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larafan25 17-05-12 19:56

Well don't any of the other screenshots look good?

Also, what is unrealistic about Lara's position in the three?

Spong 17-05-12 20:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173036)
Well we've had swimming for 8 games and how hard was it for them to impliment anything else?

That doesn't quite make sense, you'll have to re-word it or something. We never really know how hard it was to implement new features that we do eventually get because...well...we got those features. The only features that get deemed as too hard are the ones that are dropped. Like the swimming in AoD2. Okay, that's speculation, but I don't buy for a second any of the rubbish Karl spouted.

Love2Raid 17-05-12 20:00

No, the pose is realistic imo, when you take the camera angle into consideration.

The game looks great in that shot. :tmb:
But wait till you see the ultra HD version of the screen. It's so awful that I don't even want to post it here. :o

larafan25 17-05-12 20:03

^Oh the super big version? Yeah it must be stretched or something, it looks weird.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spong (Post 6173054)
That doesn't quite make sense, you'll have to re-word it or something. We never really know how hard it was to implement new features that we do eventually get because...well...we got those features. The only features that get deemed as too hard are the ones that are dropped. Like the swimming in AoD2. Okay, that's speculation, but I don't buy for a second any of the rubbish Karl spouted.

What rubbish Karl spouted?

I'll believe anything they say over you're assumptions. :/

They're doing things they have never done before with TR or any of their other games, the development is providing challenges and they need more time.

Not a big deal, not some crazy cover up.

Mikky 17-05-12 20:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Love2Raid (Post 6173055)
But wait till you see the ultra HD version of the screen. It's so awful that I don't even want to post it here. :o

If you're talking about the one Driber posted in the Eidos forum, then yes, it is terrible. :/

Love2Raid 17-05-12 20:04

Yeah, that one. D:

Spong 17-05-12 20:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Love2Raid (Post 6173055)
No, the pose is realistic imo, when you take the camera angle into consideration.

The game looks great in that shot. :tmb:

Yeah, can't deny that everything looked to be doing its job in that last pic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Love2Raid (Post 6173055)
But wait till you see the ultra HD version of the screen. It's so awful that I don't even want to post it here. :o

IKR? When I looked at the version Justin posted I thought for a moment that I'd suddenly developed cataracts. A proper HD version is warranted, it's even a tad cheeky when you think that image was released as a sweetner to the news of the delay.

"The game's been put back, sorry about that. And to show how sorry we are and what we think of you, have a crap quality pic..."

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173058)
What rubbish Karl spouted?

The reason he gave for there not being swimming in the game. When he didn't say "it's because we can't get it to work" I knew he was lying. Swimming on an island doesn't 'fit'? Sh'yeah, whatever :rolleyes:

TippingWater 17-05-12 20:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173046)
Well don't any of the other screenshots look good?

Also, what is unrealistic about Lara's position in the three?

Well for starters, who in their right mind and in Lara's position (alone and stranded on an hostile island) would climb up a tree just for a bow? What if she slips and falls breaking a limb? I know that they say that it's just a game, but still they could have taken more realistic approach. Tomb Raider 9 Lara feels more Teflon than ever. It may be true that she has more character to her, but her actions are just as unrealistic as ever imo.

I cannot wait to be proven wrong though :).

larafan25 17-05-12 20:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spong (Post 6173065)


The reason he gave for there not being swimming in the game. When he didn't say "it's because we can't get it to work" I knew he was lying. Swimming on an island doesn't 'fit'? Sh'yeah, whatever :rolleyes:

Swimming is not in the game because the game is not about swimming. Make a list of fully fleshed out mechanics you can change and implement in the game, and if you have to cut one off it's not going to be platforming.

Swimming wasn't a priority, Lara is not going underwater to find some sunken ruins in the game, there was no need for her to go underwater so they decided we didn't need a full-fledged swimming mechanic.

