Alright, is anyone going to say it or not!? [Archive]

FullmetalEd

15-06-07, 21:15

AmericanAssassin

15-06-07, 21:23

vespertea

15-06-07, 21:24

The opening line made me burst out laughing. xD

I agree on some of your points. I wish the levels were more challenging (and not DOWNSIZED, dammit!).. and that there were more moves/tricks Lara could do other than climb from ledge to ledge. It was like playing a Spiderman game.

I wasn't too keen on the boss fight system, how bullets simply couldn't hurt the enemy (omfg, they're BULLETS. They have to do SOMETHING other than anger the enemy!). I didn't mind the adrenaline dodge, though, as far as concept went.

I actually enjoy Lara's new personality. (Paris Hilton wouldn't even know how to hold a gun.) She's at least human. I think she's a lot more admirable in CD's games than she is in Core's (though I'm a Core fan myself). She's more charming in TRL and TRA.

Simply put, CD could have definitely done a better a job. But I don't think they failed. Legend left me wanting to replay it over and over again, and I can't wait for the next installment in the series. I, personally, hope the series never "rots and dies."

danitiwa

15-06-07, 21:24

Glad some one agrees with me. :)

FullmetalEd

15-06-07, 21:28

The game is innovative, original yet faithful, fresh, moderately difficult, not repetitive, descent length, incredible battles, has loads of new moves, sexier Lara than ever, Natla (SEXY), amazing actors such as Keeley, it's going to next gen (so, graphics), awesome reviews, amazing sales... There are hundreds of things I could think of if I wanted to to defend the game. ;)

Loads of new moves??? You mean the POLE HOP???:vlol::vlol::vlol: It adds NOTHING to the game!!!

And let me tell you something else, "sexy" character designs don't make for a good game, they make for pornography.

supr pwnd:tea:

AmericanAssassin

15-06-07, 21:35

Loads of new moves??? You mean the POLE HOP???:vlol::vlol::vlol: It adds NOTHING to the game!!!

Perch, actually. And, wall run. And, dodge! Not liking it is just your opinion, not the opinion of the majority, as you act, FYI. ;)

And let me tell you something else, "sexy" character designs don't make for a good game, they make for pornography.

Lara has been a sex symbol since Tomb Raider II, so it is VERY important! :mad:

Do you need more reasons? I can think some up. ;)

Rivendell

15-06-07, 21:37

It's great that people can express their opinions without people attacking them isn't it!

Oh no.. wait... My mistake.

Lux veritata

15-06-07, 21:39

TrojanMan

15-06-07, 21:40

I guess there's no way to prove I'm not a troll (other than the fact that I've been on the forum for about OVER A YEAR:ton:) But the biggest way for a close-minded person to discredit someone who's opinion they don't like is to start attacking them personally, like you have so blatantly done to me.

Defend the game, don't bash those who see it differently than you.;)

Maybe I'm lost on dates, but it says you joined in November of last year, and it's June. That's less than a year.

Also, I love arguing and I love debates, but your attacks are so vague and pointless there's no substance to them. Wow, natural predators like DINOSAURS and PANTHERS are faster than a human being? I have to put actual EFFORT and STRATEGY into defeating the bosses? God forbid. If you want to mindlessly spray rounds into foes you've got every other fight in the game that let's you do so. Pole jumping adds nothing to the game? I could just as easily say the sprinting and diving adds nothing to Tomb Raider III or shimmying around corners in Last Revelation did nothing for that game either. All of Lara's new moves are just meant to add variation to the platforming and exploration, not redefine the rules.

AmericanAssassin

15-06-07, 21:42

So basically you are all saying that I don't have the right to express my opinion, like any other human being?

Yes, you do have the right. However, doing so should be done respectfully. Your rant sounds rude and digusting... there's a difference between just expressing your opinion and what you wrote. ;)

Alfredzlopz

15-06-07, 21:42

She is a frightend, girly-girl drama queen...

What do you want her to be? a 6'2 she-male with pecs? I think shes better because she has more emotion

belter_21

15-06-07, 21:43

Whats wrong with you people?He or she just stating his/hers opinion and probably wanted to know if someone felt the same way.No need to attack personally just because you disagree. I personally really liked the game but i do understand if someone didnt.

that's my opinion too...I thought he made some interesting to read points, I just didn't agree with some of them. Ah well.

The comment about the ledges was valid, the game did overly rely on ledges and poles, and in TR1 it was more puzzle focussed...lots of puzzles were missing in TRA.

Gravastars

15-06-07, 21:43

Every time you say "pwned" it leaves you with rapidly falling credibility.

That said, you do bring up some valid points. None of which really justify why you feel this is a bad game however. You just seem to rant about things I found a minor annoyance when playing, so I'm pretty dissident when you say it's boring and redundant. Oh well, maybe we just look for different things in videogames eh?

I have been a fan of TR since I was 9 in 96', and now, failure after failure, I say, let this series rot and die, like it has been doing for almost a decade now.

What I don't understand is when people say this about a series that is thriving in the public eye. I could understand if you applied this to Sonic the Hedgehog, but Tomb Raider is still going strong.

Yeoman

15-06-07, 21:46

that's my opinion too...I thought he made some interesting to read points, I just didn't agree with some of them. Ah well.

