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Old 12-06-22, 12:30   #11
fallenangle
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It was the raptors that had me most paranoid in the Lost Valley as I'd messed up dealing with the first two.

When you get that slight glimpse of something red in the distance and your health is low and you have no idea where the next save crystal is going to be it makes you very wary and desperate to save your progress. So you take less time exploring than you should and so miss things.

At least that is my excuse.
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Old 18-06-22, 08:13   #12
Danielazo
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Clues to get on with the game, sure, but I don't mind if the game doesn't give me clues on how to find a secret.

I really like the fact that there are all these different types of secrets:
1) the easy-to-find ones to make the player feel good (Caves 1st),
2) ones that require skills and/or precision (Great Pyramid, Colosseum),
3) ones that are easy to see but can't be backtracked for (Tomb of Tihocan 2nd secret),
4) ones where there's a lot of tension, but you keep your cool and explore anyway (Tomb of Qualopec 3rd secret),
5) the secret within secret (Tomb of Qualopec again),
6) the "how the was I supposed to figure that out!" obscure secrets too (Tomb of Tihocan 1st secret, Tomb of Qualopec 1st & 2nd).

TR2 goes even further and adds "pick me up if you dare" secrets that are blatantly obvious, but have a trap nearby (The Great Wall green secret, 40 Fathoms white secret), or are behind a gate, and the player's task is to figure out how to get there (Wreck of the Maria Doria).

TR3 again extends the formula, with "grab it before it's gone forever" secrets (Area 52, Lost City of Tinnos), etc.

The whole point of the series is to explore. It is a lot slower paced than pure action games, and the player is really rewarded for exploring. That's exactly what players did back in the days: ran over every floor tile, clicked on everything that looked different (or not), tried to shoot TNT boxes, tried to swim under that waterfall in Lost Valley before turning it off, etc.

I think over the years we've somewhat forgotten what the game was all about. I noticed that myself when I started playing custom levels. Quite frankly, I sucked, because I wasn't exploring as much as I should have, making me miss levers in obscure places, secrets behind movable boxes that don't look movable at first, etc.

It's very refreshing to go back to basics of exploration like this. Heck, last few custom levels I played, I even started drawing my own map on a sheet to remember the layout and not forget anything important.
Interesting, considering the comprehensive answer, what do you think is the hardest secret in all of the classic Tomb Raider (1-5)?
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Old 18-06-22, 15:36   #13
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I think there are two other ones which are quite cryptic.

In the Colosseum where you have the timed door as you have to run over a specific spot on the floor to open it - without a guide you pretty much have to do that by blind luck.

Also in St. Francis Folly the one down the long slope before you land in the water with the first crocodile - though it is easy to see it isn't easy to get to as you have to slide down and jump at a specific time to land it. Though I suppose this is more of a skill one it does seem easier than it looks.

Last edited by Mik9517; 18-06-22 at 15:38.
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Old 22-06-22, 01:04   #14
Sardoc
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Interesting, considering the comprehensive answer, what do you think is the hardest secret in all of the classic Tomb Raider (1-5)?
Oh, gosh, good question... I've got a few.

TR1:
Tomb of Qualopec secrets 1 (obscure) & 2 (fear factor).
Tomb of Tihocan 1st secret (obscure).
St Francis' Folly secret 3 (annoying jump + secret within secret) and 4 (unintuitive path under time pressure).
Colosseum secret 3 (obscure + jumps).
Palace Midas secret 3 (obscure lever).
The Cistern secret 3 (blends in + bugged on Saturn).
Sanctuary of the Scion (very obscure).
Natla's Mines secret 3 (unintuitive).
Atlantis secret 3 (unintuitive).

TR1UB:
Temple of the Cat 1st secret (obscure). 2nd secret isn't hard, but can be lost forever. Secret 4 requires work and also can be lost forever.

TR2:
Ice Palace secret 1 (very obscure + unintuitive path).
Temple of Xian secret 1 (unintuitive).

TR2GM:
Kingdom secret 3 (hard to find + lots of jumps after)
Nightmare in Vegas secret 3 (boss + spikes)

TR3:
Jungle secret 1 (nobody expects one there).
Temple Ruins secret 4 (prep in previous secret room).
Temple of Puna secret (unintuitive).
Aldwych secret 1 (timing), 3 (item from an obscure spot), 4 (mildly unintuitive though not super hard) and 5 (timing + lots of backtracking).
Lud's Gate secret 1 (easy to miss it the first time), 3 (weird jump + can be lost forever) and 6 (stealth prep + timing).
Antarctica secret 3 (obscure item + backtracking).
RX-Tech Mines secret 2 (not trivial to find + secret within secret).
Lost City of Tinnos secret 1 (unintuitive), 2 (easily lost forever) and 3 (lots of backtracking under time pressure).