You are going to give yourself gray hairs for constantly assuming and making the worst out of everything.


Quote:

Originally Posted by TippingWater (Post 6173069)
Well for starters, who in their right mind and in Lara's position (alone and stranded on an hostile island) would climb up a tree just for a bow? What if she slips and falls breaking a limb? I know that they say that it's just a game, but still they could have taken more realistic approach. Tomb Raider 9 Lara feels more Teflon than ever. It may be true that she has more character to her, but her actions are just as unrealistic as ever imo.

I cannot wait to be proven wrong though :).

I would climb it, it's just a tree, it's not too tall.

It's also not about it being just a game, it's about it being a game. "Just" implies that because it's a game there is no reason to strive for realism, the opposite implies that because it's a game realism in this case (which isn't realism it's a really odd nitpick) has been overruled by fun/ art/ entertainment purposes.

The purpose of the layer of realism is to ground what happens in the game, grounding it in realism.

Not stifling the game's ability to be fun and entertaining and exaggerated for the purpose of realism, but taking what has been chosen from an artistic and entertainment standpoint and making it seem believable.

But regardless of all this stuff (which I seem to be the only person to think about), this doesn't even seem to be an issue.

Who climbs a tree like that? Who cares? :/

Every time I place a lever switch in one of my levels to find out I can't reach the action point, I ask myself "who pushed a lever switch instead of pulling?".

Anyways, who in their right mind would get on a ship after watching the Titanic? Etc...

edit: and I'm not trying to prove you wrong, it just seems like such a non-issue to me. How is the way she climbs a tree an issue? Especially when it's one frame of an animation?

Phlip 17-05-12 20:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173085)
Swimming is not in the game because the game is not about swimming. Make a list of fully fleshed out mechanics you can change and implement in the game, and if you have to cut one off it's not going to be platforming.

Swimming wasn't a priority, Lara is not going underwater to find some sunken ruins in the game, there was no need for her to go underwater so they decided we didn't need a full-fledged swimming mechanic.

You are going to give yourself gray hairs for constantly assuming and making the worst out of everything.

Swimming doesn't have to be the sole-purpose of a whole game, or even the number 1 priority of a game for them to include it. :rolleyes:

Spong 17-05-12 20:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173085)
Swimming is not in the game because the game is not about swimming.

No, but its been a vital pillar of the game's exploration since the very first TR.

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173085)
Swimming wasn't a priority, Lara is not going underwater to find some sunken ruins in the game...

Only because she can't. Now.
And if swimming isn't a priority, why give priority to stuff like hunting pointless animals? That never even existed before, yet it seems to have jumped to near the top of the list of things Crystal want to hype about the game.

larafan25 17-05-12 20:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phlip (Post 6173090)
Swimming doesn't have to be the sole-purpose of a whole game, or even the number 1 priority of a game for them to include it. :rolleyes:

Someone's telling me this when I'm the one who always gets told...

"This isn't (insert Mario, Silent Hill, Uncharted, Sims, Elder Scrolls, etccc)"

When one action is more prevalent and important in the game than another, and you can't make th other, which do you cut? The one which is the most prevalent so that the gaming community loves you and doesn't get to play the game for why they truly love it. <3 Nope, of course you cut the other one.

It seems clear to me that CD are doing something quite different with this game which changes the depths of the combat and physics mechanics, and maybe even platforming. We've seen Lara enter water, we know that if there is water for her to wade in our exploration will not be restricted.

All we don't know about is what happens when Lara meets deep water or if she will meet deep water.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spong (Post 6173094)
No, but its been a vital pillar of the game's exploration since the very first TR.



Only because she can't. Now.
And if swimming isn't a priority, why give priority to stuff like hunting pointless animals? That never even existed before, yet it seems to have jumped to near the top of the list of things Crystal want to hype about the game.

I disagree with the word vital, that's something I'd assign to platforming.

Why put hunting animals near the top of the priorities list? IDK. Would you rather hunt animals or swim?

