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leglion 06-05-12 19:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6153391)
It ruins immersion.

It reminds you it's a game.

We want a game world where we can see something and identify it as interactive without needing weird icons.

But CD said the icons would go away as the game progresses. What type of objects that're interactive need to be established.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lukass (Post 6153259)
Agreed completely.



What about those lanterns? What about those red pieces of wood lying on the floor in the E3 demo? I think Mikky's right, I feel the same :(

Brian Horton's quotes from EDGE magazine:



Do we need something to draw our eyes? I don't think so :(



As I was re-writing this second quote now I felt almost uncomfortable. I think I don't even have to explain why :/

There will always be something that will tell you "use me", "you need to go here"...I really am pissed now, because I absolutely forgot about the Edge magazine interview :/ I am officially extremely disappointed.

There was a red piece of wood on like on ledge in the Demo. There was red wood EVERYWHERE. Red just happens to be an accent color in the game. Lanterns are useful in the dark. I think Lara lights them though because in some of the screenshot they're not lit.

And every game uses that. It's called empty space and silhouette. The radio tower is an example of this; it's the highest and most outstanding object so you know you have to go there. It's about creating an objective visually.

Lukass 06-05-12 19:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6153399)
So did TRL not have QTE in full force?

No TR has had QTE in full force?

Because if TRL is QTE in full force, then regardless of how the pace slows, TR9 seems to have QTE in full-er force.

Your posts sounded like QTE's are going to be used every 5 minutes. When something is in full force, it's pretty constant imho.

larafan25 06-05-12 19:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lukass (Post 6153404)
Your posts sounded like QTE's are going to be used every 5 minutes. When something is in full force, it's pretty constant imho.

Well all I mean is there are a lot of QTE.

But maybe that will matter less to people when they are greeted with a huge area to explore.

Rai 06-05-12 19:15

I don't need no icon to tell me that that burning flame is fire. I've known what fire is for a very long time, thank you. :ohn:

Well the icons are either optional or will go away after a while. Still it was annoying to see them in the demo. Just screaming at you.

I don't mind the QTEs that are used when Lara is pulling the spike out of her side, as that isn't a normal action, so something like that or even the ones used for kicking the scavenger, as they felt similar to the TRA ones where you're freeing Lara from an animal. It's QTEs where you have push specific button sequences. They must become more sparse as the game progresses.

larafan25 06-05-12 19:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rai (Post 6153409)
I don't need no icon to tell me that that burning flame is fire. I've known what fire is for a very long time, thank you. :ohn:

Well the icons are either optional or will go away after a while. Still it was annoying to see them in the demo. Just screaming at you.

Even if they just cut down on the size of the icons. They have that giant splash around them, why can't they just be a simple little button? :/

leglion 06-05-12 19:18

looking at the demo now, when Lara picked up the torch the first time an icon popped up with the picture of a flame and the action button next to it but when she went threw the waterfall and it outed and she had to light it again it didn't appear.

larafan25 06-05-12 19:21

My concern is this...

How are we going to know what is or isn't burnable crap?

Lukass 06-05-12 19:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by leglion (Post 6153401)
There was a red piece of wood on like on ledge in the Demo. There was red wood EVERYWHERE. Red just happens to be an accent color in the game.

That's not true. They're NOT EVERYWHERE. Those red pieces of wood leads you towards the cage (which has also red element on it to make sure you won't overlook it).

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7223/7...036b567f_z.jpg

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5316/7...53a1da9f_z.jpg

Mikky 06-05-12 19:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by leglion (Post 6153386)
But how is that a problem?

All of the points lf25 pointed out and the fact that it makes the game needlessly easier. It would just be nice to figure out stuff by myself, no matter how minor they may be.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lukass (Post 6153396)
QTE's are not back in full force! You know exactly why they were presented in the E3 demo!

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7253/7...6510531d_z.jpg

:ohn:

See, there you go again, it says "we want to play game not watch a movie". That doesn't make any sense to me! Since when did movies have button prompts to progress further into the movie? Unless you were playing an interactive DVD. xD Adding QTEs only makes a game more... gamey since you're interacting in the cutscenes as well as in the game, not make it more like a movie. I swear, people are idiots sometimes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6153420)
My concern is this...

How are we going to know what is or isn't burnable crap?


Easy, we do it how we used to - by trail and error. We go up to stuff and see if they're burnable or not by trying to ignite them. It makes the experience so much more worthwhile. I mean, remember in the classics when you used to find a hidden block that was camouflaged into the wall and you felt good about it because you figured it yourself. These days you can't have that because you'd have a huge hint icon next to the block saying that you can move it. I don't need any of that stuff, tbh.

leglion 06-05-12 19:24

^Read below

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6153420)
My concern is this...