The comment about the ledges was valid, the game did overly rely on ledges and poles, and in TR1 it was more puzzle focussed...lots of puzzles were missing in TRA.

I don't remember all that many puzzeles, are switches counted as puzzles?

Maybe having alot of ledges is a bit repetitive, but surely more chalenginging than just flat ground under her feet, and having way to many poles to swing on. However, I did notice that there were very few broken crumbly ledges.

Reggie

15-06-07, 21:46

Here's what I've said before on the issue:

I sent an email to my friend explaining about my current feelings on TRA and thought I'd post my (rather cynical yet positive comments). Here's what I wrote:

I was up (enjoying it) until St. Francis' folly but I've suddenly stopped playing TRA only two levels later. I'm on Palace Midas (which has lost most of its original charm) and there's no sense of discovery and it all feels a bit awkward. The new fire room has gotten a lot of praise but I found it to be very frustrating as I'm getting fed up of constant wall climbing and buggy grabs where the successfulness of manoevres seems based on luck rather than skill.

The bottom line is at this point is that whilst Crystal has seemingly gotten a much firmer grasp of Tomb Raider fundamentals, the legend engine plagues the gameplay which feels much less graceful and reliable than the original grid which I find very worrying. Another thing I'm a bit miffed about is that everyone now suddenly assumes Crystal have learned how to make a TR-ish game. Uh, this is a remake of TR1? of course the bloody game was going to be TR-ish, its like a child producing a fantastic drawing by using a dot-to-dot template.

The real deal will be TR8 where we can really see whether Crystal has learned the fundamentals. Something just seems off to me. As if TRA was simply a nod to older fans rather than a revolution for the way future TR games will be played.

Taking all this into consideration, I have to give credit where credit is due - this game, ithe original being inovative in its time for bringing the industry kicking and screaming into the 3d world and featuring a female lead character has now been remade and has gained recognition for being different for other reasons. How many games as challenging, tense and rich do you see on the market right now? all we ever seem to get these days are crime/violent games or over simplified patronising dirvel I wouldn't care to play. Just before TRa, I was considering not only giving up on TR but on the games industry altogether. I'm still mightily ****ed off that FFXII, after waiting over 7 years turned out to be repetitive, boring and completely devoid of inspiration and atmosphere. So thank God that TRA somehow came to be released - even if it meant we wouldn't get to play Core's version (which I remain convinced would have been so much better).

I'm playing my new PC copy of TR3 and its been great playing it so far, after I finish it I'm moving onto to unfinished business or TRA, it depends on how I feel.

AmericanAssassin

15-06-07, 21:48

@ Reggie: Your post is ideal. You're respectful and polite about your opinion. You wrote nothing like FullmetalEd, who wrote rudely, using words like "sucked"... See the difference?

FullmetalEd

15-06-07, 21:48

I love arguing and I love debates, but your attacks are so vague and pointless there's no substance to them. Wow, natural predators like DINOSAURS and PANTHERS are faster than a human being?

My point in that was not random. The CAMERA is terrible, and Lara doesn't even shoot the little *******s when in the middle of a jump!!!

I have to put actual EFFORT and STRATEGY into defeating the bosses? God forbid. If you want to mindlessly spray rounds into foes you've got every other fight in the game that let's you do so.

The bosses were EASY!!! But what is the point of GUNS if the don't HURT ANYTHING??? When I play TOMB RAIDER, I want and expect to SHOOT THINGS!!! Not play bloody Red Rover to defeat them!!!!

Pole jumping adds nothing to the game? I could just as easily say the sprinting and diving adds nothing to Tomb Raider III or shimmying around corners in Last Revelation did nothing for that game either. All of Lara's new moves are just meant to add variation to the platforming and exploration, not redefine the rules.

Sprinting added one heluva lot to TRIII, in timed obstacles??? HELLO??? and it was nice to be able to go faster to get through the levels. And shimmying around corners in TR4 was MASSIVELY satisfying, since everyone had always wanted to do it since TRI.

The pole hop was so bland and over so quickly, it meant nothing. It just shows how stretched TR's creativity is by now.

vespertea

15-06-07, 21:50

The real deal will be TR8 where we can really see whether Crystal has learned the fundamentals. Something just seems off to me. As if TRA was simply a nod to older fans rather than a revolution for the way future TR games will be played.

Agreed!

Yeoman

15-06-07, 21:53

Sprinting added one heluva lot to TRIII, in timed obstacles??? HELLO??? and it was nice to be able to go faster to get through the levels. And shimmying around corners in TR4 was MASSIVELY satisfying, since everyone had always wanted to do it since TRI.

There are still timed sections in TRA.

TrojanMan

15-06-07, 21:54

My point in that was not random. The CAMERA is terrible, and Lara doesn't even shoot the little *******s when in the middle of a jump!!!

The bosses were EASY!!! But what is the point of GUNS if the don't HURT ANYTHING??? When I play TOMB RAIDER, I want and expect to SHOOT THINGS!!! Not play bloody Red Rover to defeat them!!!!

Sprinting added one heluva lot to TRIII, in timed obstacles??? HELLO??? and it was nice to be able to go faster to get through the levels. And shimmying around corners in TR4 was MASSIVELY satisfying, since everyone had always wanted to do it since TRI.

