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Old 11-03-17, 18:10   #11
Zreen001
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Yes he's Bartoli and he's the same one in the video where Lara drives on the snow and a man with a hat follows her with a truck until she jumps over a rift. (He's just seen for 2 seconds...) .
Yes I meant mafioso but I didn't knew the term because I'm italian and I suck at english.
Which is funny because mafioso is an Italian word...
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Old 11-03-17, 18:36   #12
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The mysterious man in black in the main screen is marco bartoli.
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Old 11-03-17, 22:45   #13
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Old 11-03-17, 22:48   #14
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In TR2, Lara's not seen as this unstoppable, enigmatic force threatening the antagonist. That concept is currently being beaten to death by Crystal Dynamics in their new TR series.
That concept is being used in every TR game except TR2 , it's definitely not exclusive to CD's new TR games , and I prefer that concept anyway ,
The concept of rivalry , competition and face-to-face conflicts between the protagonist and the antagonist , yes it's cliched , yes it's overused , but it's by far more interesting and adds a lot more excitement and thrill to the experience than a story in which there's supposed to be a villain , but one that has literally no character , personality , motivation or background at all , in short : almost no presence .

One could argue that the classics were never about stories or good characters , but here I'm merely comparing TR2 to TR1 in terms of villains , and in this regard , TR2 was a big step backwards .
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Old 12-03-17, 00:57   #15
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Originally Posted by dinne View Post
Yes he's Bartoli and he's the same one in the video where Lara drives on the snow and a man with a hat follows her with a truck until she jumps over a rift. (He's just seen for 2 seconds...) .
Yes I meant mafioso but I didn't knew the term because I'm italian and I suck at english.
That last statement is wonderfully ironic: I admit I did have to check this and it is slightly more convoluted etymology than I thought but mafioso is actually derived from a localized Italian/Sicilian word with its roots in an Arabic term meaning self-confident or flashy, probably in a derogatory way ie. too flashy.

The word Mafia has been in general use in Italy since the mid 19th century.

The use of the word mafioso to describe Mafia gang members is apparently mostly an Italian American thing. The word was probably adopted from Italian immigrants and adapted into US English in the latter half of the 19th century. But the word is originally Italian.
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Old 12-03-17, 03:40   #16
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Old 12-03-17, 05:18   #17
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Yes, I'm talking about the man on the title screen as well as the person seen in the snow chase cutscene. I assumed they were the same person but is that really Marco? Why the sudden change in appearance? The man in black appears to be wearing a long trench coat without glasses while wearing a hat where as Marco is just wearing a suit with sunglasses and is hat less.

I assumed he was another italian mobster who played a role in the game but did not know who he was thus the reason why I asked.
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Old 12-03-17, 10:02   #18
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I think the lack of consistency between representations of Bartoli reflects the rapid development cycles of the early TR games, the generally lower standards of QA of the day and the fact that, as I understand it, the CGI and render work was farmed out to a separate studio. So the two versions (in-house and external) didn't always match up perfectly. I believe that most of the quoted examples so far are in fact supposed to be Bartoli though, including the guy in the truck in the cutscene before Temple of Xian.
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Old 12-03-17, 12:55   #19
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Of course, with no doubts it is italian but I didn't knew its existence in the english language. Same when I tried to explain a recipe with... "zucchini", and I way saying "uhm green long cucumbers" Here we use "mafioso" regurarily for mafia members, but for plural it is "mafiosi". Anyway a relevant number of words that are born in Sicily or that are part of the sicilian language had originally arabic roots.
I understand, I wasn't having a go. So apologies if my post sounded like that.

On the vegetable matter: you would have to learn to call them courgettes (French) not zucchini if you lived in the UK, that's what we generally call them.

If you called them zucchini a lot of people here wouldn't know what you meant either. Describing them as green long cucumbers would actually be even more confusing because our typical cucumbers are green and long. In decent markets courgettes can also be sold yellow, mottled green or stripey.

What is funny and weird is that we've ended up talking about vegetables in a TR gaming forum.
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Old 13-03-17, 01:37   #20
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Originally Posted by ace_85 View Post
I think the lack of consistency between representations of Bartoli reflects the rapid development cycles of the early TR games, the generally lower standards of QA of the day and the fact that, as I understand it, the CGI and render work was farmed out to a separate studio. So the two versions (in-house and external) didn't always match up perfectly. I believe that most of the quoted examples so far are in fact supposed to be Bartoli though, including the guy in the truck in the cutscene before Temple of Xian.
I was just about to post this.
You can tell this too when you see Dr. Willard in TR3 (the intro cutscene and the boat in India after you defeat Mad Tony) that Willard looks a lot different in his cutscene form compared to his ingame model.

I do wish that the CGI model of Marco as we see him on the title screen looked more like that in game. I would take that over his weird, dark glasses and wrinkly leather face any day. He looks like powerful and sinister on the title screen than in game.

Last edited by Quebsenuef; 13-03-17 at 01:38.
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