Hunting animals seems to be a more....a larger part of the game's theme and story than swimming. Though, drowning might be a different story.

If we're to argue that because the island is surrounded by water Lara she swim because water is so prevalent, etc... then we could argue that it's what happens on the island which matters.

Lara_Fan_33 17-05-12 20:29

Hmm, maybe the delay has something to do with swimming. Not that likely but I never really considered it an option until I remembered that CD was having troubles with it before :confused:

Phlip 17-05-12 20:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173101)
Someone's telling me this when I'm the one who always gets told...

"This isn't (insert Mario, Silent Hill, Uncharted, Sims, Elder Scrolls, etccc)"

When one action is more prevalent and important in the game than another, and you can't make th other, which do you cut? The one which is the most prevalent so that the gaming community loves you and doesn't get to play the game for why they truly love it. <3 Nope, of course you cut the other one.

It seems clear to me that CD are doing something quite different with this game which changes the depths of the combat and physics mechanics, and maybe even platforming. We've seen Lara enter water, we know that if there is water for her to wade in our exploration will not be restricted.

All we don't know about is what happens when Lara meets deep water or if she will meet deep water.

People who say "This isn't ..." and go to extremes are ****wits.

TBH I think they could have out it in if they wanted to but they're too lazy/can't work out their own engine. "Swimming doesn't fit this game" is a scrotum-load of old ****. It's a ****ing island, of course there's going to be water.

larafan25 17-05-12 20:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phlip (Post 6173110)
People who say "This isn't ..." and go to extremes are ****wits.

TBH I think they could have out it in if they wanted to but they're too lazy/can't work out their own engine. "Swimming doesn't fit this game" is a scrotum-load of old ****. It's a ****ing island, of course there's going to be water.

"Swimming doesn't fit this game" is a quote by whom?

Just because there's water around the island doesn't make it a priority, as the game is about what happens on the island.

We can wade the **** into water, seamlessness, believability, immersion doesn't seem to have been broken yet. We just can't swim.

edit: Also I think CD are lazy for not making a game which was a long as the entire series up to this point with every action I can do as a featured game mechanic. Lazy buggers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lara_Fan_33 (Post 6173109)
Hmm, maybe the delay has something to do with swimming. Not that probable but I never really considered it an option until I remembered that CD was having troubles with it before :confused:

I don't think they were having trouble, I think they weren't going to (and probably still aren't) implement a swimming mechanic (diving into the water to see below the water and swim around down there) because there were other things they wanted to direct their focus on and swimming didn't make the cut for important aspects of this adventure.

Perhaps people would be more forgiving if the setting was a desert.

TippingWater 17-05-12 20:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173116)
Perhaps people would be more forgiving if the setting was a desert.

:tmb:

Mr. Giraffe 17-05-12 20:44

I could care less about swimming. It wasn't a huge issue in previous CD games. It makes sense they would cut it out or not even develop it to focus on other aspects that will be new. It was barely used in their games anyways. I'd rather them take a risk and pull it off, then implement the same old thing and not have it change.

larafan25 17-05-12 20:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by TippingWater (Post 6173137)
:tmb:

Though perhaps if the story required an ocean which is a desert with it's life underground, then people might feel as though they missed a good desert opportunity, though for the sake of the story.

TippingWater 17-05-12 20:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173140)
Though perhaps if the story required an ocean which is a desert with it's life underground, then people might feel as though they missed a good desert opportunity, though for the sake of the story.

I love the way that you think :D.

larafan25 17-05-12 20:46

So do I. :pi:

TippingWater 17-05-12 20:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173144)
So do I. :pi:

:gki:.

Spong 17-05-12 20:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173101)
IDK. Would you rather hunt animals or swim?

What a ridiculous question. Which has always been a mainstay of Tomb Raider's exploration? I'll give you a clue; it's not hunting animals.

