Suicide: your views - Page 2

jajay119 · 08-07-12, 23:53

It's a difficult call. On one hand you never know what is going on in a person life and sometimes it could be seen as justified. But in general I think it's not the best option and I hate how common and easily taken as a resolve it's become by the youth of today.

Encore · 08-07-12, 23:53

I personally believe that "your body is your temple". IE, no one else has the right to decide what you do with it. The ultimate consequence of this belief is that I think everyone has (or should have) the right to decide when to end their own lives. Simply because it's no one else's business.

Of course I can think of a suicidal person as "selfish" or "coward" if they, for instance, abandon their family in their act. But the thing is - no matter how important our social connections are, all humans are essentially individuals. We are incapable of understanding what other people are feeling, their emotions and suffering, so I think that should be taken into account when passing judgment on someone who obviously had plenty of bad things going on inside their minds (because no one kills themselves just for the lulz).

The Great Chi · 09-07-12, 00:05

I never though anyone could think about suicide until this year, I had a massive absess on my ass that appeared overnight, and never felt pain like it in my whole life, it was pure torture.

It took two months of pure agony trying to recover and drain the absess out, during March and April, every move was vicious, and if it had not been for instant hospital attention and pain killers, I would have done anything to get rid of the constant pain. Luckly I knew it was only temporary, although two months is a long temporary.

For people who are in constant pain through an incurable or long term body illness, I can now see their reasoning to commit suicide, to end their suffering.

There is nothing worse than 24/7 pain, because thats all you can think about. You do not realise, till its you.

Zelda master · 09-07-12, 00:19

Ive actually been there, ill post gonorroe more, gonna take a sleep first :P

matrix54 · 09-07-12, 00:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ikas90

There is actually no certainty of that. We can't remember if we made a choice to be here or not.

No.

I'm PRETTY DAMN SURE your parents didn't check to see if it was OK with their future child if it was alright to have them. Reproduction cells do what reproduction cells are meant to do - make a baby. I'm pretty sure sperm cells don't get second thoughts before entering the egg cell, and say "maybe this isn't the right time". A baby takes time to develop from next to nothing, and then it, after a long period of time, is it able to think for itself and make choices.

Once again, I'm PRETTY DAMN SURE it wasn't up to you, but your parents, and the chance that your father was pumping out a winners and your mother's system was in working order. You have no say in whether or not your given a life or not.
---------------------------------------

And for ANYONE who thinks it's selfish, and they should consider those who they're leaving behind - that's ludicrous. Someone should wither away because of depression, all because you don't want them to relieve themselves of the burden of pain? Isn't that selfish.

"I know you're sad, but you make me happy. Can you please be sad a little while longer? Please?

"

If that's not selfish, please, tell me what is?

CiaKonwerski · 09-07-12, 01:10

I think it is a little grey, but more sided toward the "these people have serious depression" side. Because yeah, people who start to have suicidal thoughts are those who are, in some from, going through a depression. I do think however that when people start feeling depressed or start having any sort of thoughts like this, that they should tell someone right away. Otherwise they get so close to the end and decide, yep I'm doing it. I understand that it isn't easy to tell someone, but unfortunately that is the only option. It confuses me very much, because I haven't truly felt depressed and all out of hope, I have however felt very sad due to certain circumstances. It confuses me because...you see these videos of people before they kill themselves, and you see them and you think...what horrible horrible thing is happening to that person, which makes them want to leave this world so badly. What is triggering them to have that thought that there is literally no hope left? It saddens me to think that these people feel like no one is there for them, some who even have a great amount of friends. And so it is odd, is it the depressions that makes them think this, or something else? There is always something worth living for in my opinion. Friends if not family, family if not friends, the belief that something or someone will help you. It's just so weird that depression can make a person completely ignore the good aspects, ignore the pros and cons etc. And just makes them think to end it. But yes, a part of me is confused as to whether the depression causes people to think that way, in terms of erasing the good aspects and the ability to think how other people would feel, or whether there are some people who are simply selfish and are looking for an easy way out instead of dealing with what is being thrown at them. Some people who commit suicide I suppose do not even actually have to be "depressed". But maybe they do, I am unsure. I do know however that I wish people did not have those thoughts. Because their life is worth more than they know, to someone...something, somewhere.

@Rai-I agree, and that definitely is where the "grey" option from me comes in.

