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Old 07-12-17, 13:26   #1
fallenangle
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Default TR3 No Scratch

After finishing PC TR2 on a my first 'no scratch'/all secrets play through of any game and enjoying it I decided to go onto PC TR3 and do the same. I'll probably play it over a much longer period though.

Jungle was not too difficult, a bit of trouble with the tigers as I'm also trying to limit myself to just pistols for as long as doing that remains fun.

Temple Ruins has been less easy and I'm glad I'm not using the PS version because I've been saving far more often than I do normally. You make one mistake, like misjudging the distance of a blade trap, and you're doomed to repeat a long section.

I am also stuck getting through the timed door, spiked walls and blades without damage. On the no medipack run I did a few years ago I remembered that being a place I couldn't get through unscathed so I'd almost convinced myself it was impossible.

But I checked online and found a YT video which shows it possible but only with very precise initial positioning. How the guy worked that out without going nuts with the repetition I can't imagine but apparently it works; yet to try it myself.

EDIT

Yay! That worked first time almost didn't believe it.

Problem is that you almost immediately come up against another, this time supposedly insoluble damage location getting back from the third secret at 15' 20" here:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcW4zb1Suaw

Thing is I think I managed it. Hang at the bottom of the ladder and press down until her left hand lets go momentarily then immediately drop and tumble. I'd swear there is no damage but I'm going to check with a screen shot to enlarge the small life bar you get when using 1280x1024 to make certain.*

However later (22' 15" in the same YT video) when you need to do a similar drop back into the main room that same technique does not work. She'll take less damage but it appears to be unavoidable.

If anyone here knows a 'legitimate' solution here please share.

*Bah! Checked that first drop against a full health bar in a graphics program and there is literally the thinnest sliver damage after the drop. Easy to miss at that resolution. Still using the tumble does appear to minimise the damage and it is less than if you use a conventional hang drop.

Last edited by fallenangle; 07-12-17 at 15:54.
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Old 10-12-17, 09:32   #2
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It is impossible. For example in Area 51 the last secret and in RX Tech Mines the underwater section. You can do the underwater section without medipacks but not without taking damage. There are even more places where you take forced damage
Good luck
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Old 10-12-17, 12:31   #3
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Anyway you can still do your best to show the "less damage possible" the game provides...
Also, Hallows (the bonus level, if you're planning to do it too), if I am not wrong, has a zone where you fall and you loose a lot of life, so you need to have the full bar to not die there.
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Old 10-12-17, 13:36   #4
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I was also wondering how far you can get before a level forces you to take damage. A few years ago I tried a no medipack run, but my chain ended in Madabu Gorge where Lara had to dive into the final part of the level, as I just couldn't get her to land without her dying! It was the only medipack I used in the entire game run. Oh well. Good luck and do keep us up to date with your progress!
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Old 11-12-17, 00:11   #5
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I've done no medipack runs through all the games so I know (if I can remember) the techniques and tactics I used to get through avoiding most of the damage. But it is a whole different level of difficulty avoiding damage completely.

As we all know it is impossible to complete all levels undamaged, All Hallows, as mentioned, being a good example. But there are places you think are impossible that can be done like that blade/spiked wall run in Temple Ruins. I doubt I would have had the patience to find that positioning/timing/technique myself especially when you can not possibly know if it can be done when you try. At what point do you give up and accept it can't be done?

Kudos to the YT guy who worked it out and showed us how it can be done.

EDIT 17.12.17
Found another place with unavoidable damage: L4 Caves Of Kaliya where you hang drop into the dark multiple cobra pit from above. I reckon the minimum damage is about 10%.

EDIT 18.12.17

L5 Nevada Desert: unavoidable damage (approx. 5%) jumping from the water tower, over the electrified fence, into the compound.

Apparently you can avoid the compound altogether with a jump from what would be the quad bike ramp which triggers the end cut scene. Not managed to do that yet but I'm trying to do all kills and pickups as well no damage so it would be a bit of a wimp out to bypass the compound.

EDIT 24.1217

All of the Nevada levels were tough going getting all secrets and just using pistols as well as no damage. But I've just completed Area 51 and still not used any other weapons. Those MP5 laser sight and other armed guards in both that and the previous level were a pain the neck to deal with, particularly when there is more than one. But they are all pistol only kill-able without taking damage if you take some time, exploit the game fairly and save very frequently.

I certainly would not want to try no damage, all secrets, all kills, all pickups on the PS version just using the available save crystals. You'd need to be a masochist to enjoy doing that.

Annoying thing in Area 51 is that last secret or rather exiting from it. After getting through all that with no damage it is frustrating that almost the last thing you do spoils that effort.

I found a way of limiting the jump damage by bending it onto the top of the flying saucer but it still takes about 15% off the health. No YT video or description I've read indicates there's any solution.

Again if anyone knows a legitimate way to reduce or avoid the damage anywhere in TR3: please share.

