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Old 21-01-20, 21:06   #19011
Catapharact
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Originally Posted by lance6439 View Post
What he said was stupid. I don't get why a woman with curves and nice breasts is suddenly "sexist" or "objectifying"


you can sexualize anyone and anything. Just a few months ago my department boss made a joke sexualizing Anne Frank and he got fired on the spot (what a ****ing moron)

if we're going to go out of our way to stop the "sexulization of women" in gaming then the same has to go for men. Because a lot of men in real life don't even have 6packs and are hardly fit like almost every single man in video games.
The subject matter of oversexualization of game characters (female or male) is a more complicated issue and certainly doesn't ends with the absolute conclusion that women with curves are there to pander to the "male gaze" so to speak.

There was an overbearing issue during the late 80s to mid 90s where a lot of female characters in Video Games existed as sexpots and a lot of marketing was geared towards sexualization simply because... well... Sex sells and the main target audience of most game developers were male.

https://mediaschool.indiana.edu/news...ale-characters

Lara Croft was an interesting character at the time given that not only was he one of few lead female characters of a video game at the time, she OWNED her sexuality (ignoring the whole Kurtis idiocy.) While there were blatant attempt made to sell her as a sexpot, her individuality as a character shone through. This along with the lack of strong female lead characters at the time made her equally popular with both male and female gamers.

Personally though... I have never taken an interest in Lara Croft as a character only because... well... (and I know I am going to trigger a lot of classic fans,) I never found her character to be particularly interesting. When I played the TR games, all that interested me about the game were the mechanics, the level design and the puzzles. Lara Croft was just an avatar. This might also be the reason why I pretty much started losing interest in TR Games after The Last Revelation given that there were better platforming based games with better and more developed characters hitting the market.

And before anyone says anything, this sentiment applies equally to bland male characters. A very select number of people played the Duke Nukem games because they found the Duke to be an engaging and interesting character . The same applies to Devil May Cry. I can't stand Dante and outgrew that idiot by Devil May Cry 4. His brother Vergil on the hand is a more interesting character (still waiting for a Vergil forcused game Capcom!)

However, I recognize the fact that this all factors into my own personal preference and given that the gaming industry has made leaps and bounds improvements by introducing more developed and interesting female characters in games WITHOUT AN OVERBEARING focus on sexuality alone, I am satisfied with the diversity of the market. Even support female characters in Video Games are getting more and more interesting and we are seeing more and more beautiful female characters in Video Games owning their sexuality. Yennifer from the Witcher is obviously a beautiful woman but her sharp intellect and wit shone through enough to make her an engaging and interesting character; Enough IMO to warrant a Witcher Yennifer Spinoff game (hint hint CD Projekt.)

So progress has been made IMO. But it certainly didn't come quietly.
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Old 21-01-20, 21:18   #19012
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So to summarise it's just a ****ty drama about basically nothing that came out of proportions and who's gonna be profitable to all thoses clickbait Youtubers like the Quatering. It all started because this develloper have said something who isn't conform to what think Melonie and there's absolutely nothing wrong with having an opinion. ****ty drama for influencers nothing new under the Sun.
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Old 21-01-20, 21:20   #19013
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Originally Posted by Samz View Post
Haven't played SOTTR but ROTTR's Tombs were mostly optional, short one-two room affairs
you should youtube one of the late game sottr challenge tombs... that and some of the main area puzzles are pretty inventive and difficult. one of SotTR's main complaints is it has too many puzzles lol

tangent but the series in and of itself isnt about grave robbing though, otherwise tomb raider 1 isnt a tomb raider game. she's more like a ruin explorer but that sounds stupid. i know each time i say this people say "tOmBs ArEn'T nEcIsSaRiLy GrAvEs!!!" but... tombs are literally large vaults for burying a dead person of high standing lmao
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Old 21-01-20, 21:25   #19014
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Originally Posted by Legends View Post
The name could have been anything, and it would have been much more fitting than "Tomb Raider" or any of the reboot names. Since the whole tagline for the first game was "A survivor is born", they could have just called the game "Survivor" or something like that. I mean, anything other than Tomb Raider. Then of course give reboot Lara a new name as well.

Remember when Tomb Raider had the "featuring/starring Lara Croft" in the titles? They hyped Lara up to me more than just a video game character, and it worked. Even though she wasn't a super famous gaming icon yet, they sort of treated her like one.
Survivor would've been a better choice yeah.
And yes, I loved the headline Starring Lara Croft, TRII memories. I remember getting hyped just from that. I never had that feeling for reboot unfortunately. Not the anticipation once before.

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Originally Posted by lance6439 View Post
What he said was stupid. I don't get why a woman with curves and nice breasts is suddenly "sexist" or "objectifying"


you can sexualize anyone and anything. Just a few months ago my department boss made a joke sexualizing Anne Frank and he got fired on the spot (what a ****ing moron)

if we're going to go out of our way to stop the "sexulization of women" in gaming then the same has to go for men. Because a lot of men in real life don't even have 6packs and are hardly fit like almost every single man in video games.
i agree.
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Old 21-01-20, 22:05   #19015
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Ok so let me get this straight, a male feminist is calling a woman not feminist enough? I don't get it, honestly this whole thing is just stupid. Why do people keep going after Mel? She's been pretty nice and cool to me. Yeah we disagree on some points about feminism, but she's a really good person like she's always been.

Some people on the internet just need to get a life and stop coming and attacking other people.
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Old 21-01-20, 22:13   #19016
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Ok so let me get this straight, a male feminist is calling a woman not feminist enough? I don't get it, honestly this whole thing is just stupid. Why do people keep going after Mel? She's been pretty nice and cool to me. Yeah we disagree on some points about feminism, but she's a really good person like she's always been.

Some people on the internet just need to get a life and stop coming and attacking other people.
Eh it's the internet, everyone's an ass sometimes and somewhere on the internet.

On the plus side you occasionally find cute cat pictures on it.
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Old 22-01-20, 00:01   #19017
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Eh it's the internet, everyone's an ass sometimes and somewhere on the internet.

On the plus side you occasionally find cute cat pictures on it.
Indeed, I mean I don't understand how someone can get that personal over a video game. Yes I have gotten into fights, drama, screaming matches from time to time, but the length some people will go to tear someone down over an opinion is just not healthy.

I honestly don't know what is going on right now, the world is messed up then I remember it being. Maybe at that time I was a kid and couldn't see the world for what it really was, but I seriously don't remember opinions triggering people so much to where they feel the need to cut friends out of their lives or even family.

It's 1000x more toxic when you involve politics. Politics have become so nasty and revolting that no one can put in a good word.

I really hope Mel just ignores that guy and continues on as she is, but something has to change. The mount of anger, hatred, and animosity people bear towards one another is not normal. And this cancel culture just makes it 10times worse. I will never buy the excuse that someone deserves to have their entire lively hood ripped from them for one bad tweet. It's obnoxious and bizarre.

When it comes to Tomb Raider I am not a fan of the reboot, and yes from time to time I get into drama with people over it, but I don't feel so bent out of shape where I have to hunt someone down and try to ruin them completely. When it comes to feminism I thought it was supposed to be about building each other up, not tearing each other down.

It's quite rich how that guy calls himself a feminist when he is doing the opposite of what the movement is all about. He is the reason feminism has such a bad rep in the first place and his toxic attitude and behavior isn't helping it at all.

Anyway those are my thoughts on all this.

This has been the charmed hour, signing out.
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Old 22-01-20, 01:27   #19018
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Originally Posted by lance6439 View Post
if we're going to go out of our way to stop the "sexulization of women" in gaming
We're not going to do that. It's just fictional characters, they're exaggerated caricatures for a reason. The problem these days is the PC culture that takes offense to everything. Eventually, the people who get offended by women (or men for that matter) looking sexual will get more problems because the majority of people aren't gonna change to please them. They might as well try to deny human nature and see how much success they'll have with that.

Wouldn't it be funny though if all females in video games wore a niqab because showing even the slightest shape of a woman's body is considered deeming, degrading, misogynistic and dAnGeRoUs...


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Originally Posted by Catapharact View Post
Personally though... I have never taken an interest in Lara Croft as a character only because... well... (and I know I am going to trigger a lot of classic fans,) I never found her character to be particularly interesting. When I played the TR games, all that interested me about the game were the mechanics, the level design and the puzzles. Lara Croft was just an avatar. This might also be the reason why I pretty much started losing interest in TR Games after The Last Revelation given that there were better platforming based games with better and more developed characters hitting the market.
You're not going to trigger a lot of classic fans with that. Quite frankly, it's as it should be, but these days the developers want to build a game around Lara instead of building a game where she is just the controllable character. It's completely backwards, and that's why they fail. At the end of the PS1 era, other developers made more interesting 3D games, and Tomb Raider never recovered. From then on, TR turned into a family drama about Lara and completely forgot about legitimate gameplay like it once had. (-Angel of Darkness)

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Originally Posted by New Dwight View Post
And yes, I loved the headline Starring Lara Croft, TRII memories. I remember getting hyped just from that.
They did what they could to spice up the gameplay with a cool character that stood out from the rest. They used the Lara Croft's name to get her recognized.

Last edited by Legends; 22-01-20 at 01:37.
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Old 22-01-20, 10:32   #19019
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Originally Posted by Legends View Post
We're not going to do that. It's just fictional characters, they're exaggerated caricatures for a reason. The problem these days is the PC culture that takes offense to everything.
I believe this offense taking has long stopped to be genuine. I think in many cases people's outrage is faked, or they have been cought up in their own radicalism that they don't know anymore what is reasonable or not. As long as the media and the entertainment industry and the people at large continue to cater to these people and reward their behaviour by caving in to them they're gonna continue to radicalise, look for new things to be offended by, because they know that is how they're gonna get their way and how they're gonna force their will onto others.

That is why anytime somebody claims something is racist or sexist these days I'm gonna asume it's not, unless proven otherwise.
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Old 22-01-20, 16:15   #19020
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I believe this offense taking has long stopped to be genuine. I think in many cases people's outrage is faked, or they have been cought up in their own radicalism that they don't know anymore what is reasonable or not. As long as the media and the entertainment industry and the people at large continue to cater to these people and reward their behaviour by caving in to them they're gonna continue to radicalise, look for new things to be offended by, because they know that is how they're gonna get their way and how they're gonna force their will onto others.

That is why anytime somebody claims something is racist or sexist these days I'm gonna asume it's not, unless proven otherwise.
You're probably right. Some people just look for something to be offended by. It's clearly not reasonable to be offended by fictional exaggerated caricatures in video games. It's just a made up character that isn't real. Let them be fictional without yelling sexism, or some other radical bs.

Just look at all the controversy surrounding Lara Croft. They might as well yell "sex kills" with that delusional attitude. If anything, they are the problem when they look at Lara Croft as a character that is degrading to women. Most of the time when people claim something is sexist, it isn't. Or homophobic, like some delusional people demonstrated here a few days ago. People disagreeing that they don't want Lara to be a lesbian is now considered homophobic according to them, which, of course, is just ludicrous. People just need to educate themselves on what certain things mean.
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