The pole hop was so bland and over so quickly, it meant nothing. It just shows how stretched TR's creativity is by now.

Actually, Lara will continuing the enemies when jumping sideways are forwards, and diving left and right. And many many bosses in other Tomb Raider games require alternate methods to disposal as oppose to just shooting them. Tomb Raider III, Last Revelation and Angel of Darkness leap out immediately. Just because the bosses require some creativity to them doesn't make them bad. Besides, You still kill ALL of the bosses in Anniversary via shooting them anyway; I don't see what the big deal is. And timed sequences to supplement the sprint? Why not just remove and extend the time? Done deal. Face it, all of Lara's new moves always do nothing but offer the illusion of originality but rarely actually deliver. The older games are no exception.

FullmetalEd

15-06-07, 22:00

Actually, Lara will continuing the enemies when jumping sideways are forwards, and diving left and right. And many many bosses in other Tomb Raider games require alternate methods to disposal as oppose to just shooting them. Tomb Raider III, Last Revelation and Angel of Darkness leap out immediately. Just because the bosses require some creativity to them doesn't make them bad. Besides, You still kill ALL of the bosses in Anniversary via shooting them anyway; I don't see what the big deal is. And timed sequences to supplement the sprint? Why not just remove and extend the time? Done deal. Face it, all of Lara's new moves always do nothing but offer the illusion of originality but rarely actually deliver. The older games are no exception.

But you're not getting it. In the past the new moves were actually fun and satisfying and even exciting. The Pole jump is just awkward and dumb.

And yeah, I guess there were other instances of Lara Killing a boss by other means than guns, but that was for variety. Now you just kill every boss in the exact same way! Boooooring. It's like they didn't even try to mix it up in TRA. Besides, I thought the way you killed the last guy in AOD was boring and unfufilling as well.

Ah, what do you know. We're having intellegent conversation.:)

vespertea

15-06-07, 22:01

Let's say FullmetalEd would have written, "I'm not quite fond of the direction CD has taken the series. I hope that someday it can return to, or near, its roots" would have been fine. However, instead of writing anything respectful of that sort he/she wrote things like, "Legend and Anniversary both suck." Not very useful for CD to read. Reasons and example for why things don't work in a game like Tomb Raider, help CD to plan the future of the series. :D

LMAO!!!

FullmetalEd

15-06-07, 22:03

AmericanAssassin

15-06-07, 22:04

But you see, that's not getting my point across. I wanted to express clear disgust, not mild contempt. Yes, some of us writters do still have passion left in us.:tea:

FYI, once again, I myself am a writer and I am very passionate about what I do. That does not mean that I feel the need to convey my opinion rudely 24/7. I've honestly never seen you write a polite post. ;)

FullmetalEd

15-06-07, 22:05

FYI, once again, I myself am a writer and I am very passionate about what I do. That does not mean that I feel the need to convey my opinion rudely 24/7. I've honestly never seen you write a polite post. ;)

Apperently You've never seen me post outside of this thread where I am being attacked from all members and all sides.;);)

_Lam

15-06-07, 22:06

Ok. You said that it's always the same thing : Jump, jump, jump... Sorry but it was worse in TR1, jump on the block, grab, pull up... And sometime there was hidden ledge.

I don't understand how can you complain about that, now you can swing with your grapple, stand on the top of pillar, walk on the wall, climb on block, climb on ledge, use rope and jump on high lever... What you want more !?

AmericanAssassin

15-06-07, 22:07

Apperently You've never seen me post outside of this thread where I am being attacked from all members and all sides.;);)

That's certainly not the point I am trying to get across. What you apparently need to learn is that you don't have to be rude to convey "passionate" opinions. ;)

Yeoman

15-06-07, 22:10

Apperently You've never seen me post outside of this thread where I am being attacked from all members and all sides.;);)

But in your very first post (in this thread) you weren't being attacked from all sides, yet that began some of the derrogatory responses your now recieving.

vespertea

15-06-07, 22:11

But in your very first post (in this thread) you weren't being attacked from all sides, yet that began some of the derrogatory responses your now recieving.

*you're

......

I'm just messing with ya, Yeoman. :p

Yeoman

15-06-07, 22:14

Strange, I don't remember asking for the English lesson you're now giving me.

..........

joking of course ;)

BtoFu

15-06-07, 22:18

The game is innovative, original yet faithful, fresh

I can safely say I don't find it to be any of the above...in it's heyday it was all these things but in the space of eleven years it's done little to truly revamp the formula. You can argue forever of course that if you change too much then it's simply no longer a Tomb Raider game because it's very true. On the other hand if you're to look at the rate at which true touchstone series' of the 32 bit age are still going and more importantly changing then you can probably figure that Tomb Raider must get a bit of a makeover if it's going to stand up alongside the nextgen big guns. IMNSHO a franchise will always keep it's core fanbase and so the key is not to cater quite as much to them (since you're all on board regardless right?) but to catch new fans on a new set of consoles and computers. Much more is required to innovate...all that being said I'm a big fan of AE, it's a perfect example of what a decade of technological leaps and bounds does for your interactive entertainment. ;)

vespertea

15-06-07, 22:24

I won't argue. You were polite about your opinion (sort of), while FullmetalEd was not. :D

Though, of course, I think we need to pay attention to the points that FullmetalEd states just as much as how he states it. It's easy to lose sight of content in the boom of style.

