General Tomb Raider Discussion - Page 3083

LNSNHGTDS · 21-04-22, 14:51

Actually, it is explicitly stated that Lara is better than Richard in both timelines.

Legend's bio outright says that "Lara's career has far eclipsed that of her father" and in TR13 Grim says in one of his journals that while Richard would try to study the Solarii, Lara on the other hand is more resourceful and knows how to take care of herself and will not fall for their traps.

But you don't need the games to spell it out for you, Lara's actions speak for themselves. Like I said, in LAU she follows in Richard's footsteps but actually success where he failed. Richard never did locate the Scion, only information on it, whereas Lara collected all three pieces and proceeded to destroy them along with Natla. In Ghana and Thailand, Richard needed an entire expedition of people and equipment to retrieve the Ghalali Key and one of Thor's gauntlets whereas Lara only had her own athleticism, wit and twin pistols to help her. Furthermore, he never managed to pinpoint the location of any of the pieces of Excalibur and while he did find out Niflheim was in the Mediterranean (which was actually on the map in Bhogavati along with the locations of Xibalba and Valhalla anyway) Lara was the one to actually find the exact site. Likewise, in the Survivor games, Richard did the research on Kitezh and Paititi, but was never actually able to pinpoint the locations of either of them and so was left with only his unconfirmed theories to obsess over. Furthermore, the only way he could actually go to expeditions around the world was by hiring Roth and Grim as bodyguards, and Lara outlived all three of them as well as the people who killed them.

Lara and Richard are in no way shape or form equals. Lara develops an interest in archaeology because of her father, yes, but she eventually takes what he did and takes it ten steps further, succeeding in every single way he failed. You can't tell me you expect Richard to swan dive off cliffs, gun down T-Rexs and survive from something like the Yaaxil lol. If he can be compared to anyone, a much better analogy would be Alister. Both are smart, not Lara Croft smart though, and are capable of doing extensive research on myths and artefacts, research that Lara can then take to the field and actually discover and prove what Richard or Alister can only speculate and theorise about.

.snake. · 21-04-22, 15:18

^ I don't think anyone is saying that Richard is an equal to Lara - of course Lara is ultimately better, goes further, and eclipses him.

This entire discussion simply started because the observation was made that almost everything LAU or Survivor Lara is discovering and raiding is because her father did the first preliminary research for it.

It would be the equivalent of the Classics starting every game with "I read in Von Croy's notebook about his search for the Atlantean Scion/Dagger of Xian/Meteorite Stones/Amulet of Horus; but he never found them. I wonder if I can find them." Thank God those games didn't do that.

_Seth · 21-04-22, 15:27

In Rise didn't one of Richard's voice files say Roth tried to teach him how to shoot and he was "absolutely hopeless"? I swear there were a couple of other lines that suggested from him that he's more of an indoor person.

HarleyCroft · 21-04-22, 15:34

Maybe I'm judging a book by it's cover, but something tells me ol' Dicky Croft was more of an indoor person

Quebsenuef · 21-04-22, 15:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by _Seth

In Rise didn't one of Richard's voice files say Roth tried to teach him how to shoot and he was "absolutely hopeless"? I swear there were a couple of other lines that suggested from him that he's more of an indoor person.

Does that mean TReboot Lara got her psychopathic murdering skills from her mom?

Blackmoor · 21-04-22, 16:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by .snake.

^ I don't think anyone is saying that Richard is an equal to Lara - of course Lara is ultimately better, goes further, and eclipses him.

This entire discussion simply started because the observation was made that almost everything LAU or Survivor Lara is discovering and raiding is because her father did the first preliminary research for it.

It would be the equivalent of the Classics starting every game with "I read in Von Croy's notebook about his search for the Atlantean Scion/Dagger of Xian/Meteorite Stones/Amulet of Horus; but he never found them. I wonder if I can find them." Thank God those games didn't do that.

This is how I see it too.

Yes, Richard's not meant to be her equal, but he is built in her image. She's meant to be a chip off his block.

TR2013 opening line is: "A famous explorer once said, that the extraordinary is in what we do, not who we are." The famous explorer being him, Richard Croft. Lara is reporting her father's words to her. Plus alluding to him being "extraordinary" also... not just Lara's aims to be so / foreshadowing her future.

The meaning behind that Roth / Lara moment where she doubts her ability to survive because she's not "that kind of Croft." Is meant to to be an indication of her legendary father's shadow being a large one to live up to in this exact scenerio.

We are meant to eventually see her legacy eclipse his, at least I think that is the path we're on, but he is definitely meant to be some great discoverer, adventurer, explorer.

HarleyCroft · 21-04-22, 16:13

^Ew, that line was quoting her father? It was one of the things about the game that has stuck with me but I never bothered to look up who actually said it.
I hope there is no shred of reboot at all in the next planned iteration of Lara.

Blackmoor · 21-04-22, 16:18

I think it's meant to be. I can't remember if we've ever had official confirmation on it.

_Seth · 21-04-22, 16:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quebsenuef

Does that mean TReboot Lara got her psychopathic murdering skills from her mom?

