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Old 06-09-17, 07:22   #11
klona
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I do not know why CD wants Lara to be relatable in their way. That's like saying we want her to be an ordinary person. Lara is not ordinary, she should be extraordinary. What made Lara into Lara was that she was never an ordinary simple person.
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Old 06-09-17, 07:38   #12
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What the hell does this word even mean, to you personally?
It means that I can connect metaphorically with some of the character's feelings and the concept of the situations she's experiencing . What people utterly fails to understand is that for someone to relate to a character it doesn't mean that he has to face the exact same things she's facing . You know , no body on the planet have ever survived a supernatural island filled with sun-worshipping maniacs and then sat out to Siberia to search for a jewel that grants immortality . Key word : metaphor . Being ridiculed for pursuing what you believe in ? having been skilled but never actually putting them skills into the REAL test before ? experiencing fear and anxiety but eventually overcoming it with your physical and inner strength and never giving up ? learning how to be confident in yourself ? fighting your inner demons ? hasn't anyone really went through some of that ? will , I know I did and that's what makes Reboot Lara relate-able to me .

And for the record , I find Classic Lara to be relateable too , rebelling against your parents and society to chase your passion and prevent others from controlling and planning your life is very inspiring . I guess LAU Lara is the least inspiring or relatable among the three . Oh wait , people who lost their mums at a young age and are still experiencing the grief and sadness over it can relate to her in the aspect but this is hardly inspiring or self-encouraging , lol .

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But is Reboot Lara (sorry to dig at her, once again, but it's true) any more "relatable" than classic Lara, with her completely humourless, dour, remarkably fast-learning and highly Americanised British demeanour?
I have a very serious question regarding humor .

Why do most people insist that Lara currently having very little humor is unrealistic ?
"Omg , Reboot Lara is humorless she has no personality" . Since when was humor = personality ? since when are most other personality traits are forgotten , overlooked and ignored just because one trait wasn't there (or not being expanded upon) ? I definitely want more dry back to Reboot Lara (she had shown very small glimpses of it in both games though) , but that doesn't render her "unrealistic" to me . Y'know , serious people or those who lack humor and who don't crack jokes and throw around one-liners loosely 24/7 do exist in real life , if that makes them boring to you then so be it , but it does NOT mean that they're unrelateable , unrealistic and overall stripped off a personality .

Last edited by Patrick star; 06-09-17 at 09:31.
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Old 06-09-17, 09:24   #13
Nigel Cassidy
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What the hell does this word even mean, to you personally?
I think there has only ever been one character in a third person game that I felt 'was me' rather than me being a camera that is floating around the character, and that was Commander Shepard. The reason for that is that he has no distinct canonical personality, but you decide for yourself what he does or says. His personality is truly shaped by me. That is what makes him relatable. A lot of people in the Mass Effect community were talking about 'their Shepard'. Everybody's Shepard is different.

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Furthermore, why is it considered so important for a character to be "relatable",
It isn't. Not for me, and I find it quite absurd how Rhianna Pratchett spoke about old Lara and her 'Lara' in a way as if relatability was all that mattered. What is important to me is that the character is interesting and well written, and has a personality and identity that is appropriate to the setting.

Last edited by Nigel Cassidy; 06-09-17 at 09:25.
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Old 06-09-17, 10:19   #14
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Well I can't answer this question because I never felt the need to relate to a character in a video game so... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Old 06-09-17, 10:49   #15
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Ah relatable, the word i despise so much since other writers love to use it as a badge of honor or some sort.

Creating a relatable character is crap when you use it to praise yourself.
Because there is nothing easier than to create a relatable character, everybody can do that in a just one full sentence.

The moment you create a character, it is a relatable one...thats how the human mind works.
Humans will always find a way to relate even to the most boring and one dimensional character...so its not hard to create a relatable character.

It gets tricky when you want the character to be relatable or liked to a bigger extend...then you need to show your real talent as writer.
The only way not to relate to a character is if you refuse to do so...other than that its not hard to make a relatable character.

So i find this whole "relatable" thing considering either Laras useless.
You can relate with both laras for several dozens of reason, they have a ton of similaritys if you look at it etc.
Yet they are not supposed to be the very same characters.
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Old 06-09-17, 11:41   #16
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That change between 'fragile victim persona' in cutscenes and 'incredibly capable' in-game also doesn't help.
Yeah I noticed this too. It's like they didn't know how to navigate the "young inexperienced Lara" storyline and still make it a fun game, while still making grounded sense. They wanted to do the "young fragile Lara", but still have a game that can stand next to Uncharted and be as exciting, which doesn't really work. It's contradictory.
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I have a very serious question regarding humor .

Why do most people insist that Lara currently having very little humor is unrealistic ?
"Omg , Reboot Lara is humorless she has no personality" . Since when was humor = personality ? since when are most other personality traits are forgotten , overlooked and ignored just because one trait wasn't there (or not being expanded upon) ? I definitely want more dry back to Reboot Lara (she had shown very small glimpses of it in both games though) , but that doesn't render her "unrealistic" to me . Y'know , serious people or those who lack humor and who don't crack jokes and throw around one-liners loosely 24/7 do exist in real life , if that makes them boring to you then so be it , but it does NOT mean that they're unrelateable , unrealistic and overall stripped off a personality .
I get that, not everyone is a comedian and is constantly cracking jokes, but I do still think it makes a character far more likeable. I'm drawn to a character who makes you laugh and seems like a fun person to be around. Humour very often is a great way of communication and passing on ideas in a playful way. The kind of rapid-fire quick wit that classic Lara had is also a sign of great intelligence, which you'd think a woman of Lara's social standing and training would have.

