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-   -   Shadow of the Tomb Raider - General Chat (https://www.tombraiderforums.com/showthread.php?t=219557)

leomage 27-08-18 22:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by biscuits (Post 7960036)
Trust me, I have A LOT of issues with the way CD handles Tomb Raider. The way they handled their games' narrative aspects and their risk averse working methods being my main gripes.
I do agree that EM is overall better structured, based on impressions that I heard. But we need to consider that a lot of these people worked on the previous games as well. Just look at the credits sequence of each game.

If there is a difference in how CD and EM are structured, it just furthers my point that a criticism of either company isn't the same as criticising a particular member of the development team. Because obviously there's a significant overlap regardless. And people join and leave these teams all the time. Every company has a style and ethos that is more than the sum of people who work there.

I'm a big fan of naughty dog because I've enjoyed (and been impressed by) every game they've made since the first uncharted. I think they have a great development style and clearly push for significant technological advancements in every game they release. I also appreciate their recent push for more gender, sexuality, and racial diversity in their games. I can't contribute any of this to one person nor to a specific set of people. All I can say is I like what naughty dog make.

The only crystal dynamics games I've ever played are Tomb Raider games. And I probably wouldn't play them if they weren't Tomb Raider games. That's not an attack on any of the people who work there. Any of them could just as easily work at naughty dog. If that makes sense?

VictorXD 27-08-18 22:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melonie Tomb Raider (Post 7960037)
I'm 31 years old :p

Every time I am reminded of that fact I can't help but be jealous. You wouldn't happen to know Himiko or Jacob would you? :p

Zael 27-08-18 23:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by leomage (Post 7960053)
...I'm a big fan of naughty dog because I've enjoyed (and been impressed by) every game they've made since the first uncharted. I think they have a great development style and clearly push for significant technological advancements in every game they release. I also appreciate their recent push for more gender, sexuality, and racial diversity in their games. I can't attribute any of this to one person nor to a specific set of people. All I can say is I like what naughty dog make...

Those are good points, I appreciate that as well. And even when looking beyond ND's impressive recent push, we can perhaps note that even the protagonist of the original Uncharted was at one time considered 'non-standard' (as described here) within the context of gaming; but there were a number of 'influential' individuals at ND (Amy Hennig, Neil Druckmann, Josh Scherr, and Richard LeMarchand) who were committed to following through on what they believed was a compelling creative vision, despite the resistance. Similarly, in the context of Legacy of Kain:
Quote:

Originally Posted by WWETombRaider (Post 7960029)
I give them credit for lasting that long. Something tells me they wanted a break as well. Now that they have another subsidiary under their belt I'm guessing they can work on more than one game. Hopefully a new Legacy of Kain.

I have in the past (one / two) emphasized the 'influential' nature of the creative vision of certain individuals (in the case of Crystal's Soul Reaver games: primarily Amy Hennig again, along with Richard LeMarchand) who contributed to the writing, conceptualization, and characterization in those games; and when I say 'influential', I mean to convey my personal suspicion that new games in the series (made by Crystal, but without the contributions of those specific 'influential' individuals) would be likely to turn out rather different from previous games, unless great care were dedicated to the choice of new creative leads.
Quote:

Originally Posted by biscuits (Post 7960036)
Trust me, I have A LOT of issues with the way CD handles Tomb Raider. The way they handled their games' narrative aspects and their risk averse working methods being my main gripes.
I do agree that EM is overall better structured, based on impressions that I heard. But we need to consider that a lot of these people worked on the previous games as well. Just look at the credits sequence of each game.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DOPE (Post 7960041)
...Obviously there's no way for us to know for sure [with regard to Shadow], but I suspect this is more about creativity lead and direction rather than freedom...

