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Old 08-09-18, 14:08   #21
fallenangle
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We still are getting our money's worth.

Even on my latest TR4 run I took time off 'no scratch' to explore places I'd never tried to get to before using, mostly, corner bugs. I've done that many times before but really only explored a very small percentage of those places throughout the game. So it still has plenty of left for me find.

That adds significant extra replayability into some areas as well as the possibility of alternate routes/shortcuts. I always enjoy getting on top of the buildings and other structures in this another TRs which you're not meant to be able reach, an incentive in itself.

It is a pity there are not more games like this with game engine bugs you can exploit to get to otherwise impossible to reach places. The only relatively recent game I have found anything like that was in the XB360 FPS: Metro Last Light. It was a very simple bug triggered accidentally but it allowed you to backtrack a whole section of an underground railway track on foot. There wasn't a lot to do but just being there was entertainment enough.
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Old 09-09-18, 23:12   #22
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Definitely the longest, but to be honest, it also feels like the longest. With the other games I always had a sense of accomplishment when finishing a level. Like that part was done and I could move on to the next. With all the backtracking, even through previous levels, TR4 sometimes feels endless. I think it also doesn't help that every level (except Cambodia) is set in Egypt.
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Old 10-09-18, 00:04   #23
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Oh yes this is definitely the longest game in the classic series. Maybe it just feels longer because Cairo is such a drag and the puzzles take ages to figure out without a walkthrough.
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Old 10-09-18, 00:51   #24
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Just finished the game in 16h30, that's without counting all the deaths and reloads, so in reality it's probably around 20 hours. I had to use a walkthrough for the detonator (I feel really dumb for using it for that) and during Khufu's Queens Pyramids where you had to push a bloody bolder that looks like every other ****ing rock in this game, I was so pissed about that one. This game is phenomenal though, the only section I think drags on is Giza, I feel like every section outside looks the same and feels like they got lazy, and the whole scrap paper with the hyroglyps puzzles felt unfinished. TR4 was always my favorite as a kid, playing it after all these years I still haven't changed my mind, I still think it's the best TR.
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Old 10-09-18, 06:25   #25
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They could have omitted the entire Cairo section and nothing would be lost in my opinion.
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Old 10-09-18, 09:34   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b.gluch View Post
Just finished the game in 16h30, that's without counting all the deaths and reloads, so in reality it's probably around 20 hours. I had to use a walkthrough for the detonator (I feel really dumb for using it for that) and during Khufu's Queens Pyramids where you had to push a bloody bolder that looks like every other ****ing rock in this game, I was so pissed about that one. This game is phenomenal though, the only section I think drags on is Giza, I feel like every section outside looks the same and feels like they got lazy, and the whole scrap paper with the hyroglyps puzzles felt unfinished. TR4 was always my favorite as a kid, playing it after all these years I still haven't changed my mind, I still think it's the best TR.
Well, I still prefer this than having Lara like in the recent games come close and says to me: "I can move this."

The beauty of the classics is that you have to try and try; and then maybe think for yourself, perhaps something lies behind/beneath this thing

it is like you are in that world and you have to figure out what to do; not some stupid AI and hints and glowing stuff telling you everything.

If TR4 was done recently with the mechanics of the newest TR's, it can be finished in less than a day without any problem
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Old 10-09-18, 12:46   #27
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^ Yes, the hand-holding and patronising like that which goes on in modern games, not just TR, is pathetic. We do have brains and I like my one to be exercised a bit whilst I'm playing. Puzzle solving, not just being handed the solution on a plate is, or should be, a core part of any true TR game.

Whilst I agree there is puzzle stuff in the old TRs which stretches your tolerance, like that one moveable rock b.gluch mentioned, it is not that bad in comparison with some real old school games.

The first LoZ and Wolfenstein 3D hid secret areas behind completely unmarked identical looking walls or their equivalent. Randomly clicking on everything to check whether it is interactive is not puzzle solving and something I've always disliked. TR is, usually, much better than that.

Last edited by fallenangle; 12-09-18 at 10:26.
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Old 12-09-18, 08:24   #28
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I see you're all pretty much veterans here.

I'm currently on my first playthrough on PS1 (never picked up 4 and 5 back when they came out), I'm in Chambers Of Tulun and while I didn't keep track, I'd guess it took me at least 15 hours so far. I love that it's actually challenging and I love exploring every corner of every level. Though 3 will always be in my heart as the one that made me fall in love with games, TLR is probably the best classic TR game in all respects.
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Old 12-09-18, 08:59   #29
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Originally Posted by fallenangle View Post
^ Yes, the hand-holding and patronising like that which goes on in modern games, not just TR, is is pathetic. We do have brains and I like my one to be exercised a bit whilst I'm playing. Puzzle solving, not just being handed the solution on a plate is, or should be, a core part of any true TR game.

Whilst I agree there is puzzle stuff in the old TRs which stretches your tolerance, like that one moveable rock b.gluch mentioned, it is not that bad in comparison with some real old school games.

The first LoZ and Wolfenstein 3D hid secret areas behind completely unmarked identical looking walls or their equivalent. Randomly clicking on everything to check whether it is interactive is not puzzle solving and something I've always disliked. TR is, usually, much better than that.

Man after my own heart!

Yeah I think TR needs a little-"Hand-holding" but not as much as Reboot, for instance, the spiked room in Crash site, all sides of the giant pillar in the middle of the room have "Cracked" Textures but only one side can Lara actually grab, Underworld sorta did this right, in that some handholds were modelled onto the wall, I think it would be something they should keep, so you don't have to guess "Can I climb on this or not?".
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Old 13-09-18, 16:24   #30
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Yes it is
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