Yeoman

15-06-07, 22:30

Its strange because as soon as this thread blossomed into life and burnt fiercly, its now sort of fizzled out. :confused:

tweetygwee

15-06-07, 22:55

Well, I would agree with you if you were talking about Legend, but IMO Anniversary is a major improvement. The gameplay, music, graphics and above all the atmosphere are all present in TRA. I agree that some of Legend's gripes have spilled over into this game, largely because it's on the same engine. Nevertheless, TRA is a step in the right direction, so I hope Crystal can continue on this path and make TR8 (which will be on a new engine :jmp:) a brilliant TR.

Also, I think some people have been just as, if not more so, blunt and offensive in their agressive posts at FullmetalEd. Threads like this would not be such a problem if everyone posted objectively and politely. He might follow your example then, rather than have the thread turn into a flame-war.

BtoFu

15-06-07, 23:14

I won't argue. You were polite about your opinion (sort of), while FullmetalEd was not. :D

Well I never mean to come aross as though I'm attacking anyone's opinion, just the way I write I suppose. :o

remyma

15-06-07, 23:27

I agree with you on almost everything... Though i did have fun playing some of it, i was still disappointed!

Yuna´s Wish

15-06-07, 23:29

I agree with you wholeheartedly! ;) Now go and play Tomb Raider Anniversary :)

solidsnake289

15-06-07, 23:31

TR Legend and Anniversary both sucked. Everyone has heard why Legend did, now I'll say about TRA.

Ok I know legend wasn't that great but TRA IMO was awesome not quite what I was expecting but it was still cool!

Vickkyyy

15-06-07, 23:56

TR Legend and Anniversary both sucked. Everyone has heard why Legend did, now I'll say about TRA.

The level designs are rancid. 90% of the whole game is just jumping from one ovbious ledge to another. The gameplay is just boring, your doing the same three moves over and over with added amounts of frustration-not challenge-just crappy frustration since you people obviously could not come up with anything innovative to actually challenge us, and make us have fun at the same time.

The boss fights are stupid, just stupid. Wait until the enemy charges you, then "adrenaline shot" to make them crash into something, or fall off something. Shooting the bosses is completely useless in terms of hurting them, you had might as well be a damned matador.

The regular fighting is complete luck, there is no skill involved whatsoever. The camera is having an epileptic seizure while Lara herself is totally useless, since she is so much slower than the animals she's fighting.

The most bitter taste left in my mouth was definately by Lara herself. She is a frightend, girly-girl drama queen who can't seem to find the ability nore intellegence to function in a videogame, much less fight or even, heaven forbid, look cool or admirable. It's like watching Paris Hilton in a dramatic version of "The Simple Life", just with guns and people who don't know how to use them. I think that says enough about your "storyline" as well.

Overall, the game is boring, redundant, and makes it clear why Tomb Raider just can't stand up to today's halfway decent games.

I have been a fan of TR since I was 9 in 96', and now, failure after failure, I say, let this series rot and die, like it has been doing for almost a decade now.:(

you mayy be over reacting with this Paris Hilton thing

BUT :
the tomb raiders CORE made were SOOO MUCH better and Legend and Annivesary were a bit of a disgrace.
Legend's story was too mushy ( ooouuu i have to find my motherr oouu ) TOMB RAIDING MUCH !?

Annivesary, story is good, but not great. lara is slower, i must say, and im hateing some of the things CD added or changed.
but, i was supreised with some things that happened in Annivesary, which i wont say.
mm.. the deaths of certin people suprised me, and i love that.
BUT, the levels arent very fun.
the game is not fun, at all,
like at least make it fun.
gosh.

and Legend 2 !?!
are you KIDDING ME !?!
*sigh*

NOTE : i will still play every tomb raider game that comes out untill i completly loose intrest ( we'll see how legend 2 turns out )

pEhouse

16-06-07, 00:05

To bring this back to topic, this is the 8th game of the series and a lot of people are disappointed just cuz of the simple fact that it ain't nothing new no more. We all know about Lara Croft now. The revolutionary-factor is gone, but that's normal for games like this. That's why it's getting harder and harder for CD to live up to our expectations. I actually didn't think that TR I was THAT great. But a lot of people praise it to the skies just because it was the first one. Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan myself and I played all the games except AoD, loving all of them. I just don't see the need in opening 50 threads about how much people hate the game.. isn't one enough?

cylria

16-06-07, 00:09

TR Legend and Anniversary both sucked. Everyone has heard why Legend did, now I'll say about TRA.

The level designs are rancid. 90% of the whole game is just jumping from one ovbious ledge to another. The gameplay is just boring, your doing the same three moves over and over with added amounts of frustration-not challenge-just crappy frustration since you people obviously could not come up with anything innovative to actually challenge us, and make us have fun at the same time.

I can't say I agree that the game is boring, but CD should definately put some effort into improving level design in future TR games. Even if most people like the current level designs, they'll have to keep the new games fresh.

The boss fights are stupid, just stupid. Wait until the enemy charges you, then "adrenaline shot" to make them crash into something, or fall off something. Shooting the bosses is completely useless in terms of hurting them, you had might as well be a damned matador.