How are we going to know what is or isn't burnable crap?

What looks like burnable crap i guess.

So yah, the only thing that had an icon in the demo was the first torch and that was a "tutorial" on the controls. Everything else didn't have any. The only thing was the icon showing how long it would take to light the torch which didn't pop up when you came near fire.

larafan25 06-05-12 19:24

Oh also, why are the controls so weird?

Like...x to grab a torch? RT to light it? What is RT anyways? Xbox controller only has one bumper button on each side?

edit: And why do we need an icon in the upper right hand corner saying "torch" after I pick up a torch? No **** guys, no **** it's a torch. ._.

edit 2: Also, the icon to light the flame does pop up when you walk near it, but the button doesn't appear until you start doing stuff.

Rai 06-05-12 19:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by leglion (Post 6153416)
looking at the demo now, when Lara picked up the torch the first time an icon popped up with the picture of a flame and the action button next to it but when she went threw the waterfall and it outed and she had to light it again it didn't appear.

The fire icon appears everytime Lara lit something with the torch. It's so obvious and unnecessary, imo.

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6153420)
My concern is this...

How are we going to know what is or isn't burnable crap?

Well, as I say, the fire icon appears every time you go near anything flammable. That may change as you progress, but presumably, we would have 'learned' what's flammable by then :pi:

leglion 06-05-12 19:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rai (Post 6153433)
The fire icon appears everytime Lara lit something with the torch. It's so obvious and unnecessary, imo.



Well, as I say, the fire icon appears every time you go near anything flammable. That may change as you progress, but presumably, we would have 'learned' what's flammable by then :pi:

No it doesn't. Just finished looking at the demo. It only appears after you've started lighting your torch to show you how long it would take.

Stevo505 06-05-12 19:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6153426)
Oh also, why are the controls so weird?

Like...x to grab a torch? RT to light it? What is RT anyways? Xbox controller only has one bumper button on each side?

edit: And why do we need an icon in the upper right hand corner saying "torch" after I pick up a torch? No **** guys, no **** it's a torch. ._.

edit 2: Also, the icon to light the flame does pop up when you walk near it, but the button doesn't appear until you start doing stuff.

I think RT is right trigger or something. And the icon in the top right is probably for any items we pick up so we kno what they are. Why are you complaining so much now? LOL

Lukass 06-05-12 19:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6153420)
My concern is this...

How are we going to know what is or isn't burnable crap?

I can tell you.

Brian Horton:

Quote:

Visual language is always one of the big challenges. You want to make the world feel believable, but you also want to know what you can interact with. We spend a lot of time teaching players what their tools are, from the very start of the Den where you see cloth, and you see all the different stages of how fire and cloth work, and how water then affects that. We just spend time ramping simple, well-recognized physical attributes up. So what we try to do is create a set of rules that allow players to interact with, so they can always do the same sorts of things.
Which doesn't sound any good to me. We'll probably be only allowed to do still the same things over and over again.

larafan25 06-05-12 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stevo505 (Post 6153437)
I think RT is right trigger or something. And the icon in the top right is probably for any items we pick up so we kno what they are. Why are you complaining so much now? LOL

Because I can see, I can see what I'm picking up. ._.

Quote:

Originally Posted by leglion (Post 6153436)
No it doesn't. Just finished looking at the demo. It only appears after you've started lighting your torch to show you how long it would take.

Yes it does.

______________________

Guise!

In this puzzle you can kill yourself maybe?

http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/u...fan25/burn.png

Because the burnable stuff is right there, but we have to burn it from a distance and that barrel explodes. Maybe if you light it up close you die from the explosion?

See, now this would all be bad ass if there wasn't an icon telling you to do it. ._.

leglion 06-05-12 19:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lukass (Post 6153442)
I can tell you.

Brian Horton:



Which doesn't sound any good to me. We'll probably be only allowed to do still the same things over and over again.

What makes you think that?


Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6153444)
Because I can see, I can see what I'm picking up. ._.



Yes it does.

______________________

Guise!

In this puzzle you can kill yourself maybe?

http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/u...fan25/burn.png

Because the burnable stuff is right there, but we have to burn it from a distance and that barrel explodes. Maybe if you light it up close you die from the explosion?

See, now this would all be bad ass if there wasn't an icon telling you to do it. ._.