TR3 TLA:
Highland Fling secret 3 (unintuitive jump)
Willard's Lair secret 2 (requires prep) and 3 (prep + hard to find object)
Shakespeare Cliff 1st secret, very unintuitive.

That's it for now, will add TR4 and 5 soon.
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Old 24-06-22, 16:06   #15
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I remember exactly how I struggle to find all secrets in TR1, as there was no walkthrough back then. This are the ones that had me running around like a headless chicken for hours:

- Tomb of Qualopec's double secret
- Colosseum's magnum secret
- Midas Palace's hidden lever secret (oh god this one)
- Tomb of Tihocan's both secrets
- Sanctuary of the Scion (of course)
- Natla's Mines's first secret

A special mention to the last level, which drove me crazy because for a long time I thought I missed one secret but turns out the secret counter was bugged.
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Old 01-07-22, 12:19   #16
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As promised, here's the part of the answer about TR4 and TR5.

TR4:
Nothing at all until Burial Chambers. One of the secrets there can be lost forever if not picked up before a cutscene.
Valley of the Kings secret 3 and KV5 secret 4, not very difficult, just battling with Lara's animation set not having a crawl-from-wall-climb anim. Addressed in TR5.
Temple of Karnak secrets 2 & 3 + Sacred Lake secret might be unintuitive the first time around, because the game doesn't really teach you that Lara can now open underwater doors by herself, without having to look for some lever or switch. Might miss them the first time around, but definitely won't miss them in any subsequent playthrough.
Tomb of Semerkhet might be hard if you don't understand the principle of the game.
Guardian of Semerkhet and Desert Railroad secrets are certainly interesting!
Catacombs secrets 2, 3 & 4 are quite hard because you need to do something very unintuitive to unlock them.
The Lost Library secret 2 also requires you to do something you've not experienced in previous games.
Hall of Demetrius secret is very easy actually, there's a huge clue the devs leave for the player.
Cleopatra's Palace secret is not hard, but can be easily lost forever if you're not careful with an item.
Cairo ones aren't difficult at all, because you don't have to go out of your way to get them. The story elements of this section are much more difficult if you ask me.
Sphinx Complex secret... not hard in principle, but can be missed. Same with Menkaure's Pyramid prep for a secret in Khufu's Queen's Pyramids.
If I'm being honest, it feels like most secrets in Giza were added for the sake of getting to a nice, round number (70), as some of them are easier to find than TR1 Caves secrets.

TR4 Times (added in an edit):
Secret 2 is a bit unusual.

TR5:
Streets of Rome secret 3 and Trajan's Market secrets 1 & 3 are very easy to miss because of things suddenly opening up without any special effects after a particular story event.
Deepsea Dive one isn't hard in principle, there's just tension.
Labyrinth secret 1 may be easy to miss.
Labyrinth secret 3 was probably added to reach 3 secrets. Very easy.
13th Floor secret 3 requires cold blood.
Escape with the Iris secrets 2 & 3 is fun!
Red Alert secret 2 is very interesting. A bit of a PITA with what you need to do, plus of course you can get locked up forever if you don't have a save.

Gosh, it's been a sweet while since I touched TR4, and even longer for TR5. Gotta replay these some time.

Last edited by Sardoc; 01-07-22 at 12:21.
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Old 13-08-22, 22:32   #17
Danielazo
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Originally Posted by Mik9517 View Post
I think there are two other ones which are quite cryptic.

In the Colosseum where you have the timed door as you have to run over a specific spot on the floor to open it - without a guide you pretty much have to do that by blind luck.

Also in St. Francis Folly the one down the long slope before you land in the water with the first crocodile - though it is easy to see it isn't easy to get to as you have to slide down and jump at a specific time to land it. Though I suppose this is more of a skill one it does seem easier than it looks.
I really don't know what went through my mind when I skipped the third secret of the Colosseum in my OP list, if it was precisely the last one I found of this game in my childhood
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Old 15-08-22, 16:26   #18
SlyRaider
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(v) The third from Atlantis. I never understood how that door works, whenever I get there I open it out of sheer luck
Actually, I finally found out how this door works by rewriting my French TR1 solution.

I used FexInspect to find where the door trigger is and how long that door stays open.

Here is a cutaway view of the game area (sorry, the text is in French). On the right, you can see the tile that triggers the opening of the door for exactly 26 seconds. If you take a closer look, you will notice that this "trigger" tile has no motif unlike the rest of the floor. This is the trigger clue.

EDIT: Link updated with an Imgur link.

Last edited by SlyRaider; 15-08-22 at 16:44. Reason: Image removed (again). See FAQ on posting images.
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Old 15-08-22, 16:47   #19
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Welcome back SlyRaider and thank you for updating your post.
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