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Old 17-10-23, 20:59   #1
Horaan
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Default Stupid SAS

Hi !
I am currently testing myself on enemies and AI, and more specifically the SAS.

First of all, other than OCBs, are there any differences between BADDYs and SAS about AI?

Depending on the different skins I found and their animations, my needs correspond more to the SAS than to the baddies, so I have been training with them for several days :

→ Lara activates a Trigger and this activates :
1) A FLYBY camera, which itself activates three Trigger-triggerers (besides I cannot freeze it for anything other than 3 seconds despite the camera settings).
2) A door (with an actionNG to make it perform a particular animation).
3) 3 SAS who run through the door and must station themselves in certain places. To make them move I've used IA_AMBUSH (on their square + the destination location square) with a different OCB for each SAS.

Only here, all my triggers work without problem, my SAS enter the room, go TOWARDS their destination but :
-They do not go exactly to their defined nullmeshes (within 1 to 2 squares nearby)
-And once in position, they spot me (rotate based on my position) but never shoot at me, unless I start shooting at them myself.

I tried with different SAS (TR5 blue VCI, TR3 Area51, TR4 city guard) the "most successful" are with the SAS TR4 (the others do anything).

The SAS&BADDYs professionals among you will certainly have THE solution

Thanks for help

(I work with TRNG + Tomb editor)

Last edited by Horaan; 17-10-23 at 21:03.
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Old 17-10-23, 21:19   #2
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Quote:
First of all, other than OCBs, are there any differences between BADDYs and SAS about AI?
There are way too many differences
Baddies have 2 types of weapons (uzi and sword), they can walk, run, jump, climb on various ledges heights and even monkeyswing, whereas SAS can only walk, run and shoot (project tiles or grenades)
Quote:
1) A FLYBY camera, which itself activates three Trigger-triggerers (besides I cannot freeze it for anything other than 3 seconds despite the camera settings).
Weird... can you show your camera settings?
Quote:
-They do not go exactly to their defined nullmeshes (within 1 to 2 squares nearby)
Make sure that each AI nullmesh path has the same OCB at the beginning and at the end, more details here: https://trforge.net/advent/2010/day1...n.php#chapter1
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Old 17-10-23, 21:46   #3
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Quote:
There are way too many differences
Baddies have 2 types of weapons (uzi and sword), they can walk, run, jump, climb on various ledges heights and even monkeyswing, whereas SAS can only walk, run and shoot (project tiles or grenades)
Thank you that's what I thought I understood, but are they different with AI ? Do they act the same if we use them with ai ambush, guard, modify, patrol (i also think x1/x2 are only for SAS) ?

Quote:
Weird... can you show your camera settings?
Here it is !

I've tried timer "5" stupidly for "5 sec" and also "150" for "30x5sec" as the manual said, also tried random numbers, and i tried to "timer" the trigger but no difference, the camera freeze 3 seconds.

Quote:
Make sure that each AI nullmesh path has the same OCB at the beginning and at the end
Yes, i set OCB 1 for both "start" and "stop" AI for the first SAS, 2 for the second and 3 for the third.


Furthermore, what behavior are the SAS supposed to have when they arrive to their AMBUSH ? Will they automatically guard ? Prowl ? etc. or we should give them a function when they arrive?

As I think about it, at first the SAS were in room1 and their destination was in room2 but the SAS was not able to cross the portal (normal portal, nor toogle 2, nor by remove the collisions from surrounding objects), they were running like against an "invisible wall" at the location of the door. To solve this I merged my room1&2 but it's quite annoying now in the editor.

Last edited by tlr online; 18-10-23 at 00:06. Reason: Image removed. See FAQ on posting images.
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Old 17-10-23, 22:00   #4
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I've barely tested the behavior so I don't really know what's the deal with portals or how they're supposed to behave precisely, but you can also try with ai_follow instead of ambush

A-ha I see what you're missing on the camera, it's that "freeze camera (timer field)" option unticked the problem
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Old 17-10-23, 22:24   #5
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Nice idea i've never tried follow before ! I've just replace AMUSH by FOLLOW (by keeping OCB 1 / 2 / 3) but it don't work for now, i'll try more tomorrow but i'm scared that Lara must be nearby to activate the "follow" behaviour

Ah, you say true, i've unchecked it during all my different tests ^^ i just re-check the timer box and try with 150 but it doesn't change, 3 seconds only

I'm asking if my "ActionNG" for door is not causing problems by overlapping triggers
I'll try different configurations tomorrow and post my results
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Old 18-10-23, 10:35   #6
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Some tutorials say that for camera freeze the formula is 300 x number of seconds, so worth a try

About ActionNG trigger it shouldn't, but in case you try removing it and stuff magically works you could trigger that using an Organizer= command, that way you can time precisely what you need (even with frames precision)
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Old 18-10-23, 20:46   #7
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Quote:
Some tutorials say that for camera freeze the formula is 300 x number of seconds, so worth a try
YOU GOT IT ! (but 1500 is 6sec and 1200 is 5sec (?), but it works so nevermind !)
Thanks a lot !

So, for the new tries :
→ AI_FOLLOW : The SAS only walk if i'm ~1block next to them. I also tried to trigger the nullmesh but i noclip I thought I was going to vomit
→ ActionNG or not ActionNG does not change anything
→ And, for something new : If i die and the level reload itself, the FLYBY is no more triggered (so neither the heavy trigger_triggerer), but door and SAS are correctly re activated.. It only works again if I restart the whole game. I swear it correctly worked yesterday and before. Even if I re-put 150 in the FLYBY timer.

Moreover, i read the TRForge page you've send me and I read this :

This chapter is named "Peacefull caracters" and there's "If he gets assigned a special behavior he initially stays peaceful and will not attack her at once he sees her. He will only attack if Lara shows aggression".
It is exactly the behavior they have when they came to their AI_AMUSH destination ! But if I do not ambush them they are hostile (and if i I AI_FOLLOW them too) ! Maybe i do not correctly 'ambush' them ?!

Last edited by tlr online; 18-10-23 at 20:51. Reason: Image removed. See FAQ on posting images.
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Old 19-10-23, 08:53   #8
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The fast level reloading is made by the Tomb Editor hack so if you play the level after compiling don't rely much on weird behaviors, like the flyby-death situation

I really don't know about the AI problem though...
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