I still don't see it. Watched it a 4th time.

larafan25 06-05-12 19:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lukass (Post 6153442)
I can tell you.

Brian Horton:



Which doesn't sound any good to me. We'll probably be only allowed to do still the same things over and over again.

Physics are basic, this means later in the game these puzzles will build on each other in complexity.

They could get really good complex puzzles with this if they want to, I like the sounds of it.

Mikky 06-05-12 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6153444)

Guise!

In this puzzle you can kill yourself maybe?

http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/u...fan25/burn.png

Because the burnable stuff is right there, but we have to burn it from a distance and that barrel explodes. Maybe if you light it up close you die from the explosion?


I doubt you can kill yourself. They'll probably only let you ignite it from that spot.

Quote:

See, now this would all be bad ass if there wasn't an icon telling you to do it. ._.
Yeah, exactly.

Lukass 06-05-12 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by leglion (Post 6153446)
What makes you think that?

Why did you ignore my previous post about those red pieces of wood? I gave you an evidence they're not everywhere and they're supposed to lead us to the cage.
--------------

Isn't it obvious from what Brian said?

Rai 06-05-12 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by leglion (Post 6153436)
No it doesn't. Just finished looking at the demo. It only appears after you've started lighting your torch to show you how long it would take.

Watch the extended playthrough. The player goes past things that can be burned and the icon pops up even without Lara lighting it. It's fainter, but there. And as for the time it takes for something to burn, surely flames are a clue enough that you lit something or relit the torch.

larafan25 06-05-12 19:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by leglion (Post 6153446)
What makes you think that?



I still don't see it. Watched it a 4th time.

http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/u...fan25/lurp.png

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikky (Post 6153450)
I doubt you can kill yourself. They'll probably only let you ignite it from that spot.



Yeah, exactly.

In the final puzzle room you can kill yourself by lighting the barrels by the waterfall, you even see the icon appear.

leglion 06-05-12 19:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rai (Post 6153452)
Watch the extended playthrough. The player goes past things that can be burned and the icon pops up even without Lara lighting it. It's fainter, but there. And as for the time it takes for something to burn, surely flames are a clue enough that you lit something or relit the torch.

Which ones the final version then? The shorter demo fits their description of the icons decreasing as the game progresses.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikky (Post 6153450)
I doubt you can kill yourself. They'll probably only let you ignite it from that spot.



Yeah, exactly.

It's confirmed you can kill yourself like that in the very first magazines.

Rai 06-05-12 19:38

Larafan, yes, in the main room, I think it was said that if Lara lights the stuff near the exit, she will die, so you have to figure out how to blow it up without coming to harm; that's the puzzle.

@Leglion, I don't know. Both were shown at E3.

SpyrosMonster 06-05-12 19:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6153426)
Oh also, why are the controls so weird?

Like...x to grab a torch? RT to light it? What is RT anyways? Xbox controller only has one bumper button on each side?

edit: And why do we need an icon in the upper right hand corner saying "torch" after I pick up a torch? No **** guys, no **** it's a torch. ._.

edit 2: Also, the icon to light the flame does pop up when you walk near it, but the button doesn't appear until you start doing stuff.

http://files.turbosquid.com/Preview/...80677Large.jpg

I've played couple of times xbox 360 this is the controler... but i guess the controlls were in pre-alpha stage too :ton:

Mikky 06-05-12 19:41

I doubt the controls were finalized. I mean, Survival Instinct was mapped on Y, one of the face buttons. Doesn't make sense to map a command on something that's apparently optional.

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6153456)


In the final puzzle room you can kill yourself by lighting the barrels by the waterfall, you even see the icon appear.

Oh yeah, I know. I'm really looking forward to that. :pi:

larafan25 06-05-12 19:41

^I pray these are temporary controls.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rai (Post 6153460)
Larafan, yes, in the main room, I think it was said that if Lara lights the stuff near the exit, she will die, so you have to figure out how to blow it up without coming to harm; that's the puzzle.

@Leglion, I don't know. Both were shown at E3.

Yep, in the GI article it says she will die if she lights the barrels from in front of them, and we can see they are interactive...

http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/u...fan25/kill.png

Quote:

Originally Posted by leglion (Post 6153458)
Which ones the final version then? The shorter demo fits their description of the icons decreasing as the game progresses.

The shorter version is the cut version, the extended version would be more accurate would it not be?

klona 06-05-12 19:45

I want to see how she explodes... :p

leglion 06-05-12 19:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rai (Post 6153460)
Larafan, yes, in the main room, I think it was said that if Lara lights the stuff near the exit, she will die, so you have to figure out how to blow it up without coming to harm; that's the puzzle.