Ikas90 · 09-07-12, 01:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by matrix54

No.

I'm PRETTY DAMN SURE your parents didn't check to see if it was OK with their future child if it was alright to have them. Reproduction cells do what reproduction cells are meant to do - make a baby. I'm pretty sure sperm cells don't get second thoughts before entering the egg cell, and say "maybe this isn't the right time". A baby takes time to develop from next to nothing, and then it, after a long period of time, is it able to think for itself and make choices.

Once again, I'm PRETTY DAMN SURE it wasn't up to you, but your parents, and the chance that your father was pumping out a winners and your mother's system was in working order. You have no say in whether or not your given a life or not.

You speak strictly from a biological and scientific standpoint. You have to take into account that some people believe they made a choice to be here, consciously or not, and actually have valid reasons to believe so, regardless of what you believe. 'Pretty damn sure' is as close as you can get, so once again, I'm going to say that there is no certainty.

There's a reason suicide is such a controversial matter, and saying it's only down to what you're feeling and what others think of you is only one aspect of it. It's fair enough for you to believe that, but this is a thread that warrants discussion from all angles. No one is forcing anyone to believe anything.

Draco · 09-07-12, 01:54

Suicide can only be for selfish reasons. What other reasons are there to kill yourself?

As for whether it is cowardly, well, if you get to the point of suicide, then suicide is already the defacto easier path. And taking the easy path is the province of the coward.

Taking a stand against adversity requires an empathy with others outside yourself and a conviction to not shy away from a challenge simply because it is easier.

Life is a challenge, face it or quit.

AmericanAssassin · 09-07-12, 01:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Draco

Suicide can only be for selfish reasons. What other reasons are there to kill yourself?

As for whether it is cowardly, well, if you get to the point of suicide, then suicide is already the defacto easier path. And taking the easy path is the province of the coward.

Taking a stand against adversity requires an empathy with others outside yourself and a conviction to not shy away from a challenge simply because it is easier.

Life is a challenge, face it or quit.

I agree with this post entirely.

matrix54 · 09-07-12, 02:00

It's not even strictly a matter of science, but a matter of fact. Not believe. To make a choice requires a conscience, and a conscience requires a brain. Cells do not have the mental capacity (if any mental capacity at all) to make a choice of whether or not to go to the egg cell or not - it's just what they do. They try, and if they make it, they make it, if they die, the get turned into protein (I assume). People can say 'I believe this" or "I believe that" - sometimes fact is fact.

That's the beauty of the word "believe". It's not based on anything. You can pick up a few medical text books on the wonders of reproduction and childbirth - fascinating stuff.

And yes, I do understand suicide is a controversial matter - I am a very informed member of society, and I can fully understand the matter of Suicide, seeing as I've dealt with the issue personally - not pretty. I can fully + completely shift my brain around all aspect of suicide - it's not even a had situation to grasp. Suicide is a one side issue to the person dealing with it. They DO think about who they're leaving behind (it should be true for most cases), but if the pain is that serious, sticking around "for the good times" isn't going to cut it if they're already going to kill themselves. If they stay, what they we going to kill themselves over probably wasn't worth it in the end.

08-07-12, 23:53	#11
jajay119 Tomb Raider Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 10,577	It's a difficult call. On one hand you never know what is going on in a person life and sometimes it could be seen as justified. But in general I think it's not the best option and I hate how common and easily taken as a resolve it's become by the youth of today. __________________ Don't you know that something will come around?

08-07-12, 23:53	#12
Encore Tomb Raider Join Date: May 2006 Location: With Loki's army Gender: Female Posts: 17,259	I personally believe that "your body is your temple". IE, no one else has the right to decide what you do with it. The ultimate consequence of this belief is that I think everyone has (or should have) the right to decide when to end their own lives. Simply because it's no one else's business. Of course I can think of a suicidal person as "selfish" or "coward" if they, for instance, abandon their family in their act. But the thing is - no matter how important our social connections are, all humans are essentially individuals. We are incapable of understanding what other people are feeling, their emotions and suffering, so I think that should be taken into account when passing judgment on someone who obviously had plenty of bad things going on inside their minds (because no one kills themselves just for the lulz). __________________ I am Loki, of Asgard. And I am burdened with glorious purpose.