I have mentioned elsewhere my own suspicions that the influence of certain folks who are new to the series (for example Lead Writer Jill Murray, and Narrative Director Jason Dozois) has been an important part of the improvement that I perceive in the storytelling and characterization, in what we've seen so far from Shadow; tentatively (since, of course, we haven't played the game yet), I would accordingly hope that they will be an influential part of the series in the future.

Yeauxleaux 28-08-18 01:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by leomage (Post 7960026)
I don't think it makes sense to imply we can't criticise CD [or EM or whomever] because there are nice and talented people there. You can be aware that everyone who works on a game is extremely talented and working as hard as they can, and still be disappointed with what they release.

Sometimes it's a problem with the organisation/structure of the team, sometimes it's bad luck, often it's just a matter of opinion, and sometimes that team would be better suited to a different creative project.

I think all of us here are aware that all CD and EM want to do is make a good game. Whether or not they succeeded should be for each of us to judge.

Yeah I agree. While I do understand the argument for not being outright disrespectful and nasty in the criticism, we are not behoved to congratulate the team for merely turning up and doing their jobs working on a game. They're not owed a fake-positive happy dance merely for "working hard", the product they release is open to review and scrutiny just like every other product any business makes. That's how business works.

Based on what I've seen though I want EM to take on the series full time. They came straight in and fixed many of the biggest issues we've had for years that CD wouldn't fix for whatever reason, and it looks like they're trying to do the best they can with this reboot character they've been given. That alone is reason enough to say I think EM are better for the series.

iWANEX 28-08-18 02:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melonie Tomb Raider (Post 7960035)
I'm curious too.

Tomb Raider is hugely successful right now, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a team preparing what's next already. One reason why it would make sense for EM to handle SOTTR, so they could put time into what's next and all the changes that will entail.

I watched an interview the other day and when they were asked about the next adventure, both Rich and Daniel started smiling and trying to avoid the question with Rich's typical "we are concentrating on Shadow right now..." but they also said they are open to new ideas and requests and if we want something we should go to the boards and talk about it so that's a good sign. One of the interviewers requested Lara in space, and the other one wanted TR Anniversary Anniversary (lol). I'm pretty sure they already have the next step planned (or outlined, at least).

NoahCrofRaider 28-08-18 02:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by iWANEX (Post 7960151)
I watched an interview the other day and when they were asked about the next adventure, both Rich and Daniel started smiling and trying to avoid the question with Rich's typical "we are concentrating on Shadow right now..." but they also said they are open to new ideas and requests and if we want something we should go to the boards and talk about it so that's a good sign. One of the interviewers requested Lara in space, and the other one wanted TR Anniversary Anniversary (lol). I'm pretty sure they already have the next step planned (or outlined, at least).

I think so too. They’re probably throwing around ideas while keeping an open mind to what fans want, I’m betting. I would love a TR2 or TR3 remake as a future game set in the reboot universe. But I’d want it to be more of its own thing perhaps. Maybe keep the globetrotting/locations, artifacts, and characters, but make a more “fulfilling” story?

Yeauxleaux 28-08-18 02:40

I like the idea of them going back to doing episodic stand-alone adventures like the first 3 games and Chronicles were, which is an idea I've seen floating around.

I think that would open up a good opportunity to compromise, and have a Lara who has elements of both Reboot and classic Lara, as they won't have to be so strict about sticking to a particular continuity.

laracroftswest 28-08-18 04:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yeauxleaux (Post 7960164)
I like the idea of them going back to doing episodic stand-alone adventures like the first 3 games and Chronicles were, which is an idea I've seen floating around.

I think that would open up a good opportunity to compromise, and have a Lara who has elements of both Reboot and classic Lara, as they won't have to be so strict about sticking to a particular continuity.

Love this concept :cln:

James_Rutland 28-08-18 07:19

This week and the next are the last ones for Promo, give us the new trailer pls :o

Lukass 28-08-18 07:20

I think the gamescom trailer was the one with the dogs. We are not getting anything else except launch trailer a few days before release.


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