Maybe. She apparently already got her backpack from her according to that stupid mobile phone game so let's start involving everything else, too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarleyCroft

^Ew, that line was quoting her father? It was one of the things about the game that has stuck with me but I never bothered to look up who actually said it.
I hope there is no shred of reboot at all in the next planned iteration of Lara.

Eurgh, I already suspected reboot Lara had an Electra complex and this just confirms it. O_o

LNSNHGTDS · 21-04-22, 17:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by .snake.

^ I don't think anyone is saying that Richard is an equal to Lara - of course Lara is ultimately better, goes further, and eclipses him.

This entire discussion simply started because the observation was made that almost everything LAU or Survivor Lara is discovering and raiding is because her father did the first preliminary research for it.

It would be the equivalent of the Classics starting every game with "I read in Von Croy's notebook about his search for the Atlantean Scion/Dagger of Xian/Meteorite Stones/Amulet of Horus; but he never found them. I wonder if I can find them." Thank God those games didn't do that.

Well, for TR1 at least, she gets the information for two out of three pieces of the Scion from Natla, or more sodgufucally whoever in Natla's company did the research for her

But yeah I get what you mean. In the past I didn't really mind, but by now it has become a bit irritating. It's just not necessary at all to keep on bringing Richard into the equation.

21-04-22, 14:51	#30821
LNSNHGTDS Tomb Raider Join Date: May 2010 Location: Athens, Greece Posts: 10,903	Actually, it is explicitly stated that Lara is better than Richard in both timelines. Legend's bio outright says that "Lara's career has far eclipsed that of her father" and in TR13 Grim says in one of his journals that while Richard would try to study the Solarii, Lara on the other hand is more resourceful and knows how to take care of herself and will not fall for their traps. But you don't need the games to spell it out for you, Lara's actions speak for themselves. Like I said, in LAU she follows in Richard's footsteps but actually success where he failed. Richard never did locate the Scion, only information on it, whereas Lara collected all three pieces and proceeded to destroy them along with Natla. In Ghana and Thailand, Richard needed an entire expedition of people and equipment to retrieve the Ghalali Key and one of Thor's gauntlets whereas Lara only had her own athleticism, wit and twin pistols to help her. Furthermore, he never managed to pinpoint the location of any of the pieces of Excalibur and while he did find out Niflheim was in the Mediterranean (which was actually on the map in Bhogavati along with the locations of Xibalba and Valhalla anyway) Lara was the one to actually find the exact site. Likewise, in the Survivor games, Richard did the research on Kitezh and Paititi, but was never actually able to pinpoint the locations of either of them and so was left with only his unconfirmed theories to obsess over. Furthermore, the only way he could actually go to expeditions around the world was by hiring Roth and Grim as bodyguards, and Lara outlived all three of them as well as the people who killed them. Lara and Richard are in no way shape or form equals. Lara develops an interest in archaeology because of her father, yes, but she eventually takes what he did and takes it ten steps further, succeeding in every single way he failed. You can't tell me you expect Richard to swan dive off cliffs, gun down T-Rexs and survive from something like the Yaaxil lol. If he can be compared to anyone, a much better analogy would be Alister. Both are smart, not Lara Croft smart though, and are capable of doing extensive research on myths and artefacts, research that Lara can then take to the field and actually discover and prove what Richard or Alister can only speculate and theorise about. __________________ "I'm not who you think I am" - Lara Croft

21-04-22, 15:34	#30824
HarleyCroft Professor Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: Coulrophilia Posts: 3,682	Maybe I'm judging a book by it's cover, but something tells me ol' Dicky Croft was more of an indoor person __________________ Well if that ain't aren't the isn't

21-04-22, 16:13	#30827
HarleyCroft Professor Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: Coulrophilia Posts: 3,682	^Ew, that line was quoting her father? It was one of the things about the game that has stuck with me but I never bothered to look up who actually said it. I hope there is no shred of reboot at all in the next planned iteration of Lara. __________________ Well if that ain't aren't the isn't

21-04-22, 16:18	#30828
Blackmoor Tomb Raider Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: In the woods at night (female) Posts: 14,970	I think it's meant to be. I can't remember if we've ever had official confirmation on it. __________________ Not all those who wander are lost ✻

21-04-22, 15:18	#30822
.snake. Professor Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: New York Posts: 3,488	^ I don't think anyone is saying that Richard is an equal to Lara - of course Lara is ultimately better, goes further, and eclipses him. This entire discussion simply started because the observation was made that almost everything LAU or Survivor Lara is discovering and raiding is because her father did the first preliminary research for it. It would be the equivalent of the Classics starting every game with "I read in Von Croy's notebook about his search for the Atlantean Scion/Dagger of Xian/Meteorite Stones/Amulet of Horus; but he never found them. I wonder if I can find them." Thank God those games didn't do that.

21-04-22, 15:27	#30823
_Seth Professor Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: England Posts: 3,362	In Rise didn't one of Richard's voice files say Roth tried to teach him how to shoot and he was "absolutely hopeless"? I swear there were a couple of other lines that suggested from him that he's more of an indoor person.