I have to agree with you here. AD should have been required/common in one boss fight. The rest of the bosses should have been designed so that filling the rage meter is difficult and an AD would just be a reward for a long string of solid hits. The "trick" to beating them should focus on different things.

The regular fighting is complete luck, there is no skill involved whatsoever. The camera is having an epileptic seizure while Lara herself is totally useless, since she is so much slower than the animals she's fighting.

I also agree a little. It would have been nice if Lara was a little quicker on her feet. To compensate, enemies should rage a little less. Like bosses, AD should be a rare reward for getting off a solid volley of hits, not something that you can do twice over a 10 second fight.

The most bitter taste left in my mouth was definately by Lara herself. She is a frightend, girly-girl drama queen who can't seem to find the ability nore intellegence to function in a videogame, much less fight or even, heaven forbid, look cool or admirable. It's like watching Paris Hilton in a dramatic version of "The Simple Life", just with guns and people who don't know how to use them. I think that says enough about your "storyline" as well.

I would agree if we were talking about Legend. That version of Lara wasn't the intelligent adventurer/archologist I've come to like. TRA feels a lot like the old Lara to me.

Overall I like TRA. Its all the things l liked about TRL, without Legend's storyline.:D

TRBeth

16-06-07, 00:10

Are you a tomb raider fan? Truth is what you describe as boring and monotanous, is the nuts and bolts of what tomb raider is! Did you not play the original by chance?

Now if you don't like tomb raider, fine, play something else, but really climbing, pulling, jumping, etc., is intricately engrained in tomb raider. Truth is I find that the whole game is layered with physical puzzles, both hard and easy, simple and difficult. And that is in the tradition of the original game. It is what one might expect in a game where raiding tombs is the objective.

Geck-o-Lizard

16-06-07, 00:10

Guys... girls... you're all entitled to hold your own opinions. And none of you are entitled to criticise or attack other people with comments like "you fail at life" because they didn't enjoy a videogame as much as you did.

If you hated Anniversary - that's awsome.
If you loved Anniversary - that's awsome too.

But attacking someone for not liking what you did, or liking what you didn't, is not awsome at all. In fact it's very immature, and makes you look quite silly. There's a lot of truth in Quasimodo's cartoon (http://www.tombraiderforums.com/showthread.php?t=99054). Screaming at someone for expressing a different opinion, or demanding that they shut up and hand the game back to the shop if they disliked it, does not make you look cool, tough, intelligent, or classy. It makes you come across as a spoiled brat, pardon the cliche, who holds the heavily flawed belief that their own opinions and their own preferences are the universally correct ones for every one of the 6.6 billion humans living in the world today.

Everyone is different. Everyone likes different things. So I hope at least some of you will understand how silly it is to launch personal attacks against people because of this - particularly when the subject is something as trivial as a computer game.

gtkilla

16-06-07, 00:21

tranniversary119

16-06-07, 00:27

TR Legend and Anniversary both sucked. Everyone has heard why Legend did, now I'll say about TRA.

The level designs are rancid. 90% of the whole game is just jumping from one ovbious ledge to another. The gameplay is just boring, your doing the same three moves over and over with added amounts of frustration-not challenge-just crappy frustration since you people obviously could not come up with anything innovative to actually challenge us, and make us have fun at the same time.

The boss fights are stupid, just stupid. Wait until the enemy charges you, then "adrenaline shot" to make them crash into something, or fall off something. Shooting the bosses is completely useless in terms of hurting them, you had might as well be a damned matador.

The regular fighting is complete luck, there is no skill involved whatsoever. The camera is having an epileptic seizure while Lara herself is totally useless, since she is so much slower than the animals she's fighting.

The most bitter taste left in my mouth was definately by Lara herself. She is a frightend, girly-girl drama queen who can't seem to find the ability nore intellegence to function in a videogame, much less fight or even, heaven forbid, look cool or admirable. It's like watching Paris Hilton in a dramatic version of "The Simple Life", just with guns and people who don't know how to use them. I think that says enough about your "storyline" as well.

Overall, the game is boring, redundant, and makes it clear why Tomb Raider just can't stand up to today's halfway decent games.

I have been a fan of TR since I was 9 in 96', and now, failure after failure, I say, let this series rot and die, like it has been doing for almost a decade now.

First of all Tomb Raider Legend did not suck its one of the best selling games of the series and if you go on wikipedia and look at the reviews on there you can see it recieved all positive reviews. Anniversary is one of the best ones of ther series and i loved it and most people on here did to.

But hey its your opinion and im not going to change that.:)

Tavo_TR

16-06-07, 00:48

Its bad for you that you didnt like legend or anniversary but I think a lot of people agree that both games are steps in the right direction to the saga the reviews says it all no other tomb raider game has been in such a high state since tomb raider 1 and 2

Geck-o-Lizard

16-06-07, 00:52

@ Geck-o: I didn't post that comment because I didn't agree with the OP, I posted it because s/he copy/pasted that little rant in other threads before and then created this thread because s/he didn't get the response s/he wanted.

Basic politeness isn't conditional. If you feel you have a problem with another member's behaviour, speak to a mod.

danny.rex

16-06-07, 00:59

No one else said it because most of people don't feel that way about TRA

If you think that way just forget about Tomb Raider, or just stick to the original

Most of the fans are happy with TRA, and think the series are in the right road (or however it's said)

I personally love it so much :D

ilie_ fusarau

16-06-07, 02:25

Yeah I love TRA too ...

mmm...cookies

16-06-07, 02:37

It seems that perhaps the Tomb Raider series is lost on you now..........it can happen!