09-07-12, 00:05	#13
The Great Chi The Inscrutable One Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Beyond the Floating Islands Posts: 7,223	I never though anyone could think about suicide until this year, I had a massive absess on my ass that appeared overnight, and never felt pain like it in my whole life, it was pure torture. It took two months of pure agony trying to recover and drain the absess out, during March and April, every move was vicious, and if it had not been for instant hospital attention and pain killers, I would have done anything to get rid of the constant pain. Luckly I knew it was only temporary, although two months is a long temporary. For people who are in constant pain through an incurable or long term body illness, I can now see their reasoning to commit suicide, to end their suffering. There is nothing worse than 24/7 pain, because thats all you can think about. You do not realise, till its you. __________________ Humble words from the Great Chi

09-07-12, 00:19	#14
Zelda master Tomb Raider Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Beverwijk, Holland Posts: 11,335	Ive actually been there, ill post gonorroe more, gonna take a sleep first :P __________________ "y cant metroid crawl?"

09-07-12, 01:10	#16
CiaKonwerski Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 9,569	I think it is a little grey, but more sided toward the "these people have serious depression" side. Because yeah, people who start to have suicidal thoughts are those who are, in some from, going through a depression. I do think however that when people start feeling depressed or start having any sort of thoughts like this, that they should tell someone right away. Otherwise they get so close to the end and decide, yep I'm doing it. I understand that it isn't easy to tell someone, but unfortunately that is the only option. It confuses me very much, because I haven't truly felt depressed and all out of hope, I have however felt very sad due to certain circumstances. It confuses me because...you see these videos of people before they kill themselves, and you see them and you think...what horrible horrible thing is happening to that person, which makes them want to leave this world so badly. What is triggering them to have that thought that there is literally no hope left? It saddens me to think that these people feel like no one is there for them, some who even have a great amount of friends. And so it is odd, is it the depressions that makes them think this, or something else? There is always something worth living for in my opinion. Friends if not family, family if not friends, the belief that something or someone will help you. It's just so weird that depression can make a person completely ignore the good aspects, ignore the pros and cons etc. And just makes them think to end it. But yes, a part of me is confused as to whether the depression causes people to think that way, in terms of erasing the good aspects and the ability to think how other people would feel, or whether there are some people who are simply selfish and are looking for an easy way out instead of dealing with what is being thrown at them. Some people who commit suicide I suppose do not even actually have to be "depressed". But maybe they do, I am unsure. I do know however that I wish people did not have those thoughts. Because their life is worth more than they know, to someone...something, somewhere. @Rai-I agree, and that definitely is where the "grey" option from me comes in. Last edited by CiaKonwerski; 09-07-12 at 01:14.

09-07-12, 01:54	#18
Draco Tomb Raider Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Terra, Sol Posts: 24,188	Suicide can only be for selfish reasons. What other reasons are there to kill yourself? As for whether it is cowardly, well, if you get to the point of suicide, then suicide is already the defacto easier path. And taking the easy path is the province of the coward. Taking a stand against adversity requires an empathy with others outside yourself and a conviction to not shy away from a challenge simply because it is easier. Life is a challenge, face it or quit. __________________ I'm responsible for what I say... I'm not responsible for what you hear.

09-07-12, 02:00	#20
matrix54 Tomb Raider Join Date: May 2007 Location: N/A Posts: 14,672	It's not even strictly a matter of science, but a matter of fact. Not believe. To make a choice requires a conscience, and a conscience requires a brain. Cells do not have the mental capacity (if any mental capacity at all) to make a choice of whether or not to go to the egg cell or not - it's just what they do. They try, and if they make it, they make it, if they die, the get turned into protein (I assume). People can say 'I believe this" or "I believe that" - sometimes fact is fact. That's the beauty of the word "believe". It's not based on anything. You can pick up a few medical text books on the wonders of reproduction and childbirth - fascinating stuff. And yes, I do understand suicide is a controversial matter - I am a very informed member of society, and I can fully understand the matter of Suicide, seeing as I've dealt with the issue personally - not pretty. I can fully + completely shift my brain around all aspect of suicide - it's not even a had situation to grasp. Suicide is a one side issue to the person dealing with it. They DO think about who they're leaving behind (it should be true for most cases), but if the pain is that serious, sticking around "for the good times" isn't going to cut it if they're already going to kill themselves. If they stay, what they we going to kill themselves over probably wasn't worth it in the end. __________________ I didn't feel like proofreading. <3