www.tombraiderforums.com

Go Back   www.tombraiderforums.com > Tomb Raider Series > The Last Revelation

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 04-09-09, 14:16   #11
rr_carroll
Bug Scientist
 
rr_carroll's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: California
Posts: 7,209
Default

It's normal to release two Ice Elementals. Some people call them wraiths or spirits.
rr_carroll is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-09, 14:23   #12
Eddie Haskell
Tomb Raider
 
Eddie Haskell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: -6.101321, 105.426846
Posts: 13,682
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rr_carroll View Post
It's normal to release two Ice Elementals. Some people call them wraiths or spirits.
Well then I guess it's possible for only one of them to get to the water, and maybe the other did not. And since the water is already frozen (mission accomplished), he still feels the need to get to me. But alas, his powers are gone and he cannot cause harm, just annoy the crap out me.
__________________
A conservative is someone who believes in reform. But not now. ~Mort Sahl
Eddie Haskell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-09, 18:40   #13
Mytly
Tomb Raider
 
Mytly's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: In the unfashionable end of the western spiral arm of the Galaxy
Posts: 14,255
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddie Haskell View Post
And I say it in plural because I swear there were more than one.
Aren't there usually two of them?

Anyway, the elementals/wraiths themselves don't cause the water to freeze, as this bit in our walkthrough makes clear:

Quote:
Note about the ice elementals - The ice elementals are triggered to only appear for few seconds. In fact, the ice elementals do not freeze the pool permanently. After releasing them, you enable an extra trigger that is activated when you drop into the pool. So, by dropping into the pool you activate a "flipmap" which changes the surface of the pool into ice. Jump into the pool as many times as you want before releasing the ice elementals. The water will not freeze. If you release the ice elementals and make rounds in the circular hallway (that is, do not drop into the pool), they will follow you around, but they will disappear after a few seconds. If you then drop into the pool and make your way back, the pool will be frozen, although the ice elementals never passed through it!! This is because you dropped into it after releasing the ice elementals, triggering the "flipmap".
So it's a bit of a mystery why one didn't just disappear normally, as it is supposed to. Even more mysterious that it now causes no damage.
Mytly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-09, 00:27   #14
rr_carroll
Bug Scientist
 
rr_carroll's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: California
Posts: 7,209
Default

OK, I've got several interesting things!

It's more complicated than you say, Eddie, though I had to go over the situation for a bit to see that. First the pool has three states:

Original liquid state.


"Frosty", after at least one Elemental disappears.


"Frozen", after you jump into the frosty (but still liquid) water.

All 3 images have the same brightness level.

I was able to release the locusts by jumping and shooting normal arrows, but I didn't get pistols to do anything. If I shot the pendulum and quickly dropped to the ground and stayed still, the Elementals vanished soon, and the pool was frosty when I went to it; but if I ran to the pool, they buzzed me repeatedly, and stayed a long time (I kept healing myself). The pool stayed in state #1. If I ran back down the stairs, they pursued but tended to soon wander off. On one occasion only one disappeared, which is probably related to what you saw (I was running back and forth to the pool). If I had jumped into the frosty pool with the remaining guy in some special position, I probably would get your situation.

But that's not all. The room with the pool and lever changes by the use of a flipmap, as you might expect. That is, there are actually two different rooms that are similar.

I was using Fexinspect to examine the rooms in the area, checking to see what the triggers do. As I expected the lever in the frozen room opens the door that lets you return to the surface. I thought the lever in the liquid version of the room would do nothing, since you don't go there in normal play - but no!, it opens the left side of the exit gate of the level!

Naturally, I had to test this. Here's a view of the unfrozen pool after I used the position editor to get across:

Note the flare glitch.

Throw the lever, jump in the pool and release the Elementals. When the pool is frozen simply step into the lever square and the nearby door opens. Then go straight to the level exit and see this!

The motorcycle fits through the gap.