If the series stayed the same i know i would have forgotten about it a long time ago, Legend and now Anniversary are brilliant games in my and many others opinion.

Maybe you should find another game that you like and boast about that on the game section or on a different forum.

henry ze 4th

16-06-07, 02:54

I've tapped backwards enough in my life to know repetition. Pulease with the monotony argument.

Mike89

16-06-07, 04:56

Overall, the game is boring, redundant, and makes it clear why Tomb Raider just can't stand up to today's halfway decent games.

All I can say about that is I don't even know why you bother to play games at all if you feel that way about it. Why don't you just throw away your computer and take up fishing or something? Would be a lot less frustrating for you I would imagine.

Legend and Anniversary can stand up to today's games quite well as far as I'm concerned. Both are definite keepers for me. I imagine whatever games you consider up to your standards could just as easily be torn down by others like what you are doing to Legend and Anniversary. Your game standards mean nothing to anybody but yourself.

Games are like movies, what one hates, another loves. Just personal taste.

Take the Tombraider series for example. I don't refer to myself as a Tombraider diehard like some here who cherish the old Tombraiders (and compare everything else to them). I personally could never go back and play those old Tombraider games and come out of it with any satisfaction whatsoever. It would be like me trying to go back and play Quake 2. The graphics back then were so bad (compared to now), no way could I go back and enjoy that. Lara back then looked like a stick figure (with boobs) with a dog face. The way she looks now is "oh yeah" (especially in Legend IMO). Angel of Darkness I absolutely hated, not because of the game itself, but because of the atrocious controls. If that game would have had Legends/Anniversary's controls, I would still have it on my computer. IMO, Legend and Anniversary just perfected the Tombraider series, the rest are garbage (good for their day but not anymore).

My point in the last paragraph is it's my opinion and others could agree or disagree with it strongly. They would be no more right or wrong than me. That's how games are. The outcome only matters to the person who is playing.

Tthe Spirit

16-06-07, 05:18

This game is amazing...

It is better than all the previous games....

I know it is not as hard as TR1, but this doesnt mean it isn't hard...
There are great puzzles to solve, where in TR1 they were only based on opening and closing doors..
Here they seem more challenging and need more concentration...

And this game isnt repetetive...

It is really tiring and we all love it...

BTW, what do you mean by repetetive...
Jump, shhot, swing, slide, jump, pull lever...

Well yeah, it is a TR game..

TR series has always been like this...
What bothers you in this 1..

After all, it is about 80% very close to TR1...

Besides when someone would look at all the TR series from TR1 till TRA, the variation among them is what makes this game very special..
I know many dislike TR3 a bit becoz it got nothing that was new or different from the previous ones (not that it is ugly, but not as attractive)...
Then came TR4 which was the best among the series...
TR5 was like a series to keep the fans busy and i enjoy it so much and it really had very new things to do...
Now i even think AOD is great becoz it even has something new (expet this slow Lara, but the sprint in the end corrects everything)...
TRL was spectacular and very attractive and t boosted the hopes again...
Now TRA has really proven what does the word Tomb Raider mean...

Umagine if all these 8 games were done in the same habit (manner), exactly like Tr1-2...
Then everybody would get bored..

at least, each series has something which makes it unique and different from the previous...

Mona Sax

16-06-07, 08:41

Nannonxyay

16-06-07, 08:56

People are always complaining... first Legend was too easy and now Anniversary is too hard. Tut tut....

MadVoodoo

16-06-07, 09:16

The pole hop was so bland and over so quickly, it meant nothing. It just shows how stretched TR's creativity is by now.

Do you really believe videogames need to be innovative in order to be fun?

Check out most games in the charts. Ask yourself are they really that innovative? A game doesn't have to be innovative as long as all the fun elements are there to please the player. Anniversary was never intended to be innovative or groundbreaking.

Mod edit: Last comment removed. I thought we'd made it clear by now that we don't want people telling other members to leave or quit playing TR.

Tomb_wraith

16-06-07, 09:39

Anniversary is OK for me but lacking.

My opinion PC version of Anniversary:

Advance
-Graphic is ok.
-Lara looks better than Legend
-Challenging
-User made clothes for Lara
-Wet effect is cool
-Tomb rider spirit lives with this game

Disadvance

-I don´t like the console style save system.
-Controls are awful (example: When I start tarketing multiple hostile targets, Lara chooses distant target not closest one. That´s annoying)
-Camera is horrible [Camera locking system certain view would be nice.]
-lack of realism.
-Animals has circle eyes
-Levels are console stylic not PC stylic
-First fight against Larson is big disappointment. (I hope to fight against Larson with shotgun like original but no)
-some levels repeat itself
-Too much medpacks in levels

michaeldt

16-06-07, 09:41

TR Legend and Anniversary both sucked. (

well everybody has their own opinion about what they think of it.

mzprox

16-06-07, 09:46

I just spent 10 minutes cleaning out this thread, deleting 44 (!) posts in the process. Not only was I diappointed at how many regular members, people I thought were reasonable enough, deemed it necessary to attack a member personally simply for not sharing their opinion, but also at how many people chose to ignore Rivendell's and Geck-o-Lizard's warnings.