I couldn't imagine being at a party with Reboot Lara, what would we talk about that wouldn't bore anyone to death?

Last edited by Yeauxleaux; 06-09-17 at 13:32.
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Old 06-09-17, 13:13   #17
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Well, to me classic Lara was more relatable because IMO she was more consistent. She was the same person in scenes and in gameplay, there wasn't a weird disconnect. And there was that lovely connection between what she wanted and what I wanted, both being the same thing: to explore, solve, discover. Also, I personally relate more to the characters that, in the everyman-superhero spectrum, stand more to the superhero side, characters I would want to be.

And as far as I know, classic Lara and reboot Lara are just different, one is note more relatable than the other. A character needs balance to be relatable. It can't be full superhero, totally perfect, no flaws, because that is boring, and it can't be all flaws and nothing to admire/aspire to, because then why are you invested? Both classic and reboot Lara have that balance, but leaning to different sides.

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Old 06-09-17, 13:56   #18
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I think it's an "everyman" complex. Jimmy Stewart as Tomb Raider. TBH, there are times I think "Mary Sue."

The problem with "relatable" is that it's different for everyone. I have a lot more in common iwth Classic Lara's sange froide and dry sense of humor than TReboot's huffing-puffing, I've GOTTA because Naive Reason.

Part of the problem is TReboot Lara is horribly, horribly written. She's inconsistent, stupid, and boring. Her ability to throw herself around and kills lots of mercs in no way mitigates how much I just want to shake her and make her stop talking and acting like a sausage.
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Old 06-09-17, 14:23   #19
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So I thought about this some more and have another possible answer. A relatable character is to humanize them. Not through dialog but action. I will use my to favorite video game characters Chris Redfield and Jill valentine to illustrate.

Chris and Jill are members of S.T.A.R.S. Alpha team (Special Tactics and Rescue Service). Both have a strong sense of right and wrong and justice. In the first game the mansion incident we find out what kind of people they are. They are resourceful, courageous, and do every thing they can to save their comrades.

Chris has to put trust in Rebecca Chambers a new and untested member of STARS Bravo team. While Jill needs to keep trust in Barry Burton another Alpha member who is acting strange. All the while doing their jobs in a unknown hostile environment. Only to have their Captain Wesker betray them.

These are very real and human things that people can face every day. You don't need to experience some thing personally to know what it is like. You just have to look at a person and go that could happen to me. Then question yourself how you would handle it. Chris and Jill may not be super hero's but they do super things. But only because they rise to the challenge.

And some say Classic Lara Croft is more super hero than woman. Her mother and father disowned her. That is hearing your mother and father say they don't love you. She can be hurt hence the need for medical packs. She needed to be trained to do what she does. As we all need on the job training to do the job. Her actions set in motion terrible event that she needs to fix. So she is not perfect, just like everyone else. She can be flirtatious but distant. Wonder if that is a side effect from the lack of love from her parents?

So I say to be a relatable character they need to be human.
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Old 06-09-17, 14:33   #20
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Relatable should mean something/someone you can relate to on a personal level, namely a situation, a person, or lately, videogame characters as the trends demand.

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What the hell does this word even mean, to you personally?
If we're talking about the gaming universe, it means absolutely nothing.

That's not exactly what I usually look for when I pick up a new videogame to have fun with for the next 5 hours of my life. Mostly, I try to spend my free time with something that makes me escape from the real world problems and thus something that's not ordinarily boring like real life is. After all, a videogame character is still someone you spend some time with despite being a bunch of pixels on a TV/PC screen.

And characters aside, it's the gameplay that plays the biggest role for me in determining whether a game might be worthy of my time or not, so I've literally no clue as to why the personal struggles and inner fights of a videogame character are becoming one of the most important aspects of videogames nowadays.

I mean, who cares if Lara Croft is going through hard times and may end up suffering from PTSD or whatever traumatizing experience she had to endure is shaping her to be stronger and more determined...? She's not one of my real life friends or someone I am supposed to take care about, let me just have fun with an entertaining character who makes my gaming experience enjoyable and light-hearted.

Another thing I take issue with is that it seems as though the concept of relatability should be universal, as if we all should relate to the exact same things. The way arguments like "THIS character is now RELATABLE" are shoved down our throats like some sort of imposition is quite annoying. But really, in reality we all relate to different people and different situations and it works the same with videogames. Some will relate to a character because they find many similarities with their own personality or have things in common, others may relate to a character for what it represents for them regardless of the fact that they might not share any common trait. It's always different, there's no such thing as "take this character, it's better now because it's relatable".

I respect whoever relates to Reboot Lara Croft. I know some of them do because they actually found a lot of things in common and therefore they like to see themselves represented so well by a virtual avatar.

On the other hand, I don't really care about relatability but I do feel closer to classic Lara. We couldn't be more different in many aspects but it's more a case of finding her an inspirational role model, someone to look up to except for the "killer" attitude lol. Either way, it's not like I started to play Tomb Raider because I wanted to find a relatable character to baby sit, it was the sense of adventure, the engaging gameplay mechanics and a fun, sarcastic, larger-than-life female badass that brought me in. I had fun and I couldn't care less about Lara's personal problems, now it's the exact same.

Last edited by Hazelphoenix; 06-09-17 at 14:36.
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