weather; boats; meteorite shower u name it
it would be possible in the engine

A demo? Does anyone know where this can be found? Anyway, exporting rooms sounds like weíre finally breaking the block system, and skin-jointed enemies!

Paoloneís engine. Canít say much about this yet, except that the weather effects sound great.


From any future engine or patch, the main advancements I want to see are:

Capabilities for new WAD slots: At the moment we are limited to only TR4 slots, so modern game physics arenít possible, which is a shame.

Enemy behaviour: Fexengine is promising this, but before that there could be new programs to make new AI possible.

Also, Iíd appreciate any news about Fexengine or the demo Barry mentioned, TRNG news, and of course your thoughts on the future of LE.

Thank you.


29-05-07, 19:17

29-05-07, 19:20
It would be nice If we could make levels with Legend level editor, but I think CD will never publish their programs:p

29-05-07, 20:49
A Legend editor would be really hard to work with, but it would still be nice.
I like the idea about that building levels with Dxtre, that seems really easy.
I just wish there was a really easy LE to work with, where you could output it to any engine, (TR2, TR3 etc.)

29-05-07, 21:29
Legend editor... why it seems no harder than editing in Half-Life 2, which is relatively easy after a few weeks' experience.

Dxtre3D, I must say, is the most user-friendly editor, while TRLE is the most versatile. However, a FexEngine would be the ultimate fan project. (Provided it doesn't attract a lawsuit from Eidos The Odious).

30-05-07, 00:00
(Provided it doesn't attract a lawsuit from Eidos The Odious).

Oh dear :( , I hope that doesn't happen.

I don't think a Legend editor would be so hard either. Sure, we might not get the results CD do, but it's still better than the block system.

30-05-07, 02:24
I would love to have a trl, aod. tra Editors but i might get sued by edios

30-05-07, 08:31
An AOD ro Anniversary editor!!! :jmp:

why it seems no harder than editing in Half-Life 2, which is relatively easy after a few weeks' experience
I was thinking the same thing. :D
I have no experience with that editor myself but a collegue of mine started building with it a couple of months ago. He got good results within a few days and had ironed out the more serious bugs in a few weeks.

So, and editor like that based on the Anniversary engine sounds very good to me. :jmp:
(Why the Anniversary engine and not the Legend engine? Well, from what I've seen Lara is capable of more moves and can use more switches and keys. The kind of stuff I missed a lot in Legend. ;) )

30-05-07, 10:47
The mistake many people do is to belive that a TRA editor would be like TRLE. Like putting Lara there, a enemy there, a flame emitter there, a object there and then choose some textures to texture then play. But it wouldn't be like that at all.

People who can't do objects apart from blocks can just forgett about a TRA editor. Cause making TRA levels is almost the same.

They still use maya for all this. Like in AOD, Legend and TRA. Here's some pics of maya. (from AOD. Making TRA levels is the same)



This may look easy now. But you will just start with a empty place just like in Meta.

30-05-07, 10:47
(Why the Anniversary engine and not the Legend engine? Well, from what I've seen Lara is capable of more moves and can use more switches and keys. The kind of stuff I missed a lot in Legend. ;) )

That's why I kept mentioning Anniversary too. You wouldn't be able to make classic raiding levels with the Legend one, only action-packed shooters.

Thanks for the pics betal. Shouldn't un-experienced builders just use a modern editor like a block system? You don't exactly have to make elaborate lions and kurtises, but you'll still get nicer results than with the TR4 editor. The more metasequoia-familiar people could make great levels!

Anyway, Fexengine's "export room" feature looks like we'll be able to have AOD style levels. My only concern is that with Fexengine, I would have to get used to a Dxtre3d type editor, which I don't get at all! I suppose I can learn though, If we get AOD style levels.

30-05-07, 11:04
So a TRA/AOD editor is a lot like shaping clay?

30-05-07, 11:08
So a TRA/AOD editor is a lot like shaping clay?

sort off. It isn't like TRLE that you have walls, floor and cealing ready. ON a AOD/ TRA level you would need to do all that yourself. And the objects isn't something you put in the level like in TRLE. You would need to them the same time you making the level. If you understand what I mean.

30-05-07, 16:35
The current editor is complicated enough for one person. Indeed a TRA editor will be much mesh making as there are no blocks anymore. There would be very few builders left and dont forget to count the time to construct these levels as it is only mesh making to build your rooms. It's no simple click walls anymore. I'll bet the anniversary team is a minimum of 80 persons. I know Prince of Persia had more then 80. So be aware if you want to create ONE level on your own.

I would like to see the current engine without clipping of objects against the wall. On the older drivers from that time the game looks ok without clipping but with the latest hardware and drivers objects are clipping. With a bigger drawing distance objects even dissapear into walls.

That's my biggest issue with the current engine. Also I would like to see antialiasing as it is terrible with pixels in the distance. If I must believe Paolone there would be more graphic options possible as he could update the engine to use directx 8 effects.

I dont mind the gameplay functions as there is a lot more possible already if you are inventive. You can easily construct new traps if you can do mesh making and animations. But as said I want more graphical updates.

30-05-07, 17:35
I know it sounds weird, but I hope that there never come a editor like TRA, because it's gonna be so difficult, and many level makers stop with it, because they didn't get a thing from it.And of course, I like the old Lara very much, she looks more computerall :tea: