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Old 13-07-22, 08:26   #1
TombHackR
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Default PS1 secrets count

Hi everyone,

I want to 100 % complete Tomb Raider III. That is, collecting 60 secrets and completing All Hallows.

I completed the game last year, but there is no way of knowing how many secrets I got in each individual level, only the total at the end of the game. So I will have to do the entire game again, since I only remember getting 6/6 in Jungle.

However, can I do the levels in any order I want ? Let’s say I wanted to complete Aldwych first, then do Coastal Village… and then do the rest until I’ve collected all 60, then complete Meteorite Cavern to see final statistics ? Will that work ?

I need to know if the game counts the number of secrets as a value per level, or as a total value ?

For example, let’s say the game stores it as a total value every time you save the game. I have got 6 secrets in Jungle, 2 in Temple Ruins… and I have decided to go back after completing the game fully, to get all the secrets in River Ganges.

Stored value:
Jungle (6/6 secrets)
6 total secrets (max 6 so far)

Temple Ruins (2/4 secrets)
8 total secrets (max 10 so far)
River Ganges (5/5 secrets)
13 total secrets (max 15 so far)


Now, I have decided to complete all the secrets in Temple Ruins… but because I have done River Ganges first, it stores it like this:

Stored value:
Jungle (6/6 secrets)
6 total secrets (max 6 so far)

Temple Ruins (4/4 secrets)
10 total secrets (max 10 so far)
River Ganges (5/5 secrets)
13 total secrets (max 15 so far)


Do you see what I mean ? Is this how the game works with save games ? Or is it not a problem ?
Does anyone know ?

Last edited by TombHackR; 13-07-22 at 08:34.
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Old 13-07-22, 12:48   #2
fallenangle
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Good question and unfortunately I do not know the answer for sure.

The game levels are saved at the start of each with, I guess, the running stats from the previous level you've just finished and the new level with zero secrets. Therefore if you go back, find the missing secrets and save its not going to be added to the existing stats.

Effectively it'll treat the updated level secrets collected save state stats as a different profile. You'd have to continue from that point and redo all the subsequent levels again.............I think.

You can't substitute in the updated save data by any method. I pretty sure that is correct because I replay and finish individual TR3 levels without bothering to collect all the secrets. If you continue using that 'profile' and finish the game, despite having carefully preserved all secrets Tinnos and Meteorite Cavern game saves, when finished, Meteorite Cavern stats will show missing secrets and it won't go onto All Hallows.

Assuming we're talking about the PC version the obvious solution is simply redo each level with missing secrets and find them. When all done use the All Hallows game save from Stella's TR website.

It is no cheat to do this, it is just a way around a problem.

In TR2 The Golden Mask doing much the same to be able to play the Nightmare Vegas bonus level is almost mandatory because of a glitch in some versions where it doesn't unlock even when you've found all the secrets.

Last edited by fallenangle; 13-07-22 at 12:49.
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Old 14-07-22, 08:33   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fallenangle View Post
In TR2 The Golden Mask doing much the same to be able to play the Nightmare Vegas bonus level is almost mandatory because of a glitch in some versions where it doesn't unlock even when you've found all the secrets.
That's what happens when people use TR2 exe instead of GM.
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Old 14-07-22, 12:09   #4
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Sorry to TombHackR - I did not notice you were just talking about the PS version of TR3. So the option of downloading All Hallows is not available.

I am wondering though about the save system and whether that might total the secrets stats differently.

I've just checked my PS TR3 game saves and I found the one where I'd unlocked All Hallows. What I discovered was that all the previous levels are made available for replay but with the stats set to zero including secrets.

That is different from the PC version but whether that means each level stats are saved in isolation for each level and then totted up at the end of the game or whether the running score is carried over from level to level I do not know.

But I found this on Stella's TR general guide for TR3:-

"For the PlayStation version I suggest you don't return to any level after completing it, at least until you've reached the final location: Antarctica. If you've missed secrets and want the bonus level, either use the cheat for extra secrets, or replay from the beginning."

That suggests it might save the data for individual levels but it is not a good idea to go back and do that because it may trigger a loop bug.

Quote:
That's what happens when people use TR2 exe instead of GM.
Maybe but if you want to install the game to run without using the original disc (I do) don't you have to do that? The GOG and Steam versions are notorious for the problem with Nightmare In Vegas too. So if it was just a simple matter of using the "GM.exe" wouldn't that have been fixed and common knowledge.

I have all my original TR (PC TR1 - 5 discs) including The Golden Mask and whatever the advice here was at the time (10+ years ago) for running it from the HDD that's what I did. I replayed it fairly recently, last year, and it was only when it didn't unlock I remembered I had that Nightmare In Vegas start level save downloaded in my TR archive for that very reason.

Last edited by fallenangle; 14-07-22 at 12:28.
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Old 14-07-22, 18:00   #5
TombHackR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fallenangle View Post
I found this on Stella's TR general guide for TR3:-

"For the PlayStation version I suggest you don't return to any level after completing it, at least until you've reached the final location: Antarctica. If you've missed secrets and want the bonus level, either use the cheat for extra secrets, or replay from the beginning."
Okay, I see. If Stella says it’s not a good idea then it probably won’t work .
I just thought that… with being able to access every level on a single PS1 savegame… and the fact that TR3 is non chronological and you can choose the order of which locations you can go to… I wondered if going back to redo levels to gain the secrets, would add to the total at the end of Meteorite Cavern.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fallenangle View Post
I've just checked my PS TR3 game saves and I found the one where I'd unlocked All Hallows. What I discovered was that all the previous levels are made available for replay but with the stats set to zero including secrets.
That makes sense, because you are replaying the level from the beginning, so the timer is going to set back to zero seconds, and the kills & secrets stats will reset too. If you exited the level without saving then it will keep the original stats.
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Old 14-07-22, 19:02   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fallenangle View Post
Maybe but if you want to install the game to run without using the original disc (I do) don't you have to do that? The GOG and Steam versions are notorious for the problem with Nightmare In Vegas too. So if it was just a simple matter of using the "GM.exe" wouldn't that have been fixed and common knowledge.
No. Although using the TR2 exe is an option (so you can play without the TR2 disc), it isn't advised due to the issues mentioned above in addition to incorrect wolf and bear AI. The best ways to play the expansion today are either by using a patched Golden Mask exe that has the CD check removed (No-CD) in which the original TR2 disc doesn't need to be detected. Or, you can play The Golden Mask via Arsunt's TR2Main - all under a single TR2 installation.

Apologies to TombHackR for derailing the thread somewhat.
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Old 15-07-22, 11:25   #7
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Thanks for that info on the use of the patched GM.exe.

I don't think I'm going to 'risk' messing around with my current install on this PC. As for all the other TR 1 -5 games the no-CD set ups I'm using have served me well for a long time, even if it does cause that GM issue.

However I'm currently building, slowly, a new PC (Win 11 ) with, hopefully, significantly better gaming capabilities. I'm definitely going to want to install all the old TRs on it. So whatever the current, preferred "No CD" method for doing that will be used this time.
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Old 15-07-22, 13:25   #8
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I have the TR2 GM no CD exe on my Onedrive. It can be widescreen-patched no problem.

EDIT: I had no idea the PSX version of TR3 worked like that, as I've never really done anything with the PSX version. I might have finished Jungle just to see how the game plays on a gamepad, but not much else.

Well, time to dust off these (non-existent) pad skills and finish all the TRs!

Last edited by Sardoc; 15-07-22 at 13:28.
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