If you look carefully at the 4th image, you can see triangular platforms in both corners of the room, which I had never noticed. It's not too hard to jump to either one, using a short running jump (I didn't try the full version). Then you can attempt a jump to the other side of the pool. If it works, you could shortcut most of the level, with no cheats or bugs!

Because Lara steps forward first with her left foot, it's easier to try this from the image's left corner. It should be easy, but the big stupid beam across the ceiling blocks the jump! I haven't given up because holding Action gets you very close.

Thanks for posting, Eddie. I never would have noticed any of this if you hadn't.

Last edited by rr_carroll; 05-09-09 at 00:31.
rr_carroll is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-09, 11:59   #15
The Great Chi
The Inscrutable One
 
The Great Chi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Beyond the Floating Islands
Posts: 9,082
Default

eddy, if you are on the PC can you save the game with this pet elemental, and put a copy of the save on ww.mediafire.com for us all to try this
__________________
Humble words by The Great Chi
The Great Chi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-09, 12:43   #16
Eddie Haskell
Tomb Raider
 
Eddie Haskell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: -6.101321, 105.426846
Posts: 13,682
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Great Chi View Post
eddy, if you are on the PC can you save the game with this pet elemental, and put a copy of the save on ww.mediafire.com for us all to try this
Here you go, have fun!

And rr carroll, that's extremely interesting to read, nice research! I never have fooled around with a TR game as you do, and as a consequence I am still trying to find many, many secrets in all of the TR games. Even after hundreds of play through's over all of the games. But I am glad to know a bit more about the hows and whys.

I did actually know of the corner platforms in that room, and I always could make it to the nearest ones on either side of the doorway. But it was not possible to jump to the other side and use the lever until the water was frozen.

The Ice Elemental vanished when I exited the level on the bike, so my pet abandoned me.
__________________
A conservative is someone who believes in reform. But not now. ~Mort Sahl
Eddie Haskell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-09, 17:07   #17
rr_carroll
Bug Scientist
 
rr_carroll's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: California
Posts: 7,209
Default

Avoiding walkthroughs and other info makes a lot of sense, there's always another discovery lurking around the corner for you. But stuff like that half-open gate really nags at me, it must be there for something! Probably just a route they decided to change, and they didn't go to the bother of removing it.
rr_carroll is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-09, 17:15   #18
The Great Chi
The Inscrutable One
 
The Great Chi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Beyond the Floating Islands
Posts: 9,082
Default

For those who do not have the PC version, here is Eddies savepoint in action

__________________
Humble words by The Great Chi
The Great Chi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-09, 21:59   #19
Eddie Haskell
Tomb Raider
 
Eddie Haskell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: -6.101321, 105.426846
Posts: 13,682
Default

^Heh heh heh nice work, love the captions.

Can anyone figure out why the creature exists and seems to seek you out and yet cannot harm you? I don't get that.
__________________
A conservative is someone who believes in reform. But not now. ~Mort Sahl
Eddie Haskell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-09, 04:06   #20
rr_carroll
Bug Scientist
 
rr_carroll's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: California
Posts: 7,209
Default

Answering that would require someone with Level Editor knowledge, who could examine what controls the changes in the Elementals and the flipmap for the pool rooms. I speculate that after the Elementals split up near the pool, one of them can enter the walls and trigger the pool's frosty state. If Lara jumps in quickly enough, the second Elemental doesn't have time to make it into the walls and disappear.

Why it avoids Lara and becomes harmless seems more mysterious. I wonder what happens if you re-enter the corridor and pool area?

Edit: Well, now I know! I downloaded your savegame. If you return to the corridor & pool, you hear it, but you don't see it. But as you climb out the exit, at a certain level the elemental flies all around Lara and through her (still harmless). It seems confined to a certain level. I went to the low area beyond the gate near the beginning of the level; there you can see the wraith is confined to an altitude about 8 clicks high. Since this is above the altitude at which it ordinarily appears, it's even MORE mysterious, if anything.

Last edited by rr_carroll; 06-09-09 at 06:09.
rr_carroll is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT. The time now is 00:15.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.