This goes for everybody. In the case of

-...
- mzprox
congrats, you've just earned yourself a booking.

I do respect the OP opinion, but if some one says let this series "rot and die" then please allow me to give an advice: "dont play these games so you give yourself and me a favor not writing here."

I've repeated myself because i dont feel i was as close rude as the opening post wich was not deleted after all. This is my opinion hope it get respect too. or an other booking

to be more constructive (and just mentioning that the OP was not constructive at all):

TR Legend and Anniversary both sucked.

Not true, these were very succesfull games. anyway we are different

The level designs are rancid. 90% of the whole game is just jumping from one ovbious ledge to another

Yes, there were parts where it was too obvious, but 90%? no way. And even those parts can be obvious for someone but not the others. I have played the previous TR games and do think they can compete with/(beat) this game with only their nostalgic value. they were also "obvious" in some parts and had some good puzzles on the other parts just like this game

The boss fights are stupid, just stupid. Wait until the enemy charges you, then "adrenaline shot" to make them crash into something, or fall off something. Shooting the bosses is completely useless in terms of hurting them, you had might as well be a damned matador.

Many of us thinks that the boss fights were enjoyable and needed more creativity than just to run around and shoot like in other TR games..

The regular fighting is complete luck, there is no skill involved whatsoever. The camera is having an epileptic seizure while Lara herself is totally useless, since she is so much slower than the animals she's fighting.

The fighting is more than luck :) however i have to agree that there is a problem here which should be solved. Locking on the desirable target not always easy and sometimes it switches. (for example in the great pyramid level many times hapened that i have started to shoot on the timed switches instead of the mephits). And yes the camera sometimes made the fight hard, definetly needs improvement

The most bitter taste left in my mouth was definately by Lara herself. She is a frightend, girly-girl drama queen who can't seem to find the ability nore intellegence to function in a videogame, much less fight or even, heaven forbid, look cool or admirable. It's like watching Paris Hilton in a dramatic version of "The Simple Life", just with guns and people who don't know how to use them. I think that says enough about your "storyline" as well.

Now you are just insulting many of us' favorite character. You can see the contrast between "Anniversary" Lara and "Legend" Lara, and this is because this was one of Lara's first adventures. The story line was quite the same as the first (and most succesfull) TR games', just with more character portrait. And i liked them.

Overall, the game is boring, redundant, and makes it clear why Tomb Raider just can't stand up to today's halfway decent games.

You are wrong because it stands. no need to tell more.

I have been a fan of TR since I was 9 in 96', and now, failure after failure, I say, let this series rot and die, like it has been doing for almost a decade now.:(

please dont play this series if you think it should rot and die, thx.

blu39

16-06-07, 09:49

The only solution to you not liking the game is simple.

Don't play it!!!:tea:

Let other's enjoy, even if you don't.

:jmp:

clairelovestlc

16-06-07, 10:15

The only solution to you not liking the game is simple.

Don't play it!!!:tea:

Let other's enjoy, even if you don't.

:jmp:

Well said!

I liked it, i found it rather easy in comparison to the original games, it seemed to have lost a lot of the "wow" factor, and the puzzles seemed a lot easier. But in retrospect, i was about 11 years old when i started playing tomb raider games, it was one of the first game series i ever played. so of course its going to have lost some of its effect!

When the series first came out, it was fresh and new, games of its type were not common, each time they added a new move or graphical advance to the game, it was a massive step. Now so many other games have followed in its footsteps, and technological advances have come an awful long way. It must be 100% times harder for a game developer to get an audience to go " WOW!" because we have seen so much of it before.

I agree the game did feel a bit linear in places, and some of the levels had a very redundant " grab that ledge, hop to that ledge jump back to that ledge" feel, but that is a largely what the original tomb raider games were based upon... the frustration of spending all day climbing to the top of a waterfall/ room/ to push the wrong button and fall off, having to start over again!

I would love the series to keep going, and i will keep playing it for as long as i enjoy it... But society changes, people change and grow and the things they like change and grow, we expect more now than ever before out of a game.
I would like to see more dynamics added to the game, more complex puzzles and slightly more variety in the way that enemy's can be killed. i also missed the ability to combine items and adapt them. and i most definitely feel that it would be a huge step forward for them to allow more variety in the way we can interact with the environment, allowing the player to climb where they want to ( and is logically possible) rather than where the designer feels we should be able to climb.

Yes there are room for improvements, but i feel that the game is far better than AOD and legend, so they are going in the right direction, i believe there is ALWAYS room for improvement and when there is no more room to improve... well then it has failed.

" show me a thoroughly satisfied man, and i will show you a failure"

The above is just my opinion, so i would once again like to quote Blu39... if you don't like it, then let those who do like it, enjoy it, we all like different things, an no persons opinion is more valid than anyone else's!

And lets face it, it would be a pretty boring place, if we all liked the same things!

Xian Priestess

16-06-07, 10:51

All I can say is - if it hadn't been for Lara I would never had got into game playing at all. I do not constantly play games, like many here no doubt do, and the games I do choose to play are all this kind of adventure/puzzle stuff. I have watched my son play shoot 'em ups and things like Tekken, which I would not even pick up a controller for, as they would give me very little satisfaction. So, we are all different in what we consider to be an enjoyable and good game.

