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Drone 13-04-08 20:11

interesting could those shards be a part of a spear or they always were separated (like spear of destiny)

NightWish 13-04-08 20:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drone (Post 2635927)
interesting could those shards be a part of a spear or they always were separated (like spear of destiny)

according to aod's comic they werw a part of a medalion or something like that. but yeah I guess the could be a part of a spear

aussie500 14-04-08 05:30

A normal crystalline spear if it broke, would probably end up as fragments or dust rather than shards, an amulet as mentioned in the comics or even a sword would be more likely, something round, or something reasonably flat, perhaps it was even designed to seperate into shards. There was a crystaline sword in the concept art.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2...1162375866.jpg




I would not precisely call the object this nephilim is holding a spear, but it seems to be crystalline and the head of it would likely break into shards. Also one of the concepts shows a red periapt shard. Or perhaps someone cannibalised his headpiece which has three nice spear shaped crystals just the right size.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2...lery-15_09.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2...1162375860.jpg

Could this poor soul like the knight that originally had part of Excalibur, have gone of to the crusades with a relic of mythical power, a periapt shard as the head of his spear? Unlikely but he fitted into the story somehow.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2.../Image1b-1.jpg

of course there is even the possibility that there are more than one periapt artifact, and that one was broken to form the shards. The original nephilim do seem to have been fond of crystal, perhaps somehow the name periapt is connected with the maker of the artifact the material itself, the inherent power of the artifact or where the crystalline material is from. So we could have a periapt amulet, sword, spear or other items as well with the name periapt.

NightWish 14-04-08 13:06

aussie, You dindt say anything about teh templar connection what do you think? :)
Quote:

Originally Posted by aussie500 (Post 2636931)
A normal crystalline spear if it broke, would probably end up as fragments or dust rather than shards, an amulet as mentioned in the comics or even a sword would be more likely, something round, or something reasonably flat, perhaps it was even designed to seperate into shards. There was a crystaline sword in the concept art.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2...1162375866.jpg

Well this loks like an early consept of teh shards to me... You know things end up looking different then the original idea - this can be the original idea - doubt its a sword to be honest - does it say its a sword?
Amnd I dont remember was it mentioned anywhere that the shards were broken off of something? Because they can be just crystals carved in such a shape that they can work for weapons. :confused: Did only the comic book say that ?
Quote:

Originally Posted by aussie500 (Post 2636931)

I would not precisely call the object this nephilim is holding a spear, but it seems to be crystalline and the head of it would likely break into shards. Also one of the concepts shows a red periapt shard. Or perhaps someone cannibalised his headpiece which has three nice spear shaped crystals just the right size.
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2...lery-15_09.jpg

And to be honest this has always looked liek an early version of the LV undead Knights. Just look at the nephilim conespts we have - they are in a totally different direction!


Quote:

Originally Posted by aussie500 (Post 2636931)
Could this poor soul like the knight that originally had part of Excalibur, have gone of to the crusades with a relic of mythical power, a periapt shard as the head of his spear? Unlikely but he fitted into the story somehow.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2.../Image1b-1.jpg

ANd if they wanted to show there is something magical or special about this spear - the artist would have spent some more time on the spear and add some detal and maybe light - to classic wy to show something has a special power. And this poor soul was said to be connected to Eckhardt in the companion right?


Quote:

Originally Posted by aussie500 (Post 2636931)
of course there is even the possibility that there are more than one periapt artifact, and that one was broken to form the shards. The original nephilim do seem to have been fond of crystal, perhaps somehow the name periapt is connected with the maker of the artifact the material itself, the inherent power of the artifact or where the crystalline material is from. So we could have a periapt amulet, sword, spear or other items as well with the name periapt.

Hmm when I hear crystal I have the instant assossiation Crystal - mine. Mines are underground in rocks - as the underground cities. Maybe the sahrds were from taken the unerground city and the neohilim build their cities there precicely because those crystals could be found only there and they had to protect what they are susceptible to?

Earthcane 14-04-08 13:23

Whoah, the second Nephilim concept is so BRIGHT! :eek:

aussie500 14-04-08 14:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by NightWish (Post 2632573)
How LV came to know aout this is a bit difficult to decide. But I really think that the Templars had something to do here. Lets face it - Murty woudnt have said the LV are an offshoot of thetemplars for nothing. te templars were very mystical fugures with a lot of legends around them. They spent a lot of time in asia in the holy lands where they were said to obtain knowledge about alchemy, astronomy and all sorts of dark arts. It is possible to say that they found information about the nephilim somehow while lokoing for the fable treasures they were said to have found. And maybe during that period they somehow released thee nephilim that eventually made a deal with Eckhardt (Karel). and they maybe felt guilty when saw what a terrible creature they releaased.A nd took an oath to destry them. After the Templars were banned on europe. Most were tortured and killed. But in legends it is said that some managed to escape on boats with their fabled treasure (but what was it?) towards scotland or england... it is possible they formed the LV there


:D

The Templar Knight's were Christians, there was nothing mystical about them and they would have been burned at the stake back then if they had been studying alchemy and the dark arts. As to some of the myths, the England/ Scotland escape one does not seem that realistic to me.