She's Lara Croft, she's supposed to explore tombs and swimming has always been a part of that. She's not the female Crocodile Dundee. I personally couldn't care less for 'surviving', I just want to climb ledges, jump across spike traps, raid tombs and find secrets.

larafan25 17-05-12 21:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spong (Post 6173172)
What a ridiculous question. Which has always been a mainstay of Tomb Raider's exploration? I'll give you a clue; it's not hunting animals.

She's Lara Croft, she's supposed to explore tombs and swimming has always been a part of that. She's not the female Crocodile Dundee. I personally couldn't care less for 'surviving', I just want to climb ledges, jump across spike traps, raid tombs and find secrets.

She's always been hunted by animals and has always killed animals.

Hunting as opposed to frolicking about enemy heads is supposedly more exploration-based as you actually have to hunt the animal. Just think of it like finding secrets that you have to kill.

leglion 17-05-12 21:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173177)
She's always been hunted by animals and has always killed animals.

Hunting as opposed to frolicking about enemy heads is supposedly more exploration-based as you actually have to hunt the animal. Just think of it like finding secrets that you have to kill.

I think he doesn't want moving secrets because they're too much of a challenge for him. :whi:

Phlip 17-05-12 21:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173116)
"Swimming doesn't fit this game" is a quote by whom?

Just because there's water around the island doesn't make it a priority, as the game is about what happens on the island.

We can wade the **** into water, seamlessness, believability, immersion doesn't seem to have been broken yet. We just can't swim.

edit: Also I think CD are lazy for not making a game which was a long as the entire series up to this point with every action I can do as a featured game mechanic. Lazy buggers.

Karl, I'm pretty sure.

Again, it doesn't need to be a priority to feature.



They're lazy for not doing something which has been done in games, INCLUDING TOMB RAIDER, since like, the 1980's.

Spong 17-05-12 21:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173177)
She's always been hunted by animals and has always killed animals.

I wish I'd put money on you saying something like that. So fighting with a tiger is hunting? Gunning down a Tibetan monk is hunting?

Did we enter those combat scenarios based on a necessity? Maybe there was the odd scripted encounter to gain an item, but we never had to go chasing pigs to eat.

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173177)
Just think of it like finding secrets that you have to kill.

I'll see it as a mechanic that is completely alien to the series, one that ostensibly seems absurd and appears to do nothing more than pointlessly elongate a process which used to be accomplished simply by pressing the action button while stood over a medipak.

That's how the hunting comes across to me at the moment. I can't say that's what it is until I play the game. Until then, everything about it screams rubbish.

larafan25 17-05-12 21:09

I can see why people would want swimming...and I can totally understand the sentiment that exploring takes priority over anything combat-oriented.

Buttt...

Swimming in the past three games, I'd argue much like platforming has simply been a means of getting around. I would rather hunt a rabbit through a hub in the new game the way it looks to be, than swim in a hub the way swimming has been in the past three games.

Of course people would argue that more than swimming was broken in the past games, so given that idea, why not assume that everything else is being fixed (especially land exploration which I truly have faith in) while swimming waits on the sidelines for at least one game.

If we're getting a hub system which provides better and more exploration than the past TR level structure, might that not make up for a little bit of missing and possibly linear swimming?

I think an issue with the TR series has been that so many features come to be tradition and expected, that there is less room for quality when it comes to stacking up all that quantity from past installments.

Scrape it all off and start adding in quality mechanics instead of just throwing everything back into the game and adding some good new stuff.

larafan25 17-05-12 21:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spong (Post 6173195)
I wish I'd put money on you saying something like that. So fighting with a tiger is hunting? Gunning down a Tibetan monk is hunting?

I was extremely careful to say they hunted her and not vice-versa.

Both are combat, though one type of combat includes exploration.