I have thoroughly enjoyed Anniversary - even when the frustrating bits have had me cursing. I think for diehard fans of the series, we have all been able to take something positive out of the PS2 versions of the games - even AoD had its moments. But then, perhaps I'm easy to please. I just enjoy jumping Lara around, solving puzzles and shooting intruders and biting my nails wondering if she will make the next timed sequence. Therefore, CD have continued to deliver what I need since they took over. I have no complaints, other than the usual petty ones regarding tricky controls and camera now and then, but the challenge is to overcome those obstacles and help Lara finish her adventure.

I would be interested to know what the thread starter would like to see in the next game that is different and innovative. As others have said, this is Tomb Raider, and it is basically a platformer. Knowing the formula, why play if that has become old hat to you? There will always be an audience for this kind of game - or at least I hope so. And Lara has grown immensely since the old days, and for that we should all be glad.

As long as CD fix the camera for TR8 I'll play these kind of games until I'm 90! I will never become bored with the format.

a_Nxiety

16-06-07, 11:40

I have been a fan of TR since I was 9 in 96', and now, failure after failure, I say, let this series rot and die, like it has been doing for almost a decade now.:(

i would have completely agreed with that statement had we only been talking about Legend. TRA is the TR game that brought it back for me, i've loathed all the bad sequels and movies as long as i can remember but TRA finally does the game justice, and in my opinion is the only good installment to the series since the original.

danitiwa

16-06-07, 11:53

It's great that people can express their opinions without people attacking them isn't it!

Oh no.. wait... My mistake.

Yeah, I know what you mean. I hate it when stuff like this happens. I mean the going mad because some one isn't the same as you, interestingly enough this was the cause of most if not ALL wars EVER in the world.

That's why I like the sani, it may be pervy, but it's nice and quiet, they respect each other. :)

Mona Sax

16-06-07, 12:52

I do respect the OP opinion, but if some one says let this series "rot and die" then please allow me to give an advice: "dont play these games so you give yourself and me a favor not writing here."

I've repeated myself because i dont feel i was as close rude as the opening post wich was not deleted after all. This is my opinion hope it get respect too. or an other booking
The difference it that he attacked a game while you attacked a person. The game isn't going to mind much.

petujaymz

16-06-07, 12:55

The level designs are rancid. 90% of the whole game is just jumping from one ovbious ledge to another. The gameplay is just boring, your doing the same three moves over and over...

I have to disagree with you there babes...

Yes, a portion of the ledges are obvious, but the challenge is trying to reach them. Timing has become an important factor too - much more so than in TRL.

Prior to the release of TRA, after watching the vids, I too was worried that TRA would be repetitive. The fact is, it's not. Yes, you do regularly use 3/4 of Lara's moves to get around, but the environments are more interactive than those in TRL. e.g spring ledges, spring poles, retracting platforms etc - this is where the variety comes in... if that makes sense.

As you've been a TR fan since '96, I'm assuming you played the game using manual grab...

:wve:

Tomb Raider Jay

16-06-07, 20:11

TR Legend and Anniversary both sucked. Everyone has heard why Legend did, now I'll say about TRA.

The level designs are rancid. 90% of the whole game is just jumping from one ovbious ledge to another. The gameplay is just boring, your doing the same three moves over and over with added amounts of frustration-not challenge-just crappy frustration since you people obviously could not come up with anything innovative to actually challenge us, and make us have fun at the same time.

The boss fights are stupid, just stupid. Wait until the enemy charges you, then "adrenaline shot" to make them crash into something, or fall off something. Shooting the bosses is completely useless in terms of hurting them, you had might as well be a damned matador.

The regular fighting is complete luck, there is no skill involved whatsoever. The camera is having an epileptic seizure while Lara herself is totally useless, since she is so much slower than the animals she's fighting.

The most bitter taste left in my mouth was definately by Lara herself. She is a frightend, girly-girl drama queen who can't seem to find the ability nore intellegence to function in a videogame, much less fight or even, heaven forbid, look cool or admirable. It's like watching Paris Hilton in a dramatic version of "The Simple Life", just with guns and people who don't know how to use them. I think that says enough about your "storyline" as well.

Overall, the game is boring, redundant, and makes it clear why Tomb Raider just can't stand up to today's halfway decent games.

I have been a fan of TR since I was 9 in 96', and now, failure after failure, I say, let this series rot and die, like it has been doing for almost a decade now.:(

Of course I realise this is just your opinion however I find your post to be very mean and it's very obvious you don't understand that game developers work really long, hard hours to bring us these games - try being grateful for once! :rolleyes:

There are negative aspects to Anniversary sure, but no-one should churn out a spiel like yours without backing it up with some valid points - why did you hate it so much? I feel you could have compared it to the original and brought out the points you thought were wrong about Anniversary and backed them up with how the original TR had done it - you'd have gotten a much better response than just letting it all blurt out like you did :)

Just think about how different TRA and the original really are - one's a classic game which defined the 3D revolution in games and the other is a "modern re-imagoning" to bring the game up to date :)

Regardless of what CD did with TRA - it was always my opinion that they would never surpass the original TR anyway ;)