Last edited by fallenangle; 24-12-17 at 02:34.
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Old 30-12-17, 16:59   #6
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Moved onto London and had the same sort of problems with unavoidable damage in Thames Wharf. Three places you are forced to take damage from barbed wire: getting back from the first secret, a sliver of damage jumping to the crane platform after going through the cisterns and a similar amount of damage on that stupid little slope outside the cathedral you have to jump up shortly after that.

It annoys more because you've spent so much effort getting through numerous gun toting enemies without damage just using the pistols which, in some places, is very tricky.

Getting all the pickups in Thames Wharf without drop damage was also hard too. In that second dark warehouse courtyard area across from the start point dropping to the floor to get the two pickups (+ save crystal for PS) causes damage. But I found you can do a long bendy jump from the lower metallic platform, after you get the flue key, and grab the ladder in the corner. It is not easy but I was quite please with myself to discover it could be done.

Aldwych unavoidable damage annoys too. In the drill shaft you can minimise it but whether you want to get the secret there's or not I could not find a way to avoid damage. Then there is the simple but unavoidable hang drop to the area in front of the timed door switches once you have the second Solomon key. That does a pointless sliver of damage too.

Currently doing Lud's Gate and as I expected the the armed guards in the museum are a pain to deal with in the confined spaces near the start using just pistols. I've been tempted to use the Desert Eagle but I found a way through them all only to be forced to take damage getting down the back of the sphinx you have to do if you want to get to the nearby secret area and collect the small medi-pack.

It is again made more annoying because if you get the jump direction and technique correct it only causes the finest sliver of damage. I was pleased to find a way of receiving far less damage than I accepted when doing a no medi-pack run. But any damage on a no scratch run is unacceptable and if was not for the design detail there I think the damage could be avoided.
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Old 30-12-17, 20:22   #7
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Nice run so far
No scratch is really rewarding and frustrating challenge
Since you asked, Lud's Gate is possible without any damage, legally of course.
Sorry if a bit late but you might want to check this, it only reduces the damage to the minimum 0.5%, from 4.5%.
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Old 31-12-17, 13:09   #8
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Thanks.

That Temple Ruins drop shown seems to do exactly the same damage as I managed there. Interesting that it involved not killing the Kali statue though; I wonder if dropping onto that, alive or dead, might minimise or reduce the damage further. Something to try later.

You can certainly do Lud's Gate without damage if you don't go to the museum or you are not going for all the secrets/pickups there. But if you are, like me, only using legitimate techniques, I don't think it is possible. But any more idea for avoiding damage anywhere in the game I'd be very interesting in knowing about.

The only way to the secret with the two rockets and crystal on the platform along the wall to right of the sphinx is via the column at the back > jump/grab/slide projection from the wall. You can only get there with minimum(?) damage, legitimately, AFAIK, by jumping from the head, tumbling in mid-air and grabbing the edge of the slide immediately adjacent to the platform with the small medipack. Then you need another back-jump with tumble and full left bend to land on the column.

Of course if you're using cheats there are several ways and places you can use corner/crawl bugs, to get the secret and collect the small medi-pack, even from right down on the floor of the room.

Last edited by fallenangle; 31-12-17 at 13:12.
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Old 31-12-17, 14:45   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fallenangle View Post
Lud's Gate without damage if you don't go to the museum or you are not going for all the secrets/pickups there. But if you are, like me, only using legitimate techniques, I don't think it is possible
That's what I meant, it is possible, I didn't want to give you any spoilers though.

The statue in Temple Ruins kicks Lara to the 1 click higher tile. The vertical length of the fall that matters.
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Old 31-12-17, 16:06   #10
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Thanks again. So I guess that would mean even if the statue in Temple Ruins was 'dead', ie. you were clever enough to kill it so it was lying underneath where Lara has to drop you'd still receive the same damage. Pity.

Just been replaying the first part of Lud's Gate and I found there is another problem when going for all pickups. The embarrassing reason for having to do this was because I didn't know the route to first secret area is shut off by a door if you do the right hand museum route first. So I had to replay all the stuff I'd done up to the sphinx but if it did prove one thing that is the techniques I used for dealing with the armed museum guards are repeatable.

It was then I also realised I'd missed the rocket on the front of the sphinx and as far as I can tell there is no way of getting that and getting back up to the secret area or getting the small medi-pack at the back.

It is an either/or problem apparently and as I'm prioritizing equally no damage/all secrets > all kills > all pickups > pistols only I've had to leave the rocket.

It is the first pickup I've knowingly had to leave.

City

Finished Lud's Gate with just that little bit of damage. Really difficult to deal with the frogmen but did it. I think I had a glitch there too: when I used the switch in the boiler room to open the final underwater door another crocodile should appear, at least it did the first time. But on multiple retries - no croc anywhere to be found. WTF?

So pleased you can do the whole of City without damage up to the point you kill SL. However going back for all pickups and the secret you find the hang drop from the crawl space secret area damages LC. No way to avoid it but it can be minimised if you shimmy full to the left and then tumble as you hit the dirt. Again the damage there is all you take and, like the Lud's Gate sphinx one really is minimal, but it still counts as another you can't finish with all secrets doing no scratch.

Last edited by fallenangle; 02-01-18 at 18:01.
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