NightWish 14-04-08 15:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by aussie500 (Post 2637568)
The Templar Knight's were Christians, there was nothing mystical about them and they would have been burned at the stake back then if they had been studying alchemy and the dark arts. As to some of the myths, the England/ Scotland escape one does not seem that realistic to me.

Wow I dont think I can disagre with you more! I have reesearched the subject quite a lot - rRead quite a lot of literature on them (they have always intrigued me) and watched every online vid I could find in you tube about them - plus the ones I own. I am pretty certain here I know what I am talking about.
Yes I agree that probably for real the templars wasnt anything supernatural about them at all - but at that times people had a different way of seeing reality.

ANYWAY The templars that were said to have learned those 'dark arts' from teh locals in the Holy lands. France (where they are officially formed) lernt about that a lot later. But they became really powerful. the king heard that the templars had some very doubtfull and bothering customs - so at friday the 13th (where the commen supersticion comes from) early in teh m morning the authorities were all ordered to catch every single templar In france ( and the templar order was banned on whole europe). Most of the templars were caught and tortured in incredibly horrifying ways. because the king wanted them to admit their sins. And of course most of the cought were killed, burned or they died during the tortures. BUt its impossible all of them were cought. The templars had spread a lot and were increibly many at that time.

In almost all sourse I have taken info from it said they had an immense treasure - some even say it was the holly grail - though it could have been just money (gold) because they had made the 1st (primitive form of a) Bank.
Those that were said to have escaped are thought to have sailed towards england and scotland simply because there have been found signs of teh temlpars from after their bannishment. Like churches - I remmeber spesifically in sciotland that there is a church where historians/archaeologists have found many signs of the templars. Like a horse with 2 horsmen on it. Thats the smbol of the templars.

Check this out if you dnt believe me: I have a DVD about the temlars by History channel - in it there is some info especially about that scotish vhurch I mentioned above - I guess it can be found here. My DVD is alled teh knights templar:
http://youtube.com/results?search_qu...l&search_type=


From then on its possible the templars formed a new order to continue their knowledge. This can be the LV. Lets have in mind TR is not in real life - so the powers LV have can be explained if we say that thir treasure is the holy Grail. In a book I read about teh grail, was menioned that some nationalities believed (traces of teh grail or a magical cup can be found in many cultures) that it gives supernatural powers and immortality. (nephilim are immortal maybe teher can be a connection to them somehow). So its possible a group of templars got supernatural power when found teh grail (presumably in King solomon's temple where the templars had obvioulsy digged). ANd that group escaped and formed teh LV.


What I am saying is simply that Core/Murty wouldnt have even mentioned LV are an offshoot of teh templars without a reason. Especially when its well known how surrounded in myths and legends the templars are.



ANYWAY
To stay on topic - sort of - his is a remake I made of one aod2 consept - the woman with teh sun mask

http://nightwish666.deviantart.com/a...stess-76377352

aussie500 15-04-08 01:48

The only thing that was really bothering the king of France was the large debt he owed the Templar's, the order was persecuted and dissolved for greed, not because of dark arts or forbidden knowledge. They were simply to powerful and too successful at acquiring riches. Even the Pope knew they were not guilty, no evidence was ever presented at the trial to show they were guilty and the only way they could get confessions was by torture. Most of the former Templars either retired or joined other orders, in some countries new orders were started that consisted of former Templar Knights. Yes a lot were killed, but not many compared to those who died in the crusades and other battles. The Templar's already had a strong presence in England and Scotland before the persecution started, so it is not surprising that evidence of them was to be found there even after the order no longer officially existed. The first reference to the Scottish freemasons being connected to the Knights Templar was not made till almost five hundred years later, the supposed connection with the medieval Knights Templar was so flimsy most would class it as a myth, there is no evidence showing a connection. The carving at Rosslyn Chapel, built over a hundred years after the Templars were dissolved, and long before the beginnings freemasonry shows a knight on a horse just one not two, the second figure is not actually on the horse, but behind it. Like everything else about the myth, people will believe anything, if they want to make a connection hard enough.

As to the reason the LV were connected with the Knights Templar, there are not that many warrior monks around to choose from, they were going to use the 1300's date where the persecution of the order started, having to go underground would have made it more likely such a branch could have existed in secret, and yes the myth concerning the grail and the templars might have come into it somewhere along the line.

The picture of the nephilim is very good, although her wings (stubs?) are not actually part of her clothing, and l would have connected the pattern on the neckline of the dress more with a water theme than the sun. There should only be water flowing from one side of the dress, to clearly show she is the source of the water.

cococomics_pres 15-04-08 02:43

^^ she is one of the nephilim right? So she'd just have stubs as you said, like this guy:
Quote:

Originally Posted by aussie500

Also I think I remember reading somewhere, perhaps even from one of your posts, aussie that these two:
were meant to be Homunculi? I wonder if we would have had to deal with them as more powerful entities in the bio research facility? Just a curiosity, I've always thought those two images were really neat. As well as the shrub-skeleton!

aussie500 15-04-08 02:48

l think the baby like one was meant to be in the tanks in the sanitarium, but they changed the concept to adults instead. Although the older one had stubs, l am not so sure the young or rejuvenited female nephilim would have only had stubs, maybe she could unfurl them into real wings similar to those of the statue in the Wrath of the Beast level.


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