Quote:

Did we enter those combat scenarios based on a necessity? Maybe there was the odd scripted encounter to gain an item, but we never had to go chasing pigs to eat.
Nope. We didn't. That doesn't mean our nutrition will be a pressing matter. That's something that seems like it will only be an issue if you make it one.


Quote:

I'll see it as a mechanic that is completely alien to the series, one that ostensibly seems absurd and appears to do nothing more than pointlessly elongate a process which used to be accomplished simply by pressing the action button while stood over a medipak.
Well....you could say the same about a lot of things I'm sure. Auto saves fixed the absurd system of collecting and choosing when to use saves.

Quote:

That's how the hunting comes across to me at the moment. I can't say that's what it is until I play the game. Until then, everything about it screams rubbish.

If our draining health proves not to be draining at a pace which is urgent, then do you find it to be an issue that we should hunt animals which run from us as opposed to attack us?

You seem to be looking at this from the perspective of it being a mandatory drag, but if it weren't mandatory then would a gamer enjoy the possible challenge of hunting the prey?

In fact why not just think of it as a mandatory boss in the sense that it has something you need to progress, so you must kill it? We know there are other ways of getting food.

just*raidin*tomb 17-05-12 21:28

Wow, I ****ing hate this forum right now.

Some of you are being cocky bigots who seem to think your assumptions are facts. Please grow up a little bit.

Mr. Giraffe 17-05-12 21:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by just*raidin*tomb (Post 6173246)
Wow, I ****ing hate this forum right now.

Some of you are being cocky bigots who seem to think your assumptions are facts. Please grow up a little bit.

This :)

Even if hunting is mandatory, so was a lot of things in previous games.

Swimming, running, jumping, killing some of the animals.... All these things were mandatory and no one whined about it. Get over it and enjoy the abilities that the game has.

Richard_Croft 17-05-12 21:40

Every time I enter this thread and see you guys discussing I'm like

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m139ytFbYm1r2kwel.gif

:o

Lukass 17-05-12 21:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by just*raidin*tomb (Post 6173246)
Wow, I ****ing hate this forum right now.

Some of you are being cocky bigots who seem to think your assumptions are facts. Please grow up a little bit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Giraffe (Post 6173260)
This :)

Even if hunting is mandatory, so was a lot of things in previous games.

Swimming, running, jumping, killing some of the animals.... All these things were mandatory and no one whined about it. Get over it and enjoy the abilities that the game has.

Agreed. People should learn how to accept certain things even if they don't like them. Grow up :/ I don't mind the lack of swimming at all. There will be other things that are fun.

larafan25 17-05-12 21:54

Wouldn't part of growing up be accepting different opinions even if you don't like them? :/

TippingWater 17-05-12 21:56

Alrighty, time for a positive remark, I do love her muscle definition in the new screenshot :).

larafan25 17-05-12 21:58

Her hair seems lighter, is that because it's daytime? Is it daytime? I wonder.

There is a river, that seems nice.

We can't swi- nevermind.

:pi:

TippingWater 17-05-12 21:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173289)
Her hair seems lighter, is that because it's daytime? Is it daytime? I wonder.

There is a river, that seems nice.

We can't swi- nevermind.

:pi:

Yeah :o.

Lukass 17-05-12 22:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6173283)
Wouldn't part of growing up be accepting different opinions even if you don't like them? :/

Coming from you? :/
-------------------------------

Anyway, I like her hands.

larafan25 17-05-12 22:00

^Don't I accept others opinions?

Hmm...then I wonder which day it is.

Day four is the wolf's den ...I think, so this must be day 2 or 3...I think it's day 3. I think it's the day she escapes the scavenger den.

Linoshi Croft 17-05-12 22:01

She looks very clean...

SpyrosMonster 17-05-12 22:01

Were you talking about this picture?

http://driber.net/os/tr9/The%20Reach_lanscape.jpg

I don't see any HD in it! The Quality sucks!...

http://driber.net/os/tr9/Lara-Injured_HQ.jpg

That's what I call HD...


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