@Leglion, I don't know. Both were shown at E3.

Quote:

Originally Posted by larafan25 (Post 6153463)
^I pray these are temporary controls.



Yep, in the GI article it says she will die if she lights the barrels from in front of them, and we can see they are interactive...

http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/u...fan25/kill.png



The shorter version is the cut version, the extended version would be more accurate would it not be?

I think the "cut" demo is the more accurate version. It was just edited. It wasn't actually that short. I remember Karl saying the demo would be very different from what we saw in the demo somewhere. But it fits their description of what the final game was supposed to be like. The extended demo had icons consistently, the edited demo had them decreasing.

larafan25 06-05-12 19:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by klona (Post 6153469)
I want to see how she explodes... :p

Same, I'm incredibly curious.

Like...if this were TRA she's just grab her side and fall backwards.

I hope she goes flying backwards into the water, where her body then floats down the stream into the fire.

Mikky 06-05-12 19:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by klona (Post 6153469)
I want to see how she explodes... :p

Well, I'd imagine CD would do something lame like having her fly towards the screen like a doll or lamer still, just having an explosion cover up the screen and hearing her scream. Ideally, though, I'd want her to actually blow up to pieces with lots of blood. :pi:

leglion 06-05-12 19:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikky (Post 6153477)
Well, I'd imagine CD would do something lame like having her fly towards the screen like a doll or lamer still, just having an explosion cover up the screen and hearing her scream. Ideally, though, I'd want her to actually blow up to pieces with lots of blood. :pi:

People who saw her deaths said they were very graphic. There's even a death of her head being smashed in. Lame, i know.

just*raidin*tomb 06-05-12 19:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikky (Post 6153477)
Well, I'd imagine CD would do something lame like having her fly towards the screen like a doll or lamer still, just having an explosion cover up the screen and hearing her scream. Ideally, though, I'd want her to actually blow up to pieces with lots of blood. :pi:

We'll probably see some blood and dirt splatter on the screen a bit and she'll probably fly off somewhere and scream. That's good enough for me tbh. I'm not sure if I want to see someone rip into a million pieces...that's exactly realistic either. Unless the explosion is like...inside you.

Don't get me wrong though. I'm all for some graphic deaths.

Mikky 06-05-12 19:56

^ Yeah, but in real life, if you were standing right next to two exploding containers and they exploded, you would be torn apart and go flying. :p

Quote:

Originally Posted by leglion (Post 6153483)
People who saw her deaths said they were very graphic. There's even a death of her head being smashed in. Lame, i know.

Yeah, but that's in QTEs. And I don't think it's lame. I can't wait to see it! :D I'm hoping the deaths during normal gameplay are as graphic and realistic as the ones in the QTEs. xD

klona 06-05-12 19:56

i haud 2.

http://www.tombraiderforums.com/pict...pictureid=6401

Quote:

Originally Posted by leglion (Post 6153483)
People who saw her deaths said they were very graphic. There's even a death of her head being smashed in. Lame, i know.

Sometimes, I wonder if she would just... explode and get splattered everywhere. :whi:
Like in the picture.

leglion 06-05-12 19:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikky (Post 6153487)
Yeah, but that's in QTEs. And I don't think it's lame. I can't wait to see it! :D I'm hoping the deaths during normal gameplay are as graphic and realistic as the ones in the QTEs. xD

QTE's are in game. It uses the in game model so there's no reason why it wouldn't happen outside of QTE's

I imagine the blood splattering on the screen and Lara having gashes on her face and on other parts of her body as the death.

Lukass 06-05-12 20:00

I personally can't wait to see her death in the wolf's den. I'm definitely going to let the wolf to kill her.

leglion 06-05-12 20:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lukass (Post 6153492)
I personally can't wait to see her death in the wolf's den. I'm definitely going to let the wolf to kill her.

It's supposed to bite her in her temple or something right?

larafan25 06-05-12 20:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by leglion (Post 6153497)
It's supposed to bite her in her temple or something right?

The boob neck.

________________________________________

I wonder if there is a crouch. roll button, there needs to be.

http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/u...n25/crouch.png

I want to go in with those cans.

Lukass 06-05-12 20:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by leglion (Post 6153497)
It's supposed to bite her in her temple or something right?

Whatever temple means (I know temple as a building), yes. And it's according to people who saw it extremely bloody scene. I don't want